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Old 09-12-2019, 12:34 PM   #21
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I think Flames slide this season. Sharks and Golden Knights take the Pacific. Flames battle Avs for 3rd place in Pacific and/or Wild Card spot.

I just hope that the Flames end season strong to have momentum going into the playoffs.
Colorado is not a Pacific Division team, so barring a significant rise from one of Arizona or Vancouver, the Flames will be fairly secure in a Divisional playoff spot.
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Old 09-12-2019, 01:01 PM   #22
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Flames will finish 2nd to VGK in Pacific. I'm more certain of that than anything else. Almost pube eating levels of certainty. Almost.
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Old 09-12-2019, 01:07 PM   #23
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Flames will finish 2nd to VGK in Pacific. I'm more certain of that than anything else. Almost pube eating levels of certainty. Almost.
They need Fleury to maintain his play, which, at his age, is never a certainty.
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Old 09-12-2019, 01:25 PM   #24
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They need Fleury to maintain his play, which, at his age, is never a certainty.
Yeah, he is going to be 35-years-old, and Fleury started +60 games last year for only the second time in the last five years. His 3,635:08 mins were the fourth-most of all NHL goalies in 2018–19. Unless Malcolm Subban can be a lot better this year, VGK is likely going to slip defensively.
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Old 09-12-2019, 01:52 PM   #25
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Fear and adrenaline.

Colorado did not will themselves to their best performance at the right time last year; these things just happen. If it was as simple as deciding when to play their best hockey, then every year the most skilled team would win. By the same token, once a team loses the momentum, it is extremely difficult to wrest it back over such a short period of time.

I have said it all along and I continue to believe that the biggest problem for Calgary last year was psychological. Too many of the Flames best players allowed Colorado to get into their heads, and I also think the coaches weren't adequately prepared for how things unravelled, and how quickly it fell apart—not just in the series, but from game-to-game.

I think everyone will be better prepared this year.
Those are all fair points, so maybe I just don't understand what you meant by how much of that was out of their control? Is there anything more within your control than preparation?

Or you're saying that none of it was the Avs doing and so there is nothing to learn for other teams?
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Old 09-12-2019, 02:15 PM   #26
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Yeah, he is going to be 35-years-old, and Fleury started +60 games last year for only the second time in the last five years. His 3,635:08 mins were the fourth-most of all NHL goalies in 2018–19. Unless Malcolm Subban can be a lot better this year, VGK is likely going to slip defensively.
I think Mark Stone will be the reason for improvement. He is their best player by a mile and they didn't have him last year for most of the year.
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Old 09-12-2019, 02:19 PM   #27
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Those are all fair points, so maybe I just don't understand what you meant by how much of that was out of their control? Is there anything more within your control than preparation?
I think it depends. For players I am not sure there is much control—players live and die by routine, so I expect that preparation in the playoffs doesn't look at all different from how it looks in the regular season. This is where coaches make a difference, and yes, for coaches this is something over which they do have control. We will see what sort of a difference a year makes, but I expect Bill Peters and company to have the team better prepared the next time around.

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Or you're saying that none of it was the Avs doing and so there is nothing to learn for other teams?
I wouldn't say "none of it was the Avs doing," because they obviously played that series very well, and they frustrated the Flames. There are strategies to play the Flames, of course—there are for every team, but I don't think this makes the biggest difference in the playoffs. Every year a very good team wins the Stanley Cup, but the team that wins is also the one that is playing their best at the right time. THAT's the magic ingredient that no one can control—you can't get around it, and it is impossible to manufacture.
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Old 09-12-2019, 02:24 PM   #28
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Old 09-12-2019, 02:29 PM   #29
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I think Flames slide this season. Sharks and Golden Knights take the Pacific. Flames battle Avs for 3rd place in Pacific and/or Wild Card spot.

I just hope that the Flames end season strong to have momentum going into the playoffs.
I can promise you this won't happen
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Old 09-12-2019, 02:42 PM   #30
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I don't see a big slide for the Flames this year. Unless the Tkachuk situation completely falls apart (which I doubt).

I expect Monahan and Gaudreau to come back hungrier than ever.

I expect Bennett, Mangiapane, Dube, Jankowski, Andersson and Kylington to be better than last year. Possibly Hanifin as well. I think Lucic will be more useful than Neal was.

I expect Backlund, Tkachuk, Ryan, Brodie, and Hamonic to be about the same.

