Official (Alberta) Oil Discussion Thread

[peter12]

Originally Posted by SebC

I doubt they or their supporters would see it that way.

The BC NDP knew their law wouldn't stand up, they passed it anyways and pushed it as far as they could through the courts to vexate the project and put on a show for their supporters. And the subset of supporters that show was for think the apocalypse will come if Alberta bitumen reaches tidewater, so to them anything and everything should be tried to prevent that, and it's the law that is wrong now.

Speaking from the BC side, I really can't say for sure how the electorate will take it. Probably minimal. I do think the integrity of the Attorney General's office has been somewhat compromised but hey, that isn't new in this day and age.

[DiracSpike]

The deliberation time says it all, BC had no chance on this one. They were basically challenging one of the core tenets of the constitution with disengenuous arguments about problems with Bitumen specifically, with the overhanging fact that the government who initiated the suit is on record as willing to do anything possible to stop the project. It's good that it was dismissed, better than the other way, but this had no chance and the most important thing is pipe in the ground with oil flowing to the coast which we're still two years away from. It's not even the biggest challenge remaining, the continuing suits about FN consultations before the FCA are much more of a wildcard given how undefined the consulation processes are.

We're still a long way from being to claim victory and finally get fair value for our resources. The WTI-WCS spread is out to $25 dollars now, $10 more than when curtailment was announced and the highest since it disastrously blew out in 2018. Mexico and other resource-competent countries get to sell their comparable heavy crude for $52 while ours sells for $35, and we're going to have to take that punishment until TMX is finished, which is minimum two years away IF all these suits continue to get quashed, which they could not. One hurdle is cleared but many still remain, and tripping on just one of them brings us back to square one and extends the timeline of Canadians getting ####ed over on value for our finite non-renewable resources.

[CaptainCrunch]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1218934884741394434


What comes next

Lionel Hutz: Don't worry, Homer. I have a fool proof strategy to get you out of here: surprise witnesses, each more surprising than the last. I tell you, the judge won't know what hit him!

[GGG]

The government canceling the rail deal is hurting $18-$20 cost for rail could have helped
Produce more barrels under curtailment.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

https://twitter.com/user/status/1218934884741394434


What comes next

Bust a move?

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

Bust a move?

Elizabeth May vs Jason Kenney dance off.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Elizabeth May vs Jason Kenney dance off.

An unnecessary, non-consensual and wholly undesired expenditure of energy to just hasten the already unfathomable warming of our planet.

[bizaro86]

Minnesota Public Utilities gave Enbridge their certificate of public necessity to replace line 3. I think that is the last thing they need to go ahead with that.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/minne...212208135.html

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Minnesota Public Utilities gave Enbridge their certificate of public necessity to replace line 3. I think that is the last thing they need to go ahead with that.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/minne...212208135.html

Good news for sure. Hopefully Enbridge could get that done this year, they only need to do the stretch in Minnesota as an updated pipeline is already in service in Canada and Wisconsin. It was only this time last year that Enbridge was saying this would be done by Q4 2019, so besides being yet another example of the ridiculous delays facing any project relating to Canada, it’s hopefully some data that this could be done this year.

This was a good step but tomorrow is the big one, the FCA ruling on TMX. Who knows what direction that could go, hopefully three random judges don’t condemn an entire region to be economically hamstrung on the disingenuous law suits of bad faith obstructionists. But we’ll see.

[Slava]

FCA dismissed the challenge, and the pipeline is a go!

(The Liberals of course bought it to kill it, and it will never happen though...)

Heres the link to the decision: https://decisions.fca-caf.gc.ca/fca-...60815/index.do

In particular, section 86 stresses that consultation does not equate to a veto. This was the last legal challenge and a major hurdle cleared.

[Tacopuck]

Somebody call Subway and get them to double their meat order!

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by Slava

FCA dismissed the challenge, and the pipeline is a go!

(The Liberals of course bought it to kill it, and it will never happen though...)

Heres the link to the decision: https://decisions.fca-caf.gc.ca/fca-...60815/index.do

In particular, section 86 stresses that consultation does not equate to a veto. This was the last legal challenge and a major hurdle cleared.

It's technically not the last, the obstructionists have 60 days to appeal to the Supreme Court, which they will. They've gone this far and have plenty of money from their American environmentalist friends to further their obstruction efforts so that will happen. So we can sweat out that decision sometime later, as well as any other suits these groups can throw against a wall in the two years it will take to get this thing built.

But yeah, it's a good step and positive development. Credit to the Trudeau Government for satisfying the consultation requirements. Hopefully they keep fighting the fight against further suits and civil disobedience because this decision and all the money spent so far mean nothing unless there's pipe in the ground flowing oil to the coast ASAP.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

It's technically not the last, the obstructionists have 60 days to appeal to the Supreme Court, which they will. They've gone this far and have plenty of money from their American environmentalist friends to further their obstruction efforts so that will happen. So we can sweat out that decision sometime later, as well as any other suits these groups can throw against a wall in the two years it will take to get this thing built.

But yeah, it's a good step and positive development. Credit to the Trudeau Government for satisfying the consultation requirements. Hopefully they keep fighting the fight against further suits and civil disobedience because this decision and all the money spent so far mean nothing unless there's pipe in the ground flowing oil to the coast ASAP.

Yeah they could appeal of course, but it's still a big deal. I do like that there is some fairly strong language there and while I think that this should have been a foregone conclusion, it still is meaningful.

As far as the civil disobedience goes, there's not much that can be done to halt that. These people are effectively radicals, so they're going to be problematic regardless of whether the courts and every legal body is aligned to allow construction.

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by Slava

Yeah they could appeal of course, but it's still a big deal. I do like that there is some fairly strong language there and while I think that this should have been a foregone conclusion, it still is meaningful.

As far as the civil disobedience goes, there's not much that can be done to halt that. These people are effectively radicals, so they're going to be problematic regardless of whether the courts and every legal body is aligned to allow construction.

Oh for sure, it's a great development and this was definitely the biggest challenge to the pipeline that we know of. It's just that this is one battle and not the war, the reality on the ground is the differential is still $20 and we're two years away, best case, from not getting ass ####ed any more. I have no problem giving Trudeau's government props for getting the pipeline through this hoop, I hope they can continue to guide it through the hoops upcoming.

[burn_this_city]

Vexatious litigants on the hook for court costs.

[Oling_Roachinen]

I'll believe it once it's constructed and has been piping oil for 15 years.

[CaptainCrunch]

This is important

https://twitter.com/user/status/1224755674199908352

[Oling_Roachinen]

It's not that important as it's been decided on time and time again, including in the last FCA decision. They've always emphasized there was no veto, just meaningful two-way consultation required.

[Fuzzy14]

Had a pretty good giggle when I read at para. 84 that this is the end of the decision here as we've met the requirements under Vavilov but we're gonna spend 150+ paragraphs now addressing things we're not required to in order to dispel any ideas that we didn't listen.

[Fuzz]

oh good, they are appealing to the Supreme Court...."This is not over".