Cycling Thread 2

[KTrain]

I've stopped doing the public Zwift races because of this. I try not to take it seriously but it would still be nice to have a chance at coming in a decent position. They've made some changes when you join to give you warnings about the level of race you're supposed to be in based on your past rides.

When I have raced, I connected to Zwift Power and checked the rankings there because they take things like HR, w/kg, etc into consideration. They also DQ people who have power ratings outside the group level parameters.

[RichieRich]

It's nice doing the odd ride from bottom of Home Road into Downtown and turning around at the zoo to return. Hardly any riders now, paths are mostly clear (odd patch of ice, but hey that's what lower pressure, studded tires, and keeping your line are for), and it's nice to be outside. I might not be taking a Zwift beating, but really there's no substitute IMO for actually riding outside.

[squiggs96]

Originally Posted by KTrain

I've stopped doing the public Zwift races because of this. I try not to take it seriously but it would still be nice to have a chance at coming in a decent position. They've made some changes when you join to give you warnings about the level of race you're supposed to be in based on your past rides.

When I have raced, I connected to Zwift Power and checked the rankings there because they take things like HR, w/kg, etc into consideration. They also DQ people who have power ratings outside the group level parameters.

Cyclists in the real world: Yeah, my FTP is around 300 watts and I’m definitely a P 1/2 racer. (Gets dusted up every hill and dropped in the crits)
Cyclists on Zwift: I weigh 125 pounds and my FTP is only 200 watts. (Wins Cat D race by 5 minutes).

I do the Zwift power thing as well. The issue is most of the big cheaters aren’t on ZP. It’s definitely not as satisfying to finish 9th on Zwift and then see you were 2nd on ZP.

[Icantwhisper]

Zwift is a training tool, the intensity of the races on Zwift is enough to promote fitness gains, cutting it out of your training probably isn't doing you any favours.
Structured training programs are good, but racing where the surges are random and you have to adjust the pace changes on the fly are quite helpful.

[stazzy33]

Was going to try and get out on my new bike today (the weather has been warm enough to melt most the snow in the bike lanes) but then it went and snowed overnight. I might still try to make a go of it this afternoon, but eff you Edmonton.

[KTrain]

Originally Posted by Icantwhisper

Zwift is a training tool, the intensity of the races on Zwift is enough to promote fitness gains, cutting it out of your training probably isn't doing you any favours.
Structured training programs are good, but racing where the surges are random and you have to adjust the pace changes on the fly are quite helpful.

I do a weekly race series on Zwift with some local guys (Calgary, Edmonton, Kelowna, etc). It's definitely the best workout I get each week. Really forces you to push yourself and the competitive nature kicks in when you're up against the same people every week. The organizer is great in that it's 21 weeks long and he has points for GC, Sprint segments and KOMs.

[Icantwhisper]

Originally Posted by KTrain

I do a weekly race series on Zwift with some local guys (Calgary, Edmonton, Kelowna, etc). It's definitely the best workout I get each week. Really forces you to push yourself and the competitive nature kicks in when you're up against the same people every week. The organizer is great in that it's 21 weeks long and he has points for GC, Sprint segments and KOMs.

Agreed, there is another local series through Ridley's, everyone knows each other so an 80KG rider can't claim to be 65KG without getting called out. Works out almost identical to real life results against the same riders.

[squiggs96]

I signed up for a three month program with the coach of our team. During race season he'll come out to races and watch us, ride in the pack (it's embarrassing that we are all going full out and he is just on a casual ride laughing at us), and then give us a debrief about the race. He'll also set up semi-custom off season training plans. We can also pay to do his customized program, which I started yesterday. He does baseline training, then gives customized workouts, meets with me once per week to review the week, goes over past training data, rides with me outside once per month, and goes over nutrition.

The first step was going to his lab and doing a ramp test like workout. It's five minutes on a trainer at a constant power with one minute rest in between. I was wearing a HRM plus sensors on my thighs, one on my right shoulder, and one on my right butt cheek. The sensors on me measure oxygen levels. It was really neat to see that as the intensity went up, my heart rate went up, and the oxygen was sucked from my legs, then as the intensity kept increasing it started being sucked from my butt and shoulder.

