Great video, hadn’t heard of that guy before but that was pretty funny (and intelligent).
Feels like there are a number of posters on this board with similar views on systemic racism as Shapiro that could probably watch the video and learn something.
Great video, hadn’t heard of that guy before but that was pretty funny (and intelligent).
Feels like there are a number of posters on this board with similar views on systemic racism as Shapiro that could probably watch the video and learn something.
I mean there's a better video where he drags all of the IDW dweebs at once, but he really seems to love dunking on Ben.
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Yeah I subscribed, I’ll work through a bunch of his videos over the next bit (just finished the John Krasinski one).
How has he been around for YEARS and I haven’t noticed??
This may be a reach, but I'm assuming it might be because he's not funded by the Koch brothers, and this whole "tech companies marginalize conservative voices through their algorithms" talking point might be complete bull####, peddled by all of the usual IDW grifters. Total speculation on my part though.
There's also the whole tactic used by centrists to try to appear objective by dismissing people like Cody, Sam Seder, Michael Brooks, etc., as the "Fox News" of the left, despite them only being similar in terms of opposite ideological leanings and not in say dishonest, cherry-picked content.
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There's also the whole tactic used by centrists to try to appear objective by dismissing people like Cody, Sam Seder, Michael Brooks, etc., as the "Fox News" of the left, despite them only being similar in terms of opposite ideological leanings and not in say dishonest, cherry-picked content.
The ones I absolutely can't stand are the ones who claim to be "lefties", yet constantly pump out extremely cherrypicked and fascist-sympathizing content. Tim Pool is the absolute worst I've seen. He's basically the equivalent of Tucker Carlson, but at least Tucker doesn't claim to be left wing...
The ones I absolutely can't stand are the ones who claim to be "lefties", yet constantly pump out extremely cherrypicked and fascist-sympathizing content. Tim Pool is the absolute worst I've seen. He's basically the equivalent of Tucker Carlson, but at least Tucker doesn't claim to be left wing...
Go to about 5:20 and try your hardest not to cringe at poor Tim.
This, by the way, is why Cliff's question of "so why won't the left debate these people if they're so assured of their intellectual superiority?" is so ridiculous. There are plenty of examples of this happening.
Sam Seder has embarrassed Tim Pool and Charlie Kirk,and has offered to debate Dave Rubin and Steven Crowder (who both continually duck him). Zizek absolutely embarrassed Jordan Peterson in their debate, and Shapiro has been dunked on more times than I can count. Ezra Klein has punked more than a couple of them. Hell, Joe freaking Rogan embarrasses these guys half the time.
You know what the result of all of this is? Absolutely nothing. The rubes that buy what these grifters are selling continue to do so and the grifters never alter their ideology. It's a complete waste of time. No one owes these goofs an ounce of effort.
No one is threatened by the "big brain" ideas of the IDW. Most people just see the grift for what it is and choose not to engage.
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This, by the way, is why Cliff's question of "so why won't the left debate these people if they're so assured of their intellectual superiority?" is so ridiculous. There are plenty of examples of this happening.
Sam Seder has embarrassed Tim Pool and Charlie Kirk,and has offered to debate Dave Rubin and Steven Crowder (who both continually duck him). Zizek absolutely embarrassed Jordan Peterson in their debate, and Shapiro has been dunked on more times than I can count. Ezra Klein has punked more than a couple of them. Hell, Joe freaking Rogan embarrasses these guys half the time.
You know what the result of all of this is? Absolutely nothing. The rubes that buy what these grifters are selling continue to do so and the grifters never alter their ideology. It's a complete waste of time. No one owes these goofs an ounce of effort.
No one is threatened by the "big brain" ideas of the IDW. Most people just see the grift for what it is and choose not to engage.
The really unfortunate thing is that this grift is what there is demand for, on the right, and on the left, and pretty much anywhere you have people. People like info and narratives that confirm their beliefs. It's much easier to sell something to a person that already believes in the product. It's really hard to sell to someone when you need to change their view of the world to do so.
From a commercial point of view, nuance doesn't make much sense. Finding your target market and then providing them with an unwavering stream of content confirming their world view does make sense.
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"If stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?"
This, by the way, is why Cliff's question of "so why won't the left debate these people if they're so assured of their intellectual superiority?" is so ridiculous. There are plenty of examples of this happening.
Because it's like debating with your four year old. It's a no win situation. In their heads they are brilliant. To you and anyone else listening they are talking gibberish. But the second you do engage them and drop the hammer on them, putting them in their place, you look like the bad guy because you're beating up on a four year old. Many times it isn't worth it.
On a separate note, Tim Pool is the skid mark in the underwear of intellectual discussion. Just a horrible horrible human being. Anyone who follows or listens to this guy really needs to take a good hard look at themselves in the mirror and ask themselves some hard questions.
Ben Shapiro is the result of a tragic mistake at his bris. Normally they discard the foreskin and send the baby home with the parents. Shapiro is the result of nurturing that foreskin to maturity, and maturity is a strong word.
Because it's like debating with your four year old. It's a no win situation. In their heads they are brilliant. To you and anyone else listening they are talking gibberish. But the second you do engage them and drop the hammer on them, putting them in their place, you look like the bad guy because you're beating up on a four year old. Many times it isn't worth it.
