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Old 08-22-2017, 03:50 PM   #3161
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Dont drag West World into this! We all know that Westeros is just a part of their bizarre theme park!!

Um....spoiler-alert?
Apparently George RR Martin pitched a crossover:

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...orge-rr-martin

Could be a way for GRRM to avoid having to do anymore work. Season 8 just begins with Dany, Jon, and Cersei all stepping outside the simulation and revealing themselves as guests.
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Old 08-22-2017, 04:33 PM   #3162
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Apparently George RR Martin pitched a crossover:

https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...orge-rr-martin

Could be a way for GRRM to avoid having to do anymore work. Season 8 just begins with Dany, Jon, and Cersei all stepping outside the simulation and revealing themselves as guests.
Oh you've got to be fataing kidding me! I was joking!!!

Apparently my random musings are Hollywood fodder.
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Old 08-22-2017, 04:39 PM   #3163
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Hold on.....I've got to write a screenplay.....you wont like it.
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Old 08-22-2017, 04:56 PM   #3164
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He was throwing them with enough velocity to reach very high in the air and with extreme accuracy. The people on that island didn't have very far to move either. He could have pegged a few off pretty easily IMO.
Yep, and not only that why wouldn't he throw the spear at the dragon Daeneyrs was riding while it was on the ground, and then have his army march in and kill off several of the the key leaders of his enemies.

War over.
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Old 08-22-2017, 05:42 PM   #3165
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In that scenario Rhaegar comes down and lets Jon board him and he knowing not to leave corpses around incinerates Drogon and rescues everyone anyway and the Night King doesn't get his Dragon.
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Old 08-22-2017, 05:48 PM   #3166
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Game of thrones is like a non-fiction version of the movie Adaptation. This is the season where Charlie Kaufman's brother takes over the writing.
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Old 08-22-2017, 05:50 PM   #3167
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So I have a theory about this season that I would like to test

If you are a book person you are more annoyed about the time jumps and fan service stuff than if you are a TV person.

I have a theory as to why if I am right but would like the data first.

For me I'm a TV person and am okay with most of this season but mildly annoyed at some parts. It has not changed my enjoyment level
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Old 08-22-2017, 05:59 PM   #3168
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I am a fan of the first three books, I strongly dislike the last two books. Which was why I was a big fan of the previous two seasons, they corrected alot of big flaws with the books.

This season is just a mess though. Shame. It's not just the timeline and geography. It's tone. The show is betraying the core themes of the series. It's almost a completely different show that just uses the same characters and setting.
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Old 08-22-2017, 06:50 PM   #3169
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I view this season as like the coles notes version of the story. Realistically, this season and next themselves could have been an 8 year show in of themselves in order to flesh things out as they have been from season 1-6.

However, the cast/crew does not want to keep going forever, so they are having to trim things significantly, where months and years are appearing to be over in a flash. I would not be surprised if in real time the story this season was taking place over the course of a full calendar year or more. They just are skipping over travel time for X to get from place a to place b. Like the guys stuck out on the island. That would have at least took 4-5 days minimum for the lake to freeze over. However, it seemed based off filming that it was 1. Simple things like that are getting glossed over.
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Old 08-22-2017, 06:52 PM   #3170
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So I have a theory about this season that I would like to test

If you are a book person you are more annoyed about the time jumps and fan service stuff than if you are a TV person.

I have a theory as to why if I am right but would like the data first.

For me I'm a TV person and am okay with most of this season but mildly annoyed at some parts. It has not changed my enjoyment level
I haven't read the books and find the time compression this season to really strain the show's credibility. I like that certain plot lines (e.g. Danaerys, Arya) seem to really be moving after so much wheel-spinning in prior seasons, but the instantaneously travel time is very detracting from the show's overall quality.
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Old 08-22-2017, 07:37 PM   #3171
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I don't mind those parts as much as the whole characters doing things that are out of character based on what was built up over several seasons or past episodes.
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Where do you see people behaving out of Character for them?