Giordano and Lindholm will be hard pressed to match last season, but even if they don't, I don't see some huge drop off.

I expect the goaltending to be better than last year.

Intangibles, like injuries, momentum from a good start, etc. probably aren't as fortunate as last year.

All told, I see maybe a marginal step back, simply because last year was so good. But I expect them to be over 100 points, so 107 doesn't seem all that unattainable.
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Old 09-12-2019, 02:52 PM   #31
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As for the Flames not making the playoffs, ALL of the following would have to happen:

1) VEG passes them (sure)
2) SJ passes them (unlikely IMO, as the Sharks lost a lot of talent this summer)
3) one of ARI or VAN has to pass them. ARI had 86 points and VAN had 81. I could see ARI hit 90, or maybe 95 at the most, but that's about it. I don't see VAN hitting 90. So the Flames would have to plummet for either of these teams to pass them.
4) Both WC teams would have to pass them. Last year, the two WCs had 93 and 90 points. It is certainly reasonable to think those numbers will rise this year, but even if we assume 96, that still requires a huge drop off from the Flames.

If you think the Flames aren't making the playoffs, you have to be thinking they will get less than 95 points. Probably less than 92 or 93.

I don't see any chance of that happening.
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Old 09-12-2019, 04:06 PM   #32
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I think Mark Stone will be the reason for improvement. He is their best player by a mile and they didn't have him last year for most of the year.
True. But a lot of other important players are aging - Paccioretty, Stastny, Reaves, and especially MAF. Even Marchessault is turning 29 this year.

They have no serious backup if MAF falters.
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Old 09-12-2019, 04:14 PM   #33
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I think their D is much weaker this year too.

Having Stone all year will be huge. But they have issues, just like every team.
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Old 09-12-2019, 04:30 PM   #34
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Old 09-13-2019, 12:34 PM   #35
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True. But a lot of other important players are aging - Paccioretty, Stastny, Reaves, and especially MAF. Even Marchessault is turning 29 this year.

They have no serious backup if MAF falters.
And here I thought the Flames an experienced team rather than an aging team, but by your standards Stastny 33 and Paccioretty 30 and 4th line thug Reaves 32 is reason to worry.

Gio 36 to start the season, Lucic 31, Backlund 30 Ryan 32 Frolik 31 and Talbot 32 on the wrong side of 30 and even Brodie and Hamonic just turned 29.

Talbot has been at the best mediocre since he turned 30

Subban is not that far behind BSD in experience and/or performance.


Hopefully these players have a few good years left.
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Old 09-13-2019, 12:53 PM   #36
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...Subban is not that far behind BSD in experience and/or performance...
NHL Career:
Goalie A: 58GS 35W 15L 8OT 2.70 GAA 0.909SP
Goalie B: 41GS 21W 16L 4OT 2.88 GAA 0.903SP

2018–19 NHL Season
Goalie A: 42GS 27W 9L 5OT 2.61GAA 0.911SP
Goalie B: 20GS 8W 10L 2OT 2.93GAA 0.902SP

Goalie A is miles ahead of Goalie B, and they have been trending in opposite directions. Guess which one is which.
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Old 09-13-2019, 01:09 PM   #37
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And here I thought the Flames an experienced team rather than an aging team, but by your standards Stastny 33 and Paccioretty 30 and 4th line thug Reaves 32 is reason to worry.

Gio 36 to start the season, Lucic 31, Backlund 30 Ryan 32 Frolik 31 and Talbot 32 on the wrong side of 30 and even Brodie and Hamonic just turned 29.

Talbot has been at the best mediocre since he turned 30

Subban is not that far behind BSD in experience and/or performance.


Hopefully these players have a few good years left.
The only core guy on your list is Gio. The most important players on the Flames are mid 20s, with a slew of younger guys being added. Who does Vegas have ready to take the reins?

Subban v. Rittich? Don't make me laugh.
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Old 09-13-2019, 01:33 PM   #38
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The only core guy on your list is Gio. The most important players on the Flames are mid 20s, with a slew of younger guys being added. Who does Vegas have ready to take the reins?

Subban v. Rittich? Don't make me laugh.
Didn’t Subban sign over in Europe? Or was that the third brother that did?
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Old 09-13-2019, 01:37 PM   #39
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Didn’t Subban sign over in Europe? Or was that the third brother that did?
I believe that would be miniature Subban, Jordan, who was drafted by the Vancouver Canucks in 2013.
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