Brad Treliving needs to go

[Jiri Hrdina]

It makes sense for it to happen at the end of the season. But it either happens right away (within 3-5 days) or it's not happening.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Makes no sense.

If the Flames were going to fire Treliving, they would have either done it when Sutter was hired, or they wouldn’t have allowed Treliving to hire Sutter and would has gassed Ward and Treliving after the season.

I don’t necessarily agree. I think Treliving/Sutter/Ownership were all convinced that they were going to turn it around and make the playoffs with Sutter. I was totally convinced it was going to work and if they didn’t have that horrid streak of 1-8 they would have made it.

At this point you don’t fire him until the season is over but I could see the fact the Sutter move did not produce playoffs it could be a death blow for him. I also think Sam Bennett exploding and Darryl telling the media this is just not a great team and only a bubble group could be things that have changed ownerships mind.

I was fairly confident that he was going to be safe until the last month or so and I do think there is a chance it happens. This is likely the most pissed and angered the fanbase has been in recent memory and throwing Treliving under the bus and having him take the fall will appease many of those fans.

[Erick Estrada]

I would hope if he's fired it's not to appease fans and it's because they are not happy with the current state of the team and legitimately want to build a contender. Treliving hasn't been a disaster but he got 7 years to build his team and his team just isn't that good. Time for another GM to get a chance of building something better.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I would hope if he's fired it's not to appease fans and it's because they are not happy with the current state of the team and legitimately want to build a contender. Treliving hasn't been a disaster but he got 7 years to build his team and his team just isn't that good. Time for another GM to get a chance of building something better.

Who they replace him with would be quite telling.

Internal replacement: more of the same
External replacement with an established track record: potentially a change in approach.

[nik-]

It'll probably be whoever is the result of the easiest hiring process, which likely means internal, which likely means they'll just bump up Conroy. Who cares that there's zero indication that he can do the job or that he was present through a large part of this failed rebuild, did you see his interviews in the 2004 run?! And they don't even need to interview anyone!

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Who they replace him with would be quite telling.

Internal replacement: more of the same
External replacement with an established track record: potentially a change in approach.

If he gets fired I'm hoping for an entire house cleaning. Gelinas, Conroy, Sigalet and the works shown the door. I know Gelinas and Conny are good dudes but this sort of nepotism is usually adopted by poorly run organizations (Oilers).

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by nik-

It'll probably be whoever is the result of the easiest hiring process, which likely means internal, which likely means they'll just bump up Conroy. Who cares that there's zero indication that he can do the job or that he was present through a large part of this failed rebuild, did you see his interviews in the 2004 run?! And they don't even need to interview anyone!

As someone who has defended BT and voted to not have him fired, I would be more than fine with it - as long as the franchise identifies and recruits someone who is a clear upgrade.

Otherwise stick with BT and he improves

Best: Replace BT with a GM with a proven track record of success
OK: Keep BT
Worst solution: Fire BT and hire someone like Conroy

Part of my reason for voting to keep BT is because I don't have faith in the franchise to actually find someone clearly better.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

If he gets fired I'm hoping for an entire house cleaning. Gelinas, Conroy, Sigalet and the works shown the door. I know Gelinas and Conny are good dudes but this sort of nepotism is usually adopted by poorly run organizations (Oilers).

Gelinas would be Sutter's call but otherwise yes. I would gas anyone involved in the decisions for the pro team. I like the work of the amateur scouting.

I also worry about Sutter's influence over player personnel is someone like Conroy was given the GM job.

[nik-]

I was only on board with Sutter if he was a "wrap up the season" hire. A three year term really kind of indicates that management and ownership haven't accepted the reality here. I understand that Sutter has no incentive to take a half year job, but then you just don't hire him. He's way too big of a presence in this club to not have an outsized influence and that's not a good thing.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Not necessarily. They kept him on, let Sutter assess what was there. Tre's deadline moves were small and seemed controlled.

If they find a guy that they believe can handle the role better than Treliving, they will hire him.

I don't see this being strange at all.

