[Rumour] Canucks/Abbotsford/Heat Ongoing Saga

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

How about outside the country? Boise or Billings perhaps?

Just speculation.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

How about outside the country? Boise or Billings perhaps?

Just speculation.

I'd like to see Boise. The arean isn't super old as it opened in 1999, it seats 5,000 for hockey and they draw 3800+ for the ECHL.

[Drury18]

I don't hate the Billings option. I think they would work well because:

1) Close to Calgary (8 hour drive, 1 hour flight) so call-ups can make it to Calgary quickly if needed. And it's a much easier 8 hour drive (no Mountains I believe) to Billings then it is to Abbotsford so you could have more Flames fans heading down there for games.

2) There are a number of Engineering and Architect firms (i.e. $$$ Companies) with HQ in Billings as well as banks, oil/gas and auto companies with operations in Billings so corporate sponsorship or ownership should be easy to find. I think there's also a dozen breweries based out of or close to Billings. I can't imagine money or sponsorship would be an issue.

3) Largest media market in Montana is based out of Billings so there would be lots of media coverage for the team. It's primarily a basketball state, but I think hockey could catch on being Canada is pretty close and Washington State right next to them has a couple of WHL teams.

My only question would be where do they play. MetraPark? They don't seem to have a dedicated ice arena that would seat enough people. Centennial only seats 500 or so.

[neo45]

The AHL does not put teams in CHL cities, that won't happen.

Fort Mc might actually be an option for an AHL team in the future.... Montana would obviously be nice

[Drury18]

The Marlies and St. Michaels played in the same city for 2 years. And arguably still do as Mississauga is only 20 minutes away from Toronto.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Drury18

The only hitch I could see with Red Deer would be that Sutter owns the team and I don't know if he would be all for sharing/moving the team for anything associated with the Flames.

I do think they would do okay drawing a crowd. Currently, the Rebels have 81% capacity at games (http://www.hockeyattendance.com/team...r-rebels/2013/). They do get a good crowd as Red Deer is a good sized city and you have easy access via Highway 2 and 11 from a number of other small towns maybe 30 minutes away.

Red Deer would work if there was no WHL team but why would Sutter move the Rebels and if they stay the AHL is going to be the 2nd choice team and I doubt there is enough money/desire to support two hockey teams in that city. I don't think it has anything to do with the Flames being involved I can't think of any reason Sutter would move for any team.

No WHL teams then the cities work but with WHL teams already there I can't see it working at all.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Well, to make things unbearable, imagine them moving to Lethbridge. We replace those posters giving us updates in exchange for Moon's keen insights:

Knight: He sucks
Ferland: He sucks
Granlund: He sucks
etc.

No worries there, if the AHL came to Lethbridge I would not be attending any games.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by neo45

The AHL does not put teams in CHL cities, that won't happen.

Fort Mc might actually be an option for an AHL team in the future.... Montana would obviously be nice

Abbotsford and Chilliwack are essentially one market and they had no problem chasing the Bruins out when the Heat moved in.

Saskatoon is a growing city with too much potential for the AHL to ignore.

I am not sure how Billings or Montana in general would work.... do they have the flight network to support an AHL team?

[moon]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Abbotsford and Chilliwack are essentially one market and they had no problem chasing the Bruins out when the Heat moved in.

Saskatoon is a growing city with too much potential for the AHL to ignore.

I am not sure how Billings or Montana in general would work.... do they have the flight network to support an AHL team?

They are essentially one market but two different cities, two different city councils and two different buildings to deal with.

Also they got a sweetheart deal in Abbotsford that allowed them to not worry about the fact that they didn't have any fans going to the game and the market is way bigger than what we are talking about here.

Unlikely that a Saskatoon, Red Deer, Lethbridge etc. are going to give the AHL a sweetheart deal to cover the losses if they even want to talk to them about using their building which already have WHL teams as the primary tennant.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by moon

They are essentially one market but two different cities, two different city councils and two different buildings to deal with.

Also they got a sweetheart deal in Abbotsford that allowed them to not worry about the fact that they didn't have any fans going to the game and the market is way bigger than what we are talking about here.

Unlikely that a Saskatoon, Red Deer, Lethbridge etc. are going to give the AHL a sweetheart deal to cover the losses if they even want to talk to them about using their building which already have WHL teams as the primary tennant.

I get that... with the building and political will aspects. I just mean the notion that the AHL will never move into areas where CHL teams will be affected. They had to know full well going into Abbotsford that they were also going to be affecting the market for the Bruins. In fact, it was discussed publicly even before the Heat moved in.

