2017/2018 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Be honest. When Gio was Dougie's age, did you see him becoming Gio? Because I remember before we traded Bouwmeester reading post after post about how Gio wasn't a true #1. I wrote a bunch of them. I remember when Gio went to Russia - 'don't let the door hit you on the way to the gulag' was how that went. Nobody expected him to even come back, let alone become a franchise player and "culture setter" as Treliving called him.

Hamilton has shown himself to be exceptionally capable in all situations. He has physical tools Gio can only dream of. He's 24, and yes, he's going to make $9M on his next contract. I can promise, no team in the league would regret having 28-33 year old Dougie Hamilton at $9M.

Johnny doesn't wear a letter, and he probably never will. I don't believe Doughty wore an A full time or at all in either of the Kings championship seasons. Between Gio, Monahan, Tkachuk, Hamonic, Backlund, I'm not seeing the need for Dougie to be some Messier type. Especially not at 24.

Here's the ultimate problem with trading Hamilton. It makes everything worse. It makes the power play worse because Gio and Brodie aren't as good offensively as Dougie. It makes the top pairing worse because Gio/Dougie >>> Brodano. It doesn't do anything to hurt the PK since Dougie doesn't play on it, but it also deprives you of Dougie freaking Hamilton as your reserve PKer when a RHD takes a penalty.

Brodie is expendable; Hamilton is not.

I see a flaw in your first statement as it is not really comparing apples to apples. Gio was an indrafted player and Dougie was a top 10 pick. Many people are saying Sam Bennett is a huge bust but the they are also excited that Spencer Foo (who is 2 years older than Sam) has potential to be a top 6 forward. Gio was clearly a late bloomer.

Dougie has not proven to be capable on theboenalty kill so he is not an all situations type guy. The Brodie-Gio pairing was extremely elite and consider the fact they had fantastic numbers when the rest of the team had horrendous possession metrics. Gio and Dougie are an elite pairing but Gulutzan made the Flames as a whole a strong possession team.

Flames have Andersson who will not replace Hamilton but will step in as a RHD and has shown great offensive ability in junior and pro. Somwhile the Flames have 4 very intriguing D prospects they lack the same potential up front.

Yes Brodie is an expendable piece but I am not convinced he will return the type of impact forward the Flames need and that is the crux of my arguement. I want the Flames to consider moving Dougie if they can get the right return for a 25 year old top pair D with size and can shoot right. If Treliving trades Hamilton for less than he is worth I will be pissed.

[Monahammer]

Dougie for EK and a small +?

[Heavy Jack]

Dougie for Ekman .. no thanks; Hamilton could easily surpass OEL and is at an amazing cap hit for 3 more years. I’d rather spend 8 + mill on a top RW or Center option.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

You don’t know that so don’t pretend that you do

Jeebus, must every obvious opinion be preceded by “IMO”? Obviously I don’t know it. But the number of IFAs that go to someone other than the highest bidder is extremely small. Even a guy like Stone who really wanted to come back to Calgary didn’t take a discount.

In my opinion UFAs like Tavares become UFAs to test the market. Having done so they take the money. Other factors are secondary and (IMO again) the main one is lifestyle for a guy like Tavares or most other vets. Picking a cup winner is too much of a crapshoot (ask Iginla).

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

Dougie for Ekman .. no thanks; Hamilton could easily surpass OEL and is at an amazing cap hit for 3 more years. I’d rather spend 8 + mill on a top RW or Center option.

I assume "EK" is supposed to be Erik Karlsson.

[Monahammer]

Definitely was talking about Erik Karlsson

I think they add because of contract and age. We obviously get the better player but he's going to cost twice as much, at least.

[Vinny01]

If the Flames trade Dougie I don’t think it should be for another Dman. If the Flames trade someone from their top 4 they need to address the glaring hole in the top 6 either at centre or with a right shot wing.

So pretending the Eklund rumor is true and there have been RoR for Hamilton talks that does make some sense but based on age and contract the Sabres need to add to that. I would think the 32nd pick AND Nylander would be iof interest if they were looking at that deal. The Flames add a 1b centre which slides Backlund down to the third line (improves the bottom 6), they get a fairly high pick which is needed, and get a right shot prospect that is young and has potential.

If they move him it needs to fill some big holes as moving him creates a hole but one I think can be filled somewhat.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

If the Flames trade Dougie I don’t think it should be for another Dman. If the Flames trade someone from their top 4 they need to address the glaring hole in the top 6 either at centre or with a right shot wing.

So pretending the Eklund rumor is true and there have been RoR for Hamilton talks that does make some sense but based on age and contract the Sabres need to add to that. I would think the 32nd pick AND Nylander would be iof interest if they were looking at that deal. The Flames add a 1b centre which slides Backlund down to the third line (improves the bottom 6), they get a fairly high pick which is needed, and get a right shot prospect that is young and has potential.

If they move him it needs to fill some big holes as moving him creates a hole but one I think can be filled somewhat.

What makes you think Nylander is a 1B centre? He hasn't played much C at all. Mostly RW. He played, I think, about 7 games at C when Matthews was injured, with a fairly wide mix of linemates - Marner, Marleau, Hyman, Brown and Kapanen.

[Jacks]

What makes you think Nylander is a 1B centre? He hasn't played much C at all. Mostly RW. He played, I think, about 7 games at C when Matthews was injured, with a fairly wide mix of linemates - Marner, Marleau, Hyman, Brown and Kapanen.