What he really liked was that even when my HR hit 175 I was very composed in the saddle. My form was still good. I wasn't rocking. I wasn't panicking and I held 175-180 HR for an entire 5 minute interval when most would have stopped. Where he thought I was terrible was in the lower ranges. He said my form wasn't good at all in it and I wasted a lot of effort. He said I haven't done enough training at the Z1 Z2 levels, so that is what a lot of my work will be in this program. He says my top end is exceptional but I have not chance to use it because I burn out before I get there and other racers will have way more left in the tank at the end.

We also went over my diet and nutrition. He asked why I didn't eat any fat. He kept asking me if I ate a bunch of different foods, but the only really fatty thing I eat regularly is cheese. I have iced cream a couple times a month, but that's it. We talked about how food fuels you for different activities, and my diet is really good for race days and peaking, but needs more thought into long term training. What I heard was I should eat way more ice cream and blame him when I get fat.

The goal of this program is to be in substantially better cycling shape at the end of May than I am now, maintain that through the summer, and hope there is a fall racing season. I am posting this here if anyone is interested on the process and to also hold myself publicly accountable. Also, in a more important way, this is why my Zwift and Strava rides will have so much less power than KTrain's rides. My coach told me to do less, so that's also my built in excuse!

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by RichieRich

(odd patch of ice, but hey that's what lower pressure, studded tires, and keeping your line are for)

That sounds backwards to me. Low pressure is great for snow to get a bigger footprint to float on top of the snow due to more rubber contact, but on ice you usually want higher pressures so that you get less rubber contact (useless on ice) and more pressure on your stud contact (so they bite in).

[RichieRich]

Originally Posted by Bill Bumface

That sounds backwards to me. Low pressure is great for snow to get a bigger footprint to float on top of the snow due to more rubber contact, but on ice you usually want higher pressures so that you get less rubber contact (useless on ice) and more pressure on your stud contact (so they bite in).

Really everyone has their own unique set of riding skills, routes, and experiences. Our Calgary river valley is super easy compared to the first "bench" which would be just up the hill like around Market Mall elevation up to about John Laurie (Edgemont area or Crowfoot). Higher elevations are another ballgame and most commuters don't experience that nastiness - both conditions but also crap snow clearing and poor road shoulders.

I've been riding year-round for ~15+ years in Calgary, from the far NW into downtown including through winter snow, sneet, hail, snain, rain, etc and some truly horrific conditions that never even appear down in the river valley. Since my commute is ~20km each way I have to balance efficiency, weight, grip, etc... Some years I haven't even used studded tires... but those years I tend to run 2.2" tires but at a lower pressure... yes they float better but on the brown sugar-snow they float around too much. Generally though because of the larger contact patch they'll run slower but grip better. Except on nastier hard-ice when they get more washy due to ridges. So now I tend to run my 2"'ish tires on the back, usually a Schalbe snow stud tire which has side-mounted studs. So if I want better grip... slightly less pressure gives studs ground contact, plus a bigger contact patch. When snow/ice gone then up the pressure goes.

For the front overall my multi-year experience has shown that the side-mounted studs do not work for me... see note above again about crazy far NW Calgary conditions. I had a brilliant Hakkapolita but can't get those in Canada anymore so I've been using a 45Nrth Gravdal for last couple of years. The Hakka has moved to my gravel bike rear tire and the Gravdal does dual duty on my '07 commuter or gravel bike when used as winter commuter. The Gravdal is a good intermediate width of I think 40mm that cuts through most snow down to the harder pack, or ice, or road. Since the studs are both in the middle and sides it handles ruts much better and so rarely washes out, but does if I'm running too high a pressure. I've gone through about 5-6 studded tires and the gravdal has been the best for me, for commuting.

Yes I've used the crazy Schwalbe Ice Spikers which are by far the best studded tire I've ever used (I haven't done fat biking), but the sound of buzzing bees and velcro-like heavy tires was too much for me.

