A Game of Thrones **BOOKS OFF LIMITS** v2

[pseudoreality]

My thoughts so far:

1) Jamie surviving was not consistent with the show. Historically there have been few easy outs. He should have at the very least drowned. If not burnt or drowned, he should have been captured. Then watch the drama has Danny roasts him in front of Tyrion. Ned didn’t escape and neither should have Jamie.

2) I’m worried the super group is going to do something super stupid that lets the whitewalkers get south of the wall. Something like this happening has been foreshadowed ever since Bran let the Night’s King touch him in a vision. I’m not a big fan of this plot device; what you are doing to stop it is what caused it.

3) Can the Night’s King warg like Bran? If so, could he just take control of the dragons? Are the Night’s King and Bran going to have a mental power off?

4) I’m thinking Qyburn put some demon child in Cersei.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Another really enjoyable episode, just wish we were getting more. The series shines in character interaction, and I feel like a lot of it is getting skipped behind the scenes. Tyrion meeting with Jaime so quickly really surprised me.

And damn I love the screen time Davos is getting this season. Great character.

I'm loving the season but it feels like it's on Fast Forward and I wish we were given more time to smell the roses as this is like a mad dash to the finish line.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I'm not one to complain to much about this show but I kind of found it lame how Bronn and Jamie just popped out of the water after everyone left. Jamie Lannister just tried to kill Daenerys and she just picks up and walk away with her dragon after seeing him tossed into the water next to them? Surely she would have had the dragon boil that water to ensure they don't come out? Also how long can these men hold their breaths? That seen was a little too much Fast & Furious for me.

How did Dany know it was jaime Lannister. She has never seen him. The scene happened very fast to her. She probably figured it was some random knight. also, probably thought he drowned or was incinerated.

It also doesn't make sense for them to start combing the place for all stragglers. They made their point, defeated an army, and captured the ones closest to the battleground.

She made her statement, now GTFO

[Oling_Roachinen]

Except Tyrion knew it was Jaime. You just saw your brother nearly get incinerated and then potentially drown in the river and don't bother to even wait the 2 minutes required to see if he comes up for air? Have one of the thousands of minions go and look for his body?

And he somehow knew Jaime was alive anyways as he wanted to get that secret meeting.

None of that really made sense. It's almost like there was a last minute change and originally Jaime and Tyrion were to meet at the battlefield, perhaps they didn't want the Kingslayer to meet Daenarys so soon, or they didn't want Tyrion betray Daenarys and let Jaime flee from the battle, but it probably would have flowed better.

[Tinordi]

The more time you think about what the characters are doing in this season the more you realize that none of it makes any sense.

Lets get this straight for a second: Danaerys sees Jamie frickin Lannister charging at her and then get thrown into the river. Next you see Jamie and Bronn resurface safely away from all of the forces.

Wait what?

Capturing Jamie Lannister would have been the greatest prize of the battle. The entire dothraki army would have been scouring the river for him. Instead, it's just conveniently forgotten and we go on to roast the Tarlys. Makes no sense. I guess maybe they thought he died at the bottom of the river? If so why not spend a line of dialogue to explain that? Otherwise we're left feeling totally confused.

Then the expeditionary force. Just so dumb. A king is letting his subjects twist in the wind, he needs to get back and establish that he's still alive. Not go traipsing around north of the wall. And then what? They've seen the size of the undead army. They've see its capabilities. Are they just planning on sneaking up on it? Seriously, what is the plan? Why not just fly a dragon up there and scoop a zombie up with its claws? And for what? To someone convince Cersei to not attack them? Just bizarre, beffudling decision making.

Yes yes, don't nitpick Tinordi just enjoy the show... Pretty hard to when nothing makes sense.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by Cappy

How did Dany know it was jaime Lannister. She has never seen him. The scene happened very fast to her. She probably figured it was some random knight. also, probably thought he drowned or was incinerated.

It also doesn't make sense for them to start combing the place for all stragglers. They made their point, defeated an army, and captured the ones closest to the battleground.

