American Politics Thread: The Hunt for Blue November

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by tkflames

I like how this debate is once again...GOP has no ethics and Democrats are pursuing good and noble goals....

Until you take the time to understand why 50% of the country voted the other way...what their concerns are...and why despite this "power hungry organization's" anti America agenda...they still had half the country vote for them in 2018 thereby leaving the power structure to what it is now allowing for this...you are just as closed minded as those you are currently ignoring by attributing all this as the corruption of the leadership.

Here is the reality...Half the country is happy with the moves the Republicans are making right now. These people have real issues that are not addressed by Democrats. They aren't all just victims that dont understand what they are voting for. If this significant portion of the country didnt exist...the Senate would be Democrat controlled (at least since 2018).

By jumping on the "everything Republicans do is evil and everything Democrats do is good" bandwagon, you are part of the problem...driving the conversation toward polarized opposites as opposed to fixing real issues.

For the record...I dont have a horse in the game, but if I did I would probably vote Democrat.

This is the most tone deaf response in the history of CP.

The GOP get votes because half the electorate consider political philosophy to be “abortion is murder, dems want my guns, immigrants stole my job” voters.

those are the issues that Dems aren’t addressing that are important to republican voters.

Constantly trotting out this narrative that we’re being mean and encouraging division are insane. This isn’t a choice between a ###### and a terd anymore. This is an authoritarian anti democratic racist hate filled party vs the democrats (who still suck but at least aren’t actively trying to erode democracy).

[agulati]

Point will stand for states with heavy slants in voting on both sides of the aisle. It can also lead to potentially a greater voter turn-out and a more involved public in this manner.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Well, she’s right.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1308449791215628290

[ResAlien]

But if you say mean things about them you’re just as bad Alas it seems nothing can ever be done.

[Puppet Guy]

[afc wimbledon]

It's hard to see how the US survives this as one country, the democratic states pretty much pay for the US and yet are having their concerns and desires ignored in a system designed to keep slavery legal by giving the balance of power to a minority of drooling trailer park dwelling yee-haw's

This is pretty much exactly the same seeds that led to the first civil war, I cant see the coasts not jettisining the south and midwest at some point, they would be massively better off in theory and get to have the things a normal first world country takes for granted, healthcare, education etc

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

It's hard to see how the US survives this as one country, the democratic states pretty much pay for the US and yet are having their concerns and desires ignored in a system designed to keep slavery legal by giving the balance of power to a minority of drooling trailer park dwelling yee-haw's

This is pretty much exactly the same seeds that led to the first civil war, I cant see the coasts not jettisining the south and midwest at some point, they would be massively better off in theory and get to have the things a normal first world country takes for granted, healthcare, education etc

This is not going to happen. Just like a civil war is not going to happen. We are a people who too intermixed to have a war or significant conflict. You have Republicans living next door to Democrats. You have large counties that are red in the midst of blue counties. You have a huge mix of people who are cast as enemies who are really friends of the people who are supposed to be their enemy. It just doesn't seem possible unless outside influences, militias and nationalist groups, invade communities to get the #### stirred up.

What this country needs right now is a calming voice. Trump is not that voice. He creates division and unrest. He thrives on unrest and division. He foments it. Biden is the better choice and show the ability to bring communities together. What really needs to be done is to have broadcast license pulled from Fox and Sinclair, and social media shut down. Stop the noise machine for a few years. Get people talking to each other again and having complex discussion instead of relying on 144 or 288 characters to get your message across. We need to get back to our knowing our neighbors and not seeing them as left or right, right or wrong. We are all Americans and there is more than should bring us together than should tear us apart. Sadly, the system is setup for the latter more than the former.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by New Era

This is not going to happen. Just like a civil war is not going to happen. We are a people who too intermixed to have a war or significant conflict. You have Republicans living next door to Democrats. You have large counties that are red in the midst of blue counties. You have a huge mix of people who are cast as enemies who are really friends of the people who are supposed to be their enemy. It just doesn't seem possible unless outside influences, militias and nationalist groups, invade communities to get the #### stirred up.

What this country needs right now is a calming voice. Trump is not that voice. He creates division and unrest. He thrives on unrest and division. He foments it. Biden is the better choice and show the ability to bring communities together. What really needs to be done is to have broadcast license pulled from Fox and Sinclair, and social media shut down. Stop the noise machine for a few years. Get people talking to each other again and having complex discussion instead of relying on 144 or 288 characters to get your message across. We need to get back to our knowing our neighbors and not seeing them as left or right, right or wrong. We are all Americans and there is more than should bring us together than should tear us apart. Sadly, the system is setup for the latter more than the former.