IMO, the AHL (and a parent NHL team) would be nuts to not try to move into Saskatoon. Whether or not Saskatoon accepts it is a different matter (like you said).

[gargamel]

Originally Posted by moon

No worries there, if the AHL came to Lethbridge I would not be attending any games.

I'm impressed that moon found a way to respond to a post about him hating everyone by being even more of a grouch.

[moon]

Originally Posted by gargamel

I'm impressed that moon found a way to respond to a post about him hating everyone by being even more of a grouch.

I am not sure how supporting the WHL team I have for 10 years over an AHL team makes me a grouch.

[J epworth]

Saskatoon is a really weird hockey market. They don't draw that well for the Blades, but the ones who do go are lifelong fans. It really is all about the Riders in Saskatoon, and after football season is over everyone just waits until June for more football. The arena is in a terrible spot for a lot of the city to get to, even with 3000 fans going to games it still takes 30 minutes to even get out of that parking lot. It's just so inconvenient that many don't bother with WHL on those -20 days that seem the norm from December on. I don't think the AHL would draw any better.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

I agree that putting an AHL team in a WHL city will never work.

I don't think it needs to be said, but I'll say it anyways: the AHL is a divisive league. It requires you to have an allegiance to the NHL parent club, especially if that AHL team is based out of Canada.

The WHL on the other hand has no such allegiance. You can cheer for the Oilers, Canucks or Flames and still enjoy a Giants, Rebels, Hitmen, Hurricanes game. It's what makes the CHL such a fun league to watch.

I just don't think Canada in general is a good market for the AHL because of how tribal Canadian hockey fans are. Yes, the AHL worked extremely well in Winnipeg at one point in time and yes, the AHL is working well out in St. John's right now. But that's because those places essentially devoid of hockey and not within decent driving distance of any hockey.

Clearly I think the best move (if it were to happen) would be to the northern States somewhere. Like I said, Billings or Boise.

Another option could be Rapid City, South Dakota. They've got a decent population of about 70,000. They've also got the Rushmore Plaza Civic Center that seats 5000. However, they've got the Rapid City Rush which is a CHL team. Don't know what type of support they get.

Just throwing it out there though for the sake of discussion.

[Savvy27]

nvm

[Calgary4LIfe]

What about Portland? Yes, they have the Winterhawks, but Portland is a fairly large city - could that be a place that would support both the WHL and the AHL?

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by moon

I am not sure how supporting the WHL team I have for 10 years over an AHL team makes me a grouch.

Mainly, it's delivery.
If the above was your goal, you could have said something like:

"Even if the AHL came to town, I would still support the WHL team I have supported for over 10 years, and likely would not go to any AHL games."

Just a suggestion...

[thymebalm]

Places I rank as good bets for crowds

1) Calgary - I don't know what rink you put them in, but there is no better market for Flames hockey than the city of Calgary. Especially as the drafting improves and the AHL becomes more and more competitive. It's already a -very- good league. Probably the 3rd best talent pool in the world. I'm priced out of season tickets to the Flames, but I'd jump for a pair of Heat Season's passes.

2) Saskatchewan - Lots of Flames fans in the province of Saskatchewan, and no professional hockey. City size doesn't really seem to matter if the allegiance isn't there. There are already 5 WHL teams there, but if done right, having their AHL team there would improve scouting in the dub at the same time as building a legitimate fan base.

3) Phoenix/Arizona - Many Albertan refugees wind up in the state of Arizona, and it's the one other spot where Flames fans seem to show up in some numbers. It would be an imported market, but I still think it would outsell Abbotsford.

4) Lethbridge - Obvious territorial conflicts with junior again, but a fanbase willing to watch Flames hockey in southern Alberta none the less.

5) Idaho/Montana - Way more work to create fans, but has the proximity and lacks some of the other deterring factors concerning saturated markets.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by moon

Red Deer would work if there was no WHL team but why would Sutter move the Rebels and if they stay the AHL is going to be the 2nd choice team and I doubt there is enough money/desire to support two hockey teams in that city. I don't think it has anything to do with the Flames being involved I can't think of any reason Sutter would move for any team.

No WHL teams then the cities work but with WHL teams already there I can't see it working at all.

The only way to convince WHL teams to move is with money. Either buy them out or offer bucks for them to move. My choice is Saskatoon. I understand they have a lot of Flames fans. A destination for a WHL team could be Fort Mac or maybe Peace River or Winnipeg.

[PeteMoss]

The best market in Canada for an AHL team would be Thunder Bay if you actually want to draw fans. No idea if the arena up there would be up to AHL standards but I'd almost guarantee fan support up there.