I think Vinny was referring to ROR as the 2nd line centre. Also, BUF has the other Nylander.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

What makes you think Nylander is a 1B centre? He hasn't played much C at all. Mostly RW. He played, I think, about 7 games at C when Matthews was injured, with a fairly wide mix of linemates - Marner, Marleau, Hyman, Brown and Kapanen.

Yeah i was off the Leafs there and addressing the “rumor” that the Flames and Sabres were talking RoR and Hamilton. I was saying if the Sabres add Nylander and the 32nd pick it makes the deal one to look at. I would not be pleased if it was one for one as I value Hamilton more than just RoR. The only way one for one works is if the Sabres retained significantly and even the. I don’t reallylike it without more pieces coming to the Flames

[Weitz]

Lucic could be coveted by a team that wants to have a high cap, but lower actual salary. After July 1 he is only paid $4.5 mill a year on the average. Savings of $7.5 million could be looked at by a team like Carolina.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Lucic could be coveted by a team that wants to have a high cap, but low actual salary. After July 1 he is only paid $4.5 mill a year on the average.

I think Edmonton still needs to retain as Lucic is not worth $4.5M. With the emphasis on speed he is looking pretty useless out there. The sense is the Oilers are confident they can move him but at what price?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Yeah i was off the Leafs there and addressing the “rumor” that the Flames and Sabres were talking RoR and Hamilton. I was saying if the Sabres add Nylander and the 32nd pick it makes the deal one to look at. I would not be pleased if it was one for one as I value Hamilton more than just RoR. The only way one for one works is if the Sabres retained significantly and even the. I don’t reallylike it without more pieces coming to the Flames

Oh, that Nylander. ROR does have a hefty contract, but he's a proven 1B-2 C.
I don't mind a deal with the Sabres around ROR, but I am not impressed with Nylander's AHL numbers and his NHL looks haven't shown much. He's bordering on being a bust as an 8th pick, though I suppose at 19 he might still come through. At the beginning of the season I would have suggested adding Reinhart but I think the Sabres wouldn't do that now.

Thing is - do the Sabres even want a defenceman now? They have Risto, they are getting Dahlin. Falk, McCabe and Scandella aren't horrible. Bogosian may have a comeback year - I'm not sure of his status.

[Toonage]

Sabres have just 2 RHD (I believe).

Flames would lose points from the back end but ROR replaces those easily (assuming he hits career averages).

If the Flames feel like they have to move Hamilton for whatever reason, or feel that they need to upgrade down the middle to move forward etc this would be the likeliest move from my point of view.

Obligatory disclaimer - I don't want to see Hamilton moved

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Sabres have just 2 RHD (I believe).

They have Risto, Bogosian, Nelson, Tennyson and Redmond who are RH. Obviously only one of those is a major player right now. But with Hamilton, do you perhaps underutilize Risto? Or his he only a 3?

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

They have Risto, Bogosian, Nelson, Tennyson and Redmond who are RH. Obviously only one of those is a major player right now. But with Hamilton, do you perhaps underutilize Risto? Or his he only a 3?

You could do worse than Ristolainen on your 2nd pairing. Or Hamilton for that matter.

Also worth noting that Bogosian hasn't played a full season in forever.

I'm just trying to connect some dots, and this deal makes some sense. Do I think it will happen? No.

[Saqe]

I don't understand why it's so inconceivable to consider trading Hamilton.

If you can bring in a 60-70 point forward it will result in a net positive change in offense for a team that's starving for offense. And if someone thinks Hamilton should be kept for his defense then I don't know what to say. It's not like he's Chris Pronger back there.

Then you can put Brodie back with Gio, who can carry Brodie on his back if needed to.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Definitely was talking about Erik Karlsson

I think they add because of contract and age. We obviously get the better player but he's going to cost twice as much, at least.

If you think the add would come from the Senators side I don't know what to say. Karlsson is a generational D man. Even given contract status he is worth more because you don't deal for him unless you know you can sign him. Age is not a factor either, he is still south of 30.

[Roof-Daddy]

Yeah, in a deal where we swap Hamilton for Karlsson, it's the Flames adding for sure.

However, I don't think it should be as much as much of an add as most probably would.

IMO Hamilton would eat into a lot of the value Karlsson has by himself, as he's a big young cost controlled RH shooting offensive Dman and would be a pretty good replacement for the Sens to get with Karlsson gone.

[wingmaker]

Originally Posted by Saqe

I don't understand why it's so inconceivable to consider trading Hamilton.

If you can bring in a 60-70 point forward it will result in a net positive change in offense for a team that's starving for offense. And if someone thinks Hamilton should be kept for his defense then I don't know what to say. It's not like he's Chris Pronger back there.

Then you can put Brodie back with Gio, who can carry Brodie on his back if needed to.

Because for a team starved for offence, trading your top point getter on defence just doesn't make sense. 60 -70 point winger for a 40 - 50 point defence man with room to push above 50 points is not a substantive upgrade. They need to add offence to the offensive players that are working on the team, not subtract offensive players to get marginally better offensive players. Also, having offence from the blue line diversifies your offence. If all of your offence is tied up in two top lines, you become very easy to shut down. If you add an offensive player to the top six while keeping some punch from the blue line in Gio and Dougie, now you are talking about upgrading the team. But trading one for the other is just not enough.