Can you think of a recent example though? It would seem down right goofy to me. If Montreal gets bounced easily, I could see Bergevin getting fired along with Duscharme. Difference is Duscharme is the interim HC. does he have a contract beyond the end of this year? Big difference between that and what Sutter was given.

How bizarre/interesting would it be to have:
-shown the door/fire one time hugely popular GM Daryll Sutter.
-Rehire him as the coach eleven years later.
-Fire his manager less than 4 months later to replace the GM with....??

Pretty sure when Sutter came out of retirement he had a good idea as to who the GM was going to be and what direction the team intended to go in. Otherwise he probably would have stayed on the farm with his family while we are in pandemic and dealing with the worst working conditions the NHL has seen in recent history. Seems like it would have been a easy 'no thanks' unless he saw something pretty attractive about the offer.

If Treliving is canned, then is Sutter hiring the new GM? Does he have a say in who the new GM should be? Is this even a good idea? I believe Sutter said during one of his early press conferences that he had no intention of expanding his role beyond coaching. What if the new GM wants to bring in his own coach, much like every GM wants to? Or is the intent to hire a new GM and see how year one goes with Sutter. If it goes poorly, new GM will fire Sutter and bring in his guy.

I'm still having a hard time seeing any scenario where Treliving is fired this offseason.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Gelinas would be Sutter's call but otherwise yes. I would gas anyone involved in the decisions for the pro team. I like the work of the amateur scouting.

I also worry about Sutter's influence over player personnel is someone like Conroy was given the GM job.

Not sure what would be a worse promotion. Conroy or Maloney?

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Not sure what would be a worse promotion. Conroy or Maloney?

I don't like either but I think Conroy.
No experience
Sutter influence
Talks too much.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Gelinas would be Sutter's call but otherwise yes. I would gas anyone involved in the decisions for the pro team. I like the work of the amateur scouting.

I also worry about Sutter's influence over player personnel is someone like Conroy was given the GM job.

“So… you think that was a good trade?….. 6 am bag skate tomorrow!”

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

I don't like either but I think Conroy.
No experience
Sutter influence
Talks too much.

To me it's more that Conny would be attached to players on the roster. I really believe the organization needs a fresh set of eyes. I suppose Darryl is that and it sounds like he's not a fan of the roster but I certainly don't want him having his hands in personnel. You can already see with him leaning on guys like Stone and Nesterov what kind of players he would be leveraging assets to acquire.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Can you think of a recent example though? It would seem down right goofy to me. If Montreal gets bounced easily, I could see Bergevin getting fired along with Duscharme. Difference is Duscharme is the interim HC. does he have a contract beyond the end of this year? Big difference between that and what Sutter was given.

How bizarre/interesting would it be to have:
-shown the door/fire one time hugely popular GM Daryll Sutter.
-Rehire him as the coach eleven years later.
-Fire his manager less than 4 months later to replace the GM with....??

Pretty sure when Sutter came out of retirement he had a good idea as to who the GM was going to be and what direction the team intended to go in. Otherwise he probably would have stayed on the farm with his family while we are in pandemic and dealing with the worst working conditions the NHL has seen in recent history. Seems like it would have been a easy 'no thanks' unless he saw something pretty attractive about the offer.

If Treliving is canned, then is Sutter hiring the new GM? Does he have a say in who the new GM should be? Is this even a good idea? I believe Sutter said during one of his early press conferences that he had no intention of expanding his role beyond coaching. What if the new GM wants to bring in his own coach, much like every GM wants to? Or is the intent to hire a new GM and see how year one goes with Sutter. If it goes poorly, new GM will fire Sutter and bring in his guy.

I'm still having a hard time seeing any scenario where Treliving is fired this offseason.

If ownership factored into the coaching hire and has decided to be more hands on with their approach to the team then I think it all makes perfect sense.

Ownership is close with Darryl. They trust him and his opinion clearly. Lot of respect there.

Would Darryl be hiring the GM? No. Would he provide his opinion & insight into what he thinks Treliving has amassed and what he thinks they should be looking for going forward? Of course. Would he be asked for a recommendation as to who he thinks would make a good GM? If asked I think he would. Again, doesn't mean he's hiring the guy but he could be very influential.