This is a pretty good description of the situation. There are some pseudo-intellectuals (even on this board!) who like to espouse some pretty ridiculous and easily dismissed views and probably feel quite happy with themselves about it. They'll post little bits of information here and there, or trot out a talking point they heard from whatever pablum machine they're hooked up to, but when confronted with facts or context, they *poof* vanish, or just repeat the same thing they just said regardless of what facts were brought up to refute it, because the only good facts are their facts. If someone brings up context that provide a different interpretation of their "facts" it's bad, but ignoring context or facts they don't agree with? That goooood. They find themselves backed into a corner because, intellectually, there's nothing actually there. They don't bother actually looking into the issue or even reading all of the things they link to (for example), just pulling what makes sense to them and repeating that one thing. They aren't able to actually discuss it in a meaningful way (you know, not just repeating the same thing 100 times) because while they might have read it, they don't have the capacity to understand it.
You might often see them complaining about people using the words "racism" or "sexism" as a insult, as though accurate descriptions of their positions and their thoughts are somehow an insult. Sure, having your views labelled racist or sexist is insulting, especially when you have an unearned perception of yourself born from a complete lack of critical thought and world understanding, but it's also fairly easy not to be insulted by these things and instead clarify your own point, or at least bring up valuable context to diminish that view, right? That is, if you have a basic understanding of racism or sexism. But their response usually seems to be *poof* or "I err... am not.... that is a personal attack!"
Those complaints usually stem from the fact that not only are they unable to intellectually discuss an idea (any idea), but they can't even examine their own views. Of course, they're usually classical liberals or libertarians or some other nonsense which they think makes them sound a little more clever or interesting. They gobble up Petersen, and Harris, with maybe a side of Shapiro, without ever actually thinking about what those guys are saying and maybe agreeing with some of it, but not of all of it (you know, like any reasonably intellectual person might do). They like buckets, they understand buckets. Buckets make this complex world easy, buckets make sense.
So it becomes pretty clear when someone asks why "the left" isn't debating these "intellectuals" (when they clearly are, all the time) or when they go *poof* as soon as someone brings up something contrary to the world view they've been told to have by someone marginally smarter or at least more publically visible than them, that being able to reguritate information that fits your world view is not quite the same as understanding that information or seeking out information. That's called learning.
Last edited by PepsiFree; 08-12-2020 at 12:11 PM.
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It's funny, but it is easy to tell who you are talking about. Great comments, and I would only add that some of these pseuso-intellectuals (they think they are anyways) will talk all tough and claim to be some master of debate and rhetoric, but when you take them on and pants them time-after-time-after-time, they cry foul, claim you are treating them poorly, then put you on ignore so they can't see you destroying their weak arguments and pointing out their cognitive dissonance. They like to talk about the "snowflakes" but these people are snowflakiest of snowflakes around. They can't think for themselves and without their youtube heroes they are empty vessels. How is it put, all hat and no horse? The intellectual dark web is the perfect place for them. It's the outhouse of thought.
It's funny, but it is easy to tell who you are talking about. Great comments, and I would only add that some of these pseuso-intellectuals (they think they are anyways) will talk all tough and claim to be some master of debate and rhetoric, but when you take them on and pants them time-after-time-after-time, they cry foul, claim you are treating them poorly, then put you on ignore so they can't see you destroying their weak arguments and pointing out their cognitive dissonance. They like to talk about the "snowflakes" but these people are snowflakiest of snowflakes around. They can't think for themselves and without their youtube heroes they are empty vessels. How is it put, all hat and no horse? The intellectual dark web is the perfect place for them. It's the outhouse of thought.
I really kind of want to like this post, but I don't, because while it's accurate, I have a lot of sympathy for these people.
A lot of people to whom these "intellectuals" appeal to are genuinely curious about understanding the world and usually at least of medium intelligence. The vast majority of them are pretty young; typically they are young men because the "intellectual dark web" is also a boys club where cool daddy figures or big brothers tell you you're cool and smart because you believe in them, and believing in them makes you more of a man, and all them feminists who make you uncomfortable are just dumb-dumbs you can laugh at.
I believe it's mostly just a question of having the wrong heroes at the wrong time. I think most of us remember to some extent what it was like when you were young and you were really impressed by someone for the first time. Typically it's some artist, a writer or a musician maybe, you're just completely at awe at their "deep ideas" or what ever. Then you eventually run into other thinkers who you also like, but who's thoughts don't form any kind of coherent whole with the ideas you previously latched on to. You start to grasp relativism and perspectives and the fact that most people are both right and wrong, and that world can't be divided into people who are right and the ones that are wrong. Or you just realizes what dumb s*** you believed in before. I think that's happened to a lot of us
But if the thing you latch on to is a constantly self-referencing and self-reinforcing intellectual jerk-circle with multiple similar voices who make a very convincing act of being smarter and just always more right than the people outside the circle, and who also constantly ridicule everyone who thinks differently, it can lead to some pretty toxic development.
It's really a lot like belonging to a cult. They will tell you things you want to hear and build you up by telling you you're so smart and so much more right about everything than anyone because you believe what the cool daddy says, but just like a cult they will instantly turn on anyone who starts asking the wrong questions.
Spend enough time in that echo chamber and "being right", "being smart" and "believing in the cool daddy" become one, and they become a part of your identity. Then when you run into a situation where you realize you might be wrong about something important, it threatens your whole identity. This is why these people become so verbally aggressive so quickly.
It's a kind of intellectual essentialism really. Being right = being the right kind of person = believing the cool daddy.
It's why I now try to give some slack to these people. They lash out because they've already realized they might be wrong. Pressuring them to admit it is pointless, it's too scary for them. The smart ones will eventually re-evaluate their positions in the safety of their own heads, and I can't force the other ones to change their minds no matter what I say.
Last edited by Itse; 08-16-2020 at 10:13 AM.
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