She made her statement, now GTFO

She was also dealing with a dragon that had just got a spear in the throat. Not exactly " Everyone hunt for 1 guy who is probably dead at the bottom of this lake!" moment.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Tinordi you're right, those two things are pretty glaring holes. You just generally seem devoid of happiness so even your legitimate complaints are sometimes treated with suspicion.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

She was also dealing with a dragon that had just got a spear in the throat. Not exactly " Everyone hunt for 1 guy who is probably dead at the bottom of this lake!" moment.

What about Tyrion then? Does he think his brother's dead? We don't know, because he doesn't mention it.

Wouldn't he want to find his brother or his brother's corpse? We don't know.

He has a moment of protectiveness to his brother when he charges the dragon and then he just forgets about him?

Oh and nevermind, Tyrion's back in King's Landing talking with Jamie! It's all water under the bridge!

[Kybosh]

[Knut]

I assume one of little birdies Varys has tells them that Jamie is still alive and has arrived back at Kings landing.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

The more time you think about what the characters are doing in this season the more you realize that none of it makes any sense.

Lets get this straight for a second: Danaerys sees Jamie frickin Lannister charging at her and then get thrown into the river. Next you see Jamie and Bronn resurface safely away from all of the forces.

Wait what?

Capturing Jamie Lannister would have been the greatest prize of the battle. The entire dothraki army would have been scouring the river for him. Instead, it's just conveniently forgotten and we go on to roast the Tarlys. Makes no sense. I guess maybe they thought he died at the bottom of the river? If so why not spend a line of dialogue to explain that? Otherwise we're left feeling totally confused.

Then the expeditionary force. Just so dumb. A king is letting his subjects twist in the wind, he needs to get back and establish that he's still alive. Not go traipsing around north of the wall. And then what? They've seen the size of the undead army. They've see its capabilities. Are they just planning on sneaking up on it? Seriously, what is the plan? Why not just fly a dragon up there and scoop a zombie up with its claws? And for what? To someone convince Cersei to not attack them? Just bizarre, beffudling decision making.

Yes yes, don't nitpick Tinordi just enjoy the show... Pretty hard to when nothing makes sense.

I get the impression that they were significantly downriver from where he fell into the water. It's likely that Bronn knew the area very well and knew where a safe place to resurface and escape would be.

The only one who would have been able to potentially find Jaime, would have been Dany herself, on dragon back. Whether or not it was prudent for her to spend a couple of hours scouring a river bank at that time, was up to the individual circumstances of the battle/post battle.

I actually didn't mind the whole escape by river thing as muchas the Euron being everywhere at once storylines.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by blankall

I get the impression that they were significantly downriver from where he fell into the water. It's likely that Bronn knew the area very well and knew where a safe place to resurface and escape would be.

The only one who would have been able to potentially find Jaime, would have been Dany herself, on dragon back. Whether or not it was prudent for her to spend a couple of hours scouring a river bank at that time, was up to the individual circumstances of the battle/post battle.

I actually didn't mind the whole escape by river thing as muchas the Euron being everywhere at once storylines.

Again though, why not just explain these things a bit better. Opening of the show, "We couldn't find Jamie's body Khaleesi."

Instead, it's writing by affectation. Tyrion cares about his brother for the "drama." Next episode, doesn't care because no drama.

Jon Snow needs to be in some action sequences, so lets write a ridiculous story line to achieve that.

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

What about Tyrion then? Does he think his brother's dead? We don't know, because he doesn't mention it.

Wouldn't he want to find his brother or his brother's corpse? We don't know.

He has a moment of protectiveness to his brother when he charges the dragon and then he just forgets about him?

Oh and nevermind, Tyrion's back in King's Landing talking with Jamie! It's all water under the bridge!

I assumed that Tyrion and Dany were perfectly fine with letting him get away and tell Cersei how scary the dragons are, and try to talk her into submitting.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

I assumed that Tyrion and Dany were perfectly fine with letting him get away and tell Cersei how scary the dragons are, and try to talk her into submitting.