I think that's one area that they have done a very good job with.
Interesting article in Wired about episode 6. They have some good viewpoints around the characters and doing things out of character.

https://www.wired.com/story/game-of-...CNDID=23056351
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Old 08-22-2017, 07:40 PM   #3172
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So I have a theory about this season that I would like to test

If you are a book person you are more annoyed about the time jumps and fan service stuff than if you are a TV person.

I have a theory as to why if I am right but would like the data first.

For me I'm a TV person and am okay with most of this season but mildly annoyed at some parts. It has not changed my enjoyment level
I expect it is might be the opposite. Those of us who managed to trudge our way through the last two books I think many would have given up on the series, except that the first two books were so fantastic.
As a book reader I really appreciate the pace of this season. I thinks it's comical how people get upset that useless filler is removed. Reminds me of this:

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Old 08-22-2017, 07:49 PM   #3173
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Interesting article in Wired about episode 6. They have some good viewpoints around the characters and doing things out of character.

https://www.wired.com/story/game-of-...CNDID=23056351
Funny I had this same discussion a few pages back and the other poster said he thought the Arya Sansa storyline wasn't showing us the whole truth. That they were themselves playing the game.

I don't agree but it raises an interesting point. If Arya and Sansa are acting so off character that people assume they must have a hidden agenda, then what if they don't? Wouldn't that show how poorly the writers have set up their rivalry? The possibility that literally the only logical explanation for their actions being so against character is that they are playing Littlefinger and this whole rivalry is a ruse to smoke him out would actually be the only logical explanation. I have my doubts but we will see.
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Old 08-22-2017, 08:07 PM   #3174
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That would be awesome if they were screwing with littlefinger. Like you I have my doubts. Sansa did bring up a good point about The Vale saving Jon's bacon, as a result I think she feels some "loyalty". That more fits her character and character development I think. She sees the bigger picture now that she is wiser, it's not always just revenge.
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Old 08-22-2017, 08:32 PM   #3175
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So I have a theory about this season that I would like to test

If you are a book person you are more annoyed about the time jumps and fan service stuff than if you are a TV person.
I'm a book reader. I don't mind all the jumping around in the timeline, I am just enjoying being a fan of something that I've already put a lot of time into and which has already provided me with a lot of joy.

There's so much critical thought that a few people put into this thread to point out what they see as problems with the show. Really, I don't get that need to bitch about stuff. Either enjoy being a fan or don't, but why hang around complaining a lot? Of course I don't mean everyone is doing that, but it seems to have become a large share of this thread. It seems to me we would all have more fun if that critical energy went into analysing and speculating on character motivations, hidden backstories, speculation about next steps etc.

I wrote before this season started that I hoped it wouldn't just turn into a special effects extravaganza that lost it's brutal unpredictability, but now that it is going more in that direction, I'm up for the ride. I'm not going to the throw the baby out with the bathwater. If extravaganza is the direction we're going, I will enjoy this extravaganza more than others because it rests on seasons of complex character evolution that has produced stories and characters that I'm genuinely interested in and are worth following through on.
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Old 08-22-2017, 09:57 PM   #3176
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Well said, I'm a book reader and have really enjoyed the detail and congruent storylines up to this point. I think we can agree we've left that behind and are trying to get this done now on the show. I will continue to enjoy both myself!
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Old 08-22-2017, 10:43 PM   #3177
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Okay my theory is wrong.

I was thinking that book readers no longer have the extensive background on which to frame their thoughts so were feeling more disconnected and bothered by the abruptness of this season. Where as show watchers would find it less jarring.

Seems like it's a mixed bag from both show and book people.

Last edited by GGG; 08-22-2017 at 10:55 PM.
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Old 08-22-2017, 10:54 PM   #3178
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Funny I had this same discussion a few pages back and the other poster said he thought the Arya Sansa storyline wasn't showing us the whole truth. That they were themselves playing the game.

I don't agree but it raises an interesting point. If Arya and Sansa are acting so off character that people assume they must have a hidden agenda, then what if they don't? Wouldn't that show how poorly the writers have set up their rivalry? The possibility that literally the only logical explanation for their actions being so against character is that they are playing Littlefinger and this whole rivalry is a ruse to smoke him out would actually be the only logical explanation. I have my doubts but we will see.
I disagree that Arya is going against character. She came home looking for family and found the same entitled sister always wanting power and potentially willing to go against Jon to get it.

