Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[iggy_oi]

When Rebecca Schulz is considered one of the more sensible candidates in your party that’s not a good sign.

[Wastedyouth]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

When Rebecca Schulz is considered one of the more sensible candidates in your party that’s not a good sign.

That is a very fair statement. She is still too conservative for me, personally.

I have yet to determine who I would vote for. But Smith, Loewen, Toews and Jean are way down my list. And probably on the list of most moderates/progressives.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

You have no idea if Sawhaney or Aheer did the same or didnt bother to book it. They might not have bothered because they know their campaigns are a lost cause and are going through the motions at this point.

Of course they made the right decision. Only after the event was publicized and decided it wasn't worth the negative attention or reputational hit to their own fragile campaigns.

Not unlike the track record of the UCP cabinet, both of which Toews and Schulz were cabinet members. Try and push ideas and decisions on Albertans, public pushback, dial it back because it was bad policy.

No pushback = bad decisions being put in place.

Aheer and Sawhaney never confirmed, Schulz' and Toews did. That's a problem in and of itself, because lumping themselves in with this libertarian/seperatist are things that Albertans notice - which is exactly what happened when the event was publicly exposed.

They're not wrong for wanting to debate, but if there was no public exposure of the extremist elements of these organizers, Toews and Schulz would have attended.

You can make fun of the polling numbers for Sawhaney and Aheer, but its pretty clear who put more thought into this process.

If you're a politician campaigning for office, or the campaigns that manage them, then you better understand the consequences of entertaining crowds like that, because Albertans pay attention.

Conservatives love to make corrections only after getting caught. Especially in Alberta.

[T-Dog]

I haven't been following the leadership race that closely, but it is disconcerting to see the number of "freedumb, convoy, conspiracy" type candidates. Who are the more reasonable candidates in this race?

On a separate point, Alberta really needs a more centrist option in its politics. I don't know why we have to choose between the socialists and the extreme nutjobs. If one of the wacko candidates wins the UCP leadership, I might actually find myself voting NDP, which would have been unfathomable to me a few years ago.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

Right. So they (Travis and Rebecca) make the right decision and backed out with more information available.

You are acting like making a mistake, learning and adjusting and making a better decision is a bad thing? This is what our leaders SHOULD be doing, rather than doubling down on stupidity. Accountability is something we should be looking for, not perfection.

You have no idea if Sawhaney or Aheer did the same or didnt bother to book it. They might not have bothered because they know their campaigns are a lost cause and are going through the motions at this point.

Did they back out because they didn’t know who the organizers were or did they back out because the event started to get media attention? I honestly have no idea but if it’s the latter then I wouldn’t consider that to be learning from a mistake just because it was the right decision. I can’t imagine any politician would agree to speak at an event during an election campaign without knowing who or what the event is supporting. IMO doing the right thing would have been showing up to the event and calling out the morons organizing it, but I admittedly tend to be a pot stirrer.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

That is a very fair statement. She is still too conservative for me, personally.

I have yet to determine who I would vote for. But Smith, Loewen, Toews and Jean are way down my list. And probably on the list of most moderates/progressives.

This is the cray thing. As an urban moderate, there is always someone i could see myself voting for in the UCP/PC races.

The top 4 are all out to lunch and would absolutely do irrevocable damage to the Province.

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

It's obviously not PC to say this (pun intended) but rural Alberta is holding the progress of this province back IMMENSELY.

Same thing happened to the Uk during Brexit. We cannot sit here and act like these people can't make disastrous decisions

[Izzle]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

You just basically proved what I said. Her campaign didn't do their diligence, the organizers and their objectives started getting publicized, they pulled out. The organizers, like any one else, probably found out online what the Alberta Prosperity Project actually was.

And what kind of campaign blindly signs up their candidate when others sign up? Surely they know there are extremist candidates and the Pied Piper approach is a fools errand?

Of course Schulz is going to defend her side. She's the one on the hot seat here.

At least Sawhaney and Aheer didn't even bother. They were smart enough to do so before the event was publicized.

Both Sawhney and Aheer are women of color. Hmmm... It's saying something. Either they weren't invited or that their campaign did their research and correctly decided to not attend.

Both paint an unwelcoming picture that Alberta should reject.

[kermitology]

If you want the UCP to be a level headed conservative party - vote for Aheer. Toews is incompetent, and the rest are varying degrees of unhinged. Pray for Alberta and hope that the damage these people do is limited. God help you if the UCP are re-elected with one of these crazies at the helm.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by T-Dog

I haven't been following the leadership race that closely, but it is disconcerting to see the number of "freedumb, convoy, conspiracy" type candidates. Who are the more reasonable candidates in this race?

On a separate point, Alberta really needs a more centrist option in its politics. I don't know why we have to choose between the socialists and the extreme nutjobs. If one of the wacko candidates wins the UCP leadership, I might actually find myself voting NDP, which would have been unfathomable to me a few years ago.

Just out of curiosity, what is the difference between what you would consider to be a “centrist” option and the current “socialists”.

According to the wacky left/right rules of the political spectrum that make no sense wouldn’t a “centrist” have to be a socialist by default?