Wha?

Yes that's much more valuable than capturing him.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Varys little bird's couldn't be trusted to find Jaime when he was moving an entire army to Highgarden though!

That's not really important though, the more important part was the immediate aftermath. Either Tyrion would have thought Jaime was dead, which would have been the most character defying sequence of his story, moreso than Shae, moreso than Tywin, or Tyrion would have known Jaime to be alive, in which case the Dothraki should have been looking for him at the riverbanks.

Heck, the Dothraki should have been looking for soldiers trying to escape the battle regardless. It's common tactics to know how and where soldiers would attempt to flee. With Daenerys clearing looking to capture and have the soldiers bend the knee, that should have been discussed prior to the attack.

Meh, plot armor. But it's lazy writing when they need to so blatantly use it.

[GoinAllTheWay]

So how many episodes do we have left for this season?

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Tinordi you're right, those two things are pretty glaring holes. You just generally seem devoid of happiness so even your legitimate complaints are sometimes treated with suspicion.

"Suspicion" isn't the word I would have chosen, but I agree with your sentiment.

[djsFlames]

But Tyrion somehow knew for certain afterwards that Jamie was fine when he brought up that he would use him to get to Cersei later at the dragon round table.

That's a huge leap/gap. Did Tyrion just decide to withhold the fact that Jamie (who killed her father) was present, and just hoped that neither Dany nor any of her army recognized the guy that was charging at her? I guess so.

I guess we're left to believe that Bronn and Jamie swam/drifted underwater for however many minutes to get to the other side of the lake and come up out of view of the army, meanwhile they assumed the two were dead.

These things are why the accelerated timeline is hurting things a little. We're used to GOT giving an attention to detail and showing us how most of everything unfolded. Now we're being left to make our own assumptions and I can see why it would be a bit off putting for many.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Again though, why not just explain these things a bit better. Opening of the show, "We couldn't find Jamie's body Khaleesi."

Instead, it's writing by affectation. Tyrion cares about his brother for the "drama." Next episode, doesn't care because no drama.

Jon Snow needs to be in some action sequences, so lets write a ridiculous story line to achieve that.

I don't really see it is all that big of a deal. The battlefield itself was massive and smoldering. The fact you couldn't see any of that from the river banks shows how far they must have traveled.

Also Dany is in a very weird and impetuous state of mind. She's also never seen Jaime Lannister, and may not have known he was even at the battle. Tyrion seems to be purposely withholding information from her at this point. Dany may not even be all that aware of who Jaime is or what his influence is. Why would she just assume that a key Lannister commander would be present with some random grain caravan.

If Tyrion did disclose to Dany that Jaime, Cersei's brother, was at the battle, her only reaction would be to demand tribute or burn him alive. That's not going to help anyone, and Tyrion isn't going to say anything to Dany about Jaime.

[ernie]

It's a bit disappointing that they seem to be glossing over the details on how meetings etc are getting set up. On the other hand we've had a half dozen seasons of knowing that the players left in this game have numerous information sources. There is also a geography convenience for much of what is happening around Dragonstone and King's Landing (and armies returning to King's Landing).

I'm not shocked that a secret meeting between Tyrion and Jaime was organized...it was bound to happen once Tyrion was back on Westeros soil. And Bronn is the common contact for the two. He's also a guy not really loyal to anything let alone a throne or monarch. The only loyalty he has shown is to Tyrion and Jaime and honestly those relationships last precisely long enough until Bronn feels it is no longer moving him ahead in the world (dumping Tyrion for a cushy marriage promise and castle). Bronn keeps his options open when things look bleak. The Lannister army just got routed and barbecued. They are plummeting down this weeks Power rankings. Bronn sees this and does a solid for the team on the rise....

The intriguing thing to me was Littlefinger and Arya. I can't help but think Arya is the one playing Littlefinger in all of this. Robb saw through the letter and Arya is a good deal smarter and experienced than Robb.