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Old 11-21-2019, 05:57 PM   #21
Roughneck
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^ I don't think they can develop Richmond Green (which probably isn't part of this discussion) because there's a cistern under it. At least I heard something to that effect.

I remember hearing that was the case as well but apparently the cisterns aren't much of an issue as Richmond closed back in September with plans to develop, rather than selling off the operations.
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Old 11-21-2019, 06:04 PM   #22
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Long overdue. Back when I was a student happily working at Sirocco for minimum wage and free golf, I remember the City course employees were making 2x-3x what I was. There’s no need for the City to be paying above market wages - golf course employment is the perfect student job.

This is the perfect solution, it allows the courses to stay open and I wouldn’t be surprised if their quality improves.
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Old 11-21-2019, 07:10 PM   #23
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First thing to go should be their rigidity on certain policies.

"Hey, got anything open in about an hour?" "Yes, foursome spot open, but we're not allowed to book anything within the next two hours, so you just have to come out and hope it's open"

Cool, we'll just not do that, thanks.
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Old 11-21-2019, 07:13 PM   #24
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I remember hearing that was the case as well but apparently the cisterns aren't much of an issue as Richmond closed back in September with plans to develop, rather than selling off the operations.
Hahaha, oh no: the cisterns under the golf course are a colossal issue. The official line from the City was "Richmond Green Golf Course has significant City infrastructure beneath the ground, which makes the options for redeveloping the site extremely limited."

They closed the course because their analysis showed no private operator would ever be interested: they could never make money at it. There are no plans to develop Richmond Green into anything at all; for the foreseeable future they'll just pay some Parks & Rec groundskeeper to mow the grass every once in a while to keep it <6", and the land will just sit there otherwise unused.

Lakeview Golf Course is pretty much the same boat: the land is a utility corridor for the high-voltage transmission lines between the Enmax substation at 50th Ave and 14th St SW and the AltaLink substation south of Westhills. (Draw a line on a map from 50th & 14th to Crowchild and 66th, and you'll see it goes right smack dab through the middle of the golf course and the neighbourhood south of Glenmore.) It's unsaleable; that's why the City did something with the land and made it golf course rather than leave it a bare patch of dirt...
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Old 11-21-2019, 07:18 PM   #25
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^^^^^^^^

I never hit the power lines at lakeview...until I hit a beautiful shot.
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Old 11-21-2019, 09:37 PM   #26
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Here's the Herald Article that comments on all of this. It's worth noting that Confed plays a major part of stormwater management which (thankfully) keeps it out of the hands of developers.

https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...s-in-the-rough

With a favorable enough lease I have to believe someone could step up and make a profit for all involved.
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Old 11-22-2019, 05:25 PM   #27
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Probably a not popular opinion, but I'm never particularly outraged at overpaid public front-line workers - it's 'waste' that is almost entirely recirculated into the local economy/taxes. Of course it all adds up, but I also hold the extremely unpopular view that taxes are the best bargain of anything we spend our money on as individuals.

That said, even as a golfer myself, I don't think public 'white-guy white-ball' courses should run at an operating loss. If they can generate some revenue it's great, but I'd still prefer more public benefit from those massive lost opportunity cost parcels of land.


Richmond Green is a funky little parcel - I hope some unique public use can come of it. Soccer fields and a dog park would be fine, but a little boring. Mountain bike park?

Or forget public benefit and make it a legit Top Golf location! Make it happen Cineplex!
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Old 11-22-2019, 05:32 PM   #28
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I am starting to believe that topgolf is never coming to Canada. Cineplex hasn't mentioned it at all since they purchased the rights
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Old 11-22-2019, 05:58 PM   #29
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I am starting to believe that topgolf is never coming to Canada. Cineplex hasn't mentioned it at all since they purchased the rights
I'd love if it did come here but how would it work with our long winter? A dome? Or hitting outside with heaters in the tee boxes and snowblowers running around that you can hit?
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Old 11-22-2019, 06:40 PM   #30
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I'd love if it did come here but how would it work with our long winter? A dome? Or hitting outside with heaters in the tee boxes and snowblowers running around that you can hit?
They have locations in Colorado, Utah, Minnesota, and Michigan, so they must have some way to work around poor weather.