[T-Dog]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Just out of curiosity, what is the difference between what you would consider to be a “centrist” option and the current “socialists”.

According to the wacky left/right rules of the political spectrum that make no sense wouldn’t a “centrist” have to be a socialist by default?

I would consider something like the Jean Chrétien or Paul Martin Liberals to be centrist parties that governed from the middle. Business minded, socially mainstream and policies that generally aren't on the fringes. I would consider socialist ideology to be on the left of the political spectrum.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

That is a very fair statement. She is still too conservative for me, personally.

I have yet to determine who I would vote for. But Smith, Loewen, Toews and Jean are way down my list. And probably on the list of most moderates/progressives.

It's a conservative party. She's my pick but might be #2 simply because I"ll vote for Toews over Smith.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by T-Dog

I would consider something like the Jean Chrétien or Paul Martin Liberals to be centrist parties that governed from the middle. Business minded, socially mainstream and policies that generally aren't on the fringes. I would consider socialist ideology to be on the left of the political spectrum.

Harper was pretty centrist for the first half decade and moved further right over time.

[Wastedyouth]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

It's a conservative party. She's my pick but might be #2 simply because I"ll vote for Toews over Smith.

That might be the right strategy.

Schulz isnt going to first ballot anyone. She probably can't second ballot.

Toews is literally the only one who will win on second ballot voting.

And I hate it because he sucks. But not as much as Smith, haha.

Sadly, he's really the only choice to beat Smith. And if we don't vote in that manner, we are looking at a Smith win. Which means we get another swing back to 4 years of NDP, which will only stall Alberta's progress for another 4 years (I don't say that, because I dislike the NDP, only that such a dramatic ideological change will stall every project, initiative and legislation for 2-6 years).

It's gonna be a wonky couple years here. Especially for municipalities.

Will be interesting at least!

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

That might be the right strategy.

Schulz isnt going to first ballot anyone. She probably can't second ballot.

Toews is literally the only one who will win on second ballot voting.

And I hate it because he sucks. But not as much as Smith, haha.

Sadly, he's really the only choice to beat Smith. And if we don't vote in that manner, we are looking at a Smith win. Which means we get another swing back to 4 years of NDP, which will only stall Alberta's progress for another 4 years (I don't say that, because I dislike the NDP, only that such a dramatic ideological change will stall every project, initiative and legislation for 2-6 years).

It's gonna be a wonky couple years here. Especially for municipalities.

Will be interesting at least!

I totally agree, Danielle Smith is incapable of winning a general election.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by T-Dog

I would consider something like the Jean Chrétien or Paul Martin Liberals to be centrist parties that governed from the middle. Business minded, socially mainstream and policies that generally aren't on the fringes. I would consider socialist ideology to be on the left of the political spectrum.

Were the policies of those parties really that drastically different from the Alberta NDP’s though?(federal and provincial jurisdictions aside)

I’m just trying to wrap my head around how one would view the UCP as closer to the Chrétien liberal government than the Alberta NDP.

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by T-Dog

I would consider something like the Jean Chrétien or Paul Martin Liberals to be centrist parties that governed from the middle. Business minded, socially mainstream and policies that generally aren't on the fringes. I would consider socialist ideology to be on the left of the political spectrum.

How is the Alberta NDP different than this?

Reminder that the Alberta NDP is not the Federal NDP.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

It's obviously not PC to say this (pun intended) but rural Alberta is holding the progress of this province back IMMENSELY.

The Rural Alberta Advantage

https://www.theraa.com/

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by chedder

Top of those polls are a person who is bats#$t crazy and a religious, handmaid tale, whackjob. We truly are doomed. I can only hope this pushes people, that wouldn't otherwise, to vote ndp next spring.

Originally Posted by Ashartus

Jean sure seems to have fallen from frontrunner to third, though I could still see him getting in as everyone's second choice. Regardless I sure hope an election gets called sooner rather than later so we don't have a complete nutcase running the province for a year with no accountability and no mandate from voters.

I'm surprised Brian Jean is that low in the polls but keep in mind these are only leadership polls. I suspect it Smith wins it will push many of the red Tories (mainly in Calgary) away from the UCP. The next election will boil down to how Calgary votes.

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Is this really where we are as a province, where the current government led by Jason Kenney is not considered "far-right wing"?

Let's call a spade a spade: we already have a far-right wing government in Alberta. We're now poised to have a lunatic fringe extremist far-right wing government in Alberta.

We're not even close to right wing even in Alberta. Centre right at best.

[Muta]

Never voted NDP before, but definitely will this time as they’re the only centrist option for this province right now. Anyone who calls them ‘left wing’ or ‘socialist’ isn’t paying attention, and hasn’t for eight years. I’m going to be rallying for the NDP too with my circle of friends - all whom never bother to vote in elections, but all whom have come to despise the UCP. And there’s A LOT of them. This extreme right-wing bat#### insanity needs to come to an end.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

We're not even close to right wing even in Alberta. Centre right at best.

That’s the beauty of subjective spectrums we make up. You’re both right and wrong. No not that right, the other right.