[Bill Bumface]

Kind of weird to flex on people that commute "only" on the river paths.

Even on a fat bike you want to raise your pressures if you're riding on glare ice. It's physics. For really rough ice, sure things change, but that stuff is also just miserable to ride on any 2" tire.

[RichieRich]

Originally Posted by Bill Bumface

Kind of weird to flex on people that commute "only" on the river paths.

Even on a fat bike you want to raise your pressures if you're riding on glare ice. It's physics. For really rough ice, sure things change, but that stuff is also just miserable to ride on any 2" tire.

Certainly was not a "flex" at all. A statement of fact from my experience of riding 15+ years going all 4 seasons. I know several folks that ride 25mm tires along the river valley year round... definitely not possible at the higher elevations I mentioned. The effectiveness of increased or reduced pressure totally depends on the surface ridden, rubber flex, and where the studs are actually located.

[KTrain]

And now for something completely different.

Adidas is releasing an SPD compatible sneaker that would be great for commutes, pub rides or heading out with the family.

Though I do find it funny that they're advertising these on pedals that could just be flipped over and rode with normal shoes.

[Fuzz]

Is that cleat pocket deep enough to prevent the clickety clacketing? I've got a pair of Specialized shoes that are just great for walking in.

[KTrain]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Is that cleat pocket deep enough to prevent the clickety clacketing? I've got a pair of Specialized shoes that are just great for walking in.

Good question. We'll probably have to wait for some "real world" reviews. They're not on the Adidas Canada site yet so they might not make it to North America (at least Canada) soon.

[MikeMc]

Originally Posted by KTrain

I've stopped doing the public Zwift races because of this. I try not to take it seriously but it would still be nice to have a chance at coming in a decent position. They've made some changes when you join to give you warnings about the level of race you're supposed to be in based on your past rides.

When I have raced, I connected to Zwift Power and checked the rankings there because they take things like HR, w/kg, etc into consideration. They also DQ people who have power ratings outside the group level parameters.

Thats the hard part with Zwift for sure. I want the competition side of it but I don't feel all are playing it on the level.

I'm relatively new to the cycling world and with Covid/winter I've jumped in head first. I feel I've improved a ton already - but when i get in some of these races which should be within my w/kg tier - I just get smoked.

Like you're a C tier and you're just hammering out 5.0 for kms at a time. Come on.

[Icantwhisper]

I think we have to remember that the categories are based on your FTP which is the power for 60mins, as most zwift races are 30-45 mins the power should be higher with surges that as meant to separate the field.
All that being said there are the odd riders that make you wonder, I just think they're fewer than is being claimed here.
Besides the best way to get faster is to chase people faster than you and there is always someone faster.

[Ryan Coke]

However zwift power will bump you up into higher categories based on shorter races. Of course putting out a certain power for a 20 minute race is different than a 60+ minute race, yet zwift power ends up using those shorter rides to determine your category based on a simple watts per kilo number.

I find as opposed to specifically worrying about winning, I just like to go a “comfortably hard” pace and fine a group that is similar to draft with, then try to out sprint at the end. I have fun, and get a good workout, and try not to worry too much about the final results with so many variables.

[Icantwhisper]

Originally Posted by Ryan Coke

However zwift power will bump you up into higher categories based on shorter races. Of course putting out a certain power for a 20 minute race is different than a 60+ minute race, yet zwift power ends up using those shorter rides to determine your category based on a simple watts per kilo number.

I find as opposed to specifically worrying about winning, I just like to go a “comfortably hard” pace and fine a group that is similar to draft with, then try to out sprint at the end. I have fun, and get a good workout, and try not to worry too much about the final results with so many variables.

Exactly, get the intensity in and enjoy the struggle to hang on, I know what my power #'s are and if I get close or beat them its a good day, way more motivation chasing someone.

[Bigtime]

What is all the power number nonsense? Am I watching Dragonball Z?

Grinding it out, outside. All the time.