I'm not talking civil war, just the country getting sick of each other and breaking up, ironically the GOP's states rights agenda makes that easier and more likely, and to be clear I dont disagree with anything you say, but it isnt going to happen, things are just going to get worse

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I'm not talking civil war, just the country getting sick of each other and breaking up, ironically the GOP's states rights agenda makes that easier and more likely, and to be clear I dont disagree with anything you say, but it isnt going to happen, things are just going to get worse

It's illegal under the Constitution for a state to secede (amended in 1869), unless it is granted permission by Congress. More than 600,000 dead Americans can attest to that. If any state did so, the federal government would immediately intervene. Plus no major international powers would dare recognize it.

Having said that, if a coalition of states decided to spurn the federal government through disobedience, enough chaos could be created to negotiate for major changes, including more autonomy for states. This would mainly be a bureaucratic process and would take an extreme level of patience and self-sacrifice, something I doubt the materialist nature of American society would endure for long.

Theoretically (but not likely), if enough states chipped away through disobedience, it could start a revolution as the federal government fails to function, in which case the current Constitution becomes defunct.

[tkflames]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

This is the most tone deaf response in the history of CP.

The GOP get votes because half the electorate consider political philosophy to be “abortion is murder, dems want my guns, immigrants stole my job” voters.

those are the issues that Dems aren’t addressing that are important to republican voters.

Constantly trotting out this narrative that we’re being mean and encouraging division are insane. This isn’t a choice between a ###### and a terd anymore. This is an authoritarian anti democratic racist hate filled party vs the democrats (who still suck but at least aren’t actively trying to erode democracy).

Lol...I love this response. In order to avoid considering reality...you broadly stroke my post as tone deaf and then make the completely tone deaf statement that I pointed out in the first place.

You clearly have very little interaction with Republican voters. Until you realize that the vast majority of Republican voters have legitimate concerns as opposed to sinister, liberal hating agendas such as:
1. Will I have a job next week and can I provide for my family
2. Will there be work for my children

If you cant address these concerns and convince them to trust you...the country will remain divided. Take a step back and recognize that you are being played like a fiddle. You are no longer able to see what is the best and worst policy...you can only see it in red or blue. In this context you have way more in common with the "dont take my guns crowd" than you believe. Until you are able to step back from this...it is impossible to have a reasonable conversation with you or any of the others on both sides in highly polarized mindsets...and worse...you will continue to get angrier as the other side continues to win 50% of the battles (maybe more maybe less).

On the senate:
The Senate is meant to be a counter balance by design to straight majority rules ( 2 votes per state), the house is the counter balance (proportional representation), the presidency is an ugly #### show thereof. Each of these had a specific constitutional purpose (the Senate's purpose is to ensure that NY, Texas and California dont set all the rules for the entire country).

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Two things can be true at once. The manichean attitude by some posters in this thread to the GOP is hilariously simplistic, while the GOP is clearly acting in an unprincipled manner solely to accrue power, and lying about those motivations. These are not inconsistent things to believe.

[bigtmac19]

Explain to me how, if he loses, the GOP will go to the Court to say the Election was illegitimate?

[Fuzz]

The US constitution should have a Survivor article whereby at some random time, all political parties are blown up, and elected members are randomly assigned to new parties where they must work together or get the boot. And by boot I mean the big Australian one.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by bigtmac19

Explain to me how, if he loses, the GOP will go to the Court to say the Election was illegitimate?

I don't know that he will "lose", because on election night itself before the mail-in ballots are finished being counted, he may well be ahead in enough states to get to 270. I think that's actually likely.

The goal, as I understand it, would be to get the Supreme Court to order that the counting of those mail-in ballots be stopped just like they ordered recounts to cease in 2000, because [INSERT DISHONEST RATIONALIZATION HERE], at which point Trump simply be declared the winner on the basis of votes tabulated to date.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

I don't know that he will "lose", because on election night itself before the mail-in ballots are finished being counted, he may well be ahead in enough states to get to 270. I think that's actually likely.

The goal, as I understand it, would be to get the Supreme Court to order that the counting of those mail-in ballots be stopped just like they ordered recounts to cease in 2000, because [INSERT DISHONEST RATIONALIZATION HERE], at which point Trump simply be declared the winner on the basis of votes tabulated to date.