I don't find it that weird that Sutter would go from being the coach, then GM, then being fired to coming back all these years later only to see the GM above him be removed. That's the business. Again, we can go back to his relationship with ownership. Despite it not working out all those years ago there is still clearly a bond.

I agree with Jiri. If Treliving is fired, I expect them to bring in an experienced GM. I would expect that person to be likeminded with Sutter.

[NewFan]

When I watch those teams in the playoffs, specially that elite teams I noticed the game system and style is almost same as Darryl's Flames. The difference is the elite teams execute the system faster, fight for the puck harder and win more small battles in the corners after forecheck or dumping. Stay own zone minimum time with a quick outlet pass or skate out with the puck. And when there is a chance or other team make a mistake the skilled elite players use it very effectively and punish opponent.
For me this team has very few players that can succeed during the playoffs or win the Cup. Current roster may play D and keep the score low but don't have enough impact players to outscore other team. I hope they make the correct decision this offseason.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Toonage

If ownership factored into the coaching hire and has decided to be more hands on with their approach to the team then I think it all makes perfect sense.

Ownership is close with Darryl. They trust him and his opinion clearly. Lot of respect there.

Would Darryl be hiring the GM? No. Would he provide his opinion & insight into what he thinks Treliving has amassed and what he thinks they should be looking for going forward? Of course. Would he be asked for a recommendation as to who he thinks would make a good GM? If asked I think he would. Again, doesn't mean he's hiring the guy but he could be very influential.

I don't find it that weird that Sutter would go from being the coach, then GM, then being fired to coming back all these years later only to see the GM above him be removed. That's the business. Again, we can go back to his relationship with ownership. Despite it not working out all those years ago there is still clearly a bond.

I agree with Jiri. If Treliving is fired, I expect them to bring in an experienced GM. I would expect that person to be likeminded with Sutter.

Well, Lombardi, then?

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Toonage

I agree with Jiri. If Treliving is fired, I expect them to bring in an experienced GM. I would expect that person to be likeminded with Sutter.

To clarify I don't expect this. That's what I would want to happen but I have doubts that they would bring in an experienced GM.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well, Lombardi, then?

I could see an argument for Lombardi. He was the one who made the moves to put LA over the top. If the Flames can extend Johnny, you could argue that adding significant pieces via trade could get the job "done". He traded a lot of futures to pretty good effect...so, is that what the Flames are looking for? It seems perfectly feasible to me that it's what the owners want.

That Athletic article from John Vogl that suggest Tkachuk + Zary + 1st round pick for Eichel...is there anyone here who would scoff at that?

Make that trade, and extend Gaudreau.

Gaudreau - Eichel - ?
Mangiapane - Lindholm - ?
Dube - Monahan - ?
Lucic - Backlund - Nordstrom

Giordano - Tanev
Hanifin - Andersson
Valimaki - Mackey

Markstrom
?

Stone
Ritchie

If you assume league minimum for Stone, Ritchie, and Nordstrom alongside qualifying offers for Valimaki and Dube, that leaves $7.4M to fill three RW spots and a back-up goalie knowing you also have Gawdin and Ruzicka on deck.

That would certainly get me excited as a fan.

(...sweetener with Seattle to have them select Kylington instead of Gio?)

If Treliving can acquire Eichel in such a deal, I'd say he would have put together two back to back strong off-seasons from a player personnel perspective after having the two years before that be complete duds.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

I could see an argument for Lombardi. He was the one who made the moves to put LA over the top. If the Flames can extend Johnny, you could argue that adding significant pieces via trade could get the job "done". He traded a lot of futures to pretty good effect...so, is that what the Flames are looking for? It seems perfectly feasible to me that it's what the owners want.

Lombardi's been Sutter's GM twice IIRC.

The Gaudreau contract situation is so problematic. So many other decisions are dependent on whether he's extended or not. But what I fear is that he will not commit either way, or even give a fairly positive direction. If I'm the Flames I have to hedge my bet and trade him now.