Sansa sends Brienne away so that if she does make a move against Jon for the throne and Arya has to go Brienne isn't their to defend Arya.

Arya challenges Sansa to gauge where she is going to go. The Truth she is trying to decent isn't does / did she support Cersai. It's is she going to make a play with Littlefinger for the North. And she wants Sansa paranoid that she is always watching.

Arya also failed at her training because she was herself and not no one. So the more Arya Stark she is the less of a faceless man she is. To me them being PTSDd and relitigating childhood fights and suspicions is exactly what would happen. Arya blames Sansa for her fathers death. She was in a position to do something and did nothing.

I think people saying Arya's character isn't being represented are ignoring the flaws and wanting the perfect hero assassin to live out their fan servicy desires of Saving Sansa, killing Littlefinger and moving on south to the Lanisters.

I am loving the seems of the broken children having the same fights again.
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Old 08-23-2017, 08:02 AM   #3179
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I disagree that Arya is going against character. She came home looking for family and found the same entitled sister always wanting power and potentially willing to go against Jon to get it.

Sansa sends Brienne away so that if she does make a move against Jon for the throne and Arya has to go Brienne isn't their to defend Arya.

Arya challenges Sansa to gauge where she is going to go. The Truth she is trying to decent isn't does / did she support Cersai. It's is she going to make a play with Littlefinger for the North. And she wants Sansa paranoid that she is always watching.

Arya also failed at her training because she was herself and not no one. So the more Arya Stark she is the less of a faceless man she is. To me them being PTSDd and relitigating childhood fights and suspicions is exactly what would happen. Arya blames Sansa for her fathers death. She was in a position to do something and did nothing.

I think people saying Arya's character isn't being represented are ignoring the flaws and wanting the perfect hero assassin to live out their fan servicy desires of Saving Sansa, killing Littlefinger and moving on south to the Lanisters.

I am loving the seems of the broken children having the same fights again.
I hadn't really thought of it all in this way before. Interesting.

The idea that Sansa might want to go after Arya and so is getting Brienne out of the picture doesn't feel right to me though. As political as she has become, I still think family matters a lot to Sansa. My impression was maybe that she wanted to get Brienne out of the picture in order to prevent Brienne and Arya getting into a really life-threatening fight as a result of the games being played.

I could totally be wrong, it just seems to me like both Sansa and Arya have smartened up enough to not get fully wrapped up in Littlefinger's manipulations. I don't think Arya and Sansa are necessarily working together, but that neither of them are merely getting played by Littlefinger.
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Old 08-23-2017, 08:17 AM   #3180
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I disagree that Arya is going against character. She came home looking for family and found the same entitled sister always wanting power and potentially willing to go against Jon to get it.

Sansa sends Brienne away so that if she does make a move against Jon for the throne and Arya has to go Brienne isn't their to defend Arya.

Arya challenges Sansa to gauge where she is going to go. The Truth she is trying to decent isn't does / did she support Cersai. It's is she going to make a play with Littlefinger for the North. And she wants Sansa paranoid that she is always watching.

Arya also failed at her training because she was herself and not no one. So the more Arya Stark she is the less of a faceless man she is. To me them being PTSDd and relitigating childhood fights and suspicions is exactly what would happen. Arya blames Sansa for her fathers death. She was in a position to do something and did nothing.

I think people saying Arya's character isn't being represented are ignoring the flaws and wanting the perfect hero assassin to live out their fan servicy desires of Saving Sansa, killing Littlefinger and moving on south to the Lanisters.

I am loving the seems of the broken children having the same fights again.

You definitely explained what is happening but we are talking about why it is happening. That's the part that doesn't add up. And you're way off base with the Arya fan service stuff. I don't recall anyone saying they want that. It all boils down to the fact I just don't buy why those characters are acting that way. And I don't think there is a good explanation for it.
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