That is exactly the game plan - Trump and Barr have been telegraphing that for months. Also don't be surprised in any way if Republican operatives and/or foreign powers plant massive numbers of fraudulent Republican AND Democratic (false flag) votes to gum up the works and make certification of mail-in ballots 'impossible'. Again, Trump has been projecting that this will be the most fraudulent election in history, and he knows why.

This is so transparent and predictable.

[edslunch]

The smug grin as he says "I told you so" will be nauseating

[Fighting Banana Slug]

What a horrendous situation. The big ask for our US brothers and sisters is to go out and vote. In person. Can't prevent all instances of ######baggery, but it would sure help of the numbers were already in the favour of Dems prior to finalizing the mail-in.

[dobbles]

Originally Posted by tkflames

Lol...I love this response. In order to avoid considering reality...you broadly stroke my post as tone deaf and then make the completely tone deaf statement that I pointed out in the first place.

You clearly have very little interaction with Republican voters. Until you realize that the vast majority of Republican voters have legitimate concerns as opposed to sinister, liberal hating agendas such as:
1. Will I have a job next week and can I provide for my family
2. Will there be work for my children

If you cant address these concerns and convince them to trust you...the country will remain divided. Take a step back and recognize that you are being played like a fiddle. You are no longer able to see what is the best and worst policy...you can only see it in red or blue. In this context you have way more in common with the "dont take my guns crowd" than you believe. Until you are able to step back from this...it is impossible to have a reasonable conversation with you or any of the others on both sides in highly polarized mindsets...and worse...you will continue to get angrier as the other side continues to win 50% of the battles (maybe more maybe less).

On the senate:
The Senate is meant to be a counter balance by design to straight majority rules ( 2 votes per state), the house is the counter balance (proportional representation), the presidency is an ugly #### show thereof. Each of these had a specific constitutional purpose (the Senate's purpose is to ensure that NY, Texas and California dont set all the rules for the entire country).

A someone that has spent the last decade living in South Carolina and Oklahoma, I can confidently say you have no idea wtf you are talking about.

I posted here 4 years ago about the sad point in which the 8 year old boy that lived down the street started talking about crooked Hilary.

In my experience, the number one driver in republican policy of the last decade? Doing whatever pisses off liberals the most. Policy 1a? Undoing anything that Obama supported.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by tkflames

You clearly have very little interaction with Republican voters. Until you realize that the vast majority of Republican voters have legitimate concerns as opposed to sinister, liberal hating agendas such as:
1. Will I have a job next week and can I provide for my family
2. Will there be work for my children

If you cant address these concerns and convince them to trust you...the country will remain divided. Take a step back and recognize that you are being played like a fiddle. You are no longer able to see what is the best and worst policy...you can only see it in red or blue. In this context you have way more in common with the "dont take my guns crowd" than you believe. Until you are able to step back from this...it is impossible to have a reasonable conversation with you or any of the others on both sides in highly polarized mindsets...and worse...you will continue to get angrier as the other side continues to win 50% of the battles (maybe more maybe less).

Just how many of these republicans are willing to admit that the US economy was adding jobs at a very healthy pace during the final 2 years of Obama's presidency?

On the senate:
The Senate is meant to be a counter balance by design to straight majority rules ( 2 votes per state), the house is the counter balance (proportional representation), the presidency is an ugly #### show thereof. Each of these had a specific constitutional purpose (the Senate's purpose is to ensure that NY, Texas and California dont set all the rules for the entire country).

And yet, it allows sparsely populated states have enormously disproportionate power, and call the shots at the expense of the rest of the country.

If the House also had some say in who gets confirmed to the SC, you maybe would have a point. As it stands now, the Senate (and especially the SML) has a ridiculous amount of power.

Just like the Senate had the power to veto removing Trump from office, the House should have the power to veto a SC pick. But alas, they don't. The Senate and WH get to call the most important shots, leaving the House powerless to do anything about it.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

What a horrendous situation. The big ask for our US brothers and sisters is to go out and vote. In person. Can't prevent all instances of ######baggery, but it would sure help of the numbers were already in the favour of Dems prior to finalizing the mail-in.

I'm going to vote in person. I have been saying that for months, and I'm begging other people to do the same. It's the only sure way to be rid of the idiot.