At the very least, you'd think they would have opened a location in the Vancouver area by now, where weather wouldn't be an issue. The Cineplex-Topgolf partnership was announced over 2 years ago.
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Old 11-22-2019, 06:46 PM   #31
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If I had to guess, I would imagine alot is seasonal employment or positions
A lot of that union's positions are. There's guys in roads that are part of the same union that are seasonal until they've worked there for 5-7 years to get on full time.

What I don't know is if there's full time position for the golf courses like there is other business units that have employees from the same union. At least roads and traffic still has work in the winter like plowing and detours, what operational activities do golf courses have in January aside from the occasional event?
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Old 11-22-2019, 07:18 PM   #32
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Cineplex owns the Rec Room, which has a Top Golf branded simulator. I think I heard a real location was going to Ontario, but I don't remember for sure...
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Old 11-22-2019, 07:23 PM   #33
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A lot of that union's positions are. There's guys in roads that are part of the same union that are seasonal until they've worked there for 5-7 years to get on full time.

What I don't know is if there's full time position for the golf courses like there is other business units that have employees from the same union. At least roads and traffic still has work in the winter like plowing and detours, what operational activities do golf courses have in January aside from the occasional event?

Recreation has a small team of full-time, year-round operations coordinators for the golf courses that's based out of the Max Bell arena. These are unionized office positions. They handle the temp staff scheduling, maintenance planning, inventory (e.g. snacks and liquor), training, etc. From what I gather, November, December, and January are completely dead months, but Sept-Oct and Feb-Mar keeps them fairly busy while they're preparing to open/close the courses for the season.
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Old 11-22-2019, 07:26 PM   #34
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First thing to go should be their rigidity on certain policies.

"Hey, got anything open in about an hour?" "Yes, foursome spot open, but we're not allowed to book anything within the next two hours, so you just have to come out and hope it's open"

Cool, we'll just not do that, thanks.

This drove me insane and they wonder why the lose money. Have 40 golf spots open but dont show them online as its within that two hr window. Almost punched the dude at richmond. Booked a time there with my sister(showed up late, yes thats my fault) asked if we could still go out and says they are all booked up. Looked out the window and nobody around.They act like there are fukcing running Augusta.
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Old 11-23-2019, 08:26 AM   #35
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I thought snobby staff was just part of the Golfing experience?
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Old 11-23-2019, 08:35 AM   #36
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This drove me insane and they wonder why the lose money. Have 40 golf spots open but dont show them online as its within that two hr window. Almost punched the dude at richmond. Booked a time there with my sister(showed up late, yes thats my fault) asked if we could still go out and says they are all booked up. Looked out the window and nobody around.They act like there are fukcing running Augusta.

IIRC they also had an easily exploitable cancellation policy. A twosome or threesome who didn't want to play with anybody else could book as a foursome and have the 'others' cancel within that window so unless there was somebody waiting at the proshop for an opening you'd get to go out on your own with no penalty. I get not wanting the random singles to join your group, but there's got to be a premium that comes with that if that's what you want. Buy the four slots, join a private club, whatever.



Maybe they changed it in the past couple years but it resulted in a lot of lost revenue for the operation and was a common complaint among people trying to sneak in a tee time.
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Old 11-23-2019, 08:58 AM   #37
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^ this for sure. I have golfed a lot as a single, and at most places I find the other golfers receptive - but the few times I have really felt like an interloper was at maple ridge.

All I could think of is book the number of slots you need. Unused slots me the course operator is out a green fee and a fellow golfer is out a spot.
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Old 11-23-2019, 09:05 AM   #38
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^ this for sure. I have golfed a lot as a single, and at most places I find the other golfers receptive - but the few times I have really felt like an interloper was at maple ridge.

All I could think of is book the number of slots you need. Unused slots me the course operator is out a green fee and a fellow golfer is out a spot.
I thought the establishment treating people like crap, oppressing your fellow man and dressing like an idiot was pretty much the entire allure of Golf?
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Old 11-23-2019, 12:10 PM   #39
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I thought the establishment treating people like crap, oppressing your fellow man and dressing like an idiot was pretty much the entire allure of Golf?
Do you golf? It doesn't sound like it.
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