Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Go Back   Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community > Main Forums > Fire on Ice: The Calgary Flames Forum
Ivrnet

Notices

View Poll Results: Do you feel not using public funds is worth the Flames moving?
Yes 180 32.26%
No 378 67.74%
Voters: 558. You may not vote on this poll

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 09-12-2017, 06:12 PM   #3301
You Need a Thneed
Voted for Kodos
 
You Need a Thneed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Random View Post
What actually has the city been doing, other than saying no?
Other than finding a suitable site, starting talks on a land transfer, etc?
__________________
My LinkedIn Profile.
You Need a Thneed is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:28 PM   #3302
Jay Random
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed View Post
Other than finding a suitable site, starting talks on a land transfer, etc?
Oh, they've done etc., have they? Well, I take everything back. Who am I to argue with somebody who provides evidence as specific as etc.?
__________________
WARNING: The preceding message may not have been processed in a sarcasm-free facility.
Jay Random is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:29 PM   #3303
You Need a Thneed
Voted for Kodos
 
You Need a Thneed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Random View Post
Oh, they've done etc., have they? Well, I take everything back. Who am I to argue with somebody who provides evidence as specific as etc.?
Are the two very critical things I mentioned not enough?
__________________
My LinkedIn Profile.
You Need a Thneed is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:29 PM   #3304
Flash Walken
Franchise Player
 
Flash Walken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Exp:
Default

Is IamNotKenKing astroturfing?

I suppose that may not be the most applicable terminology, but is it an attempt to 'manage' opinion?

Seems to have been the only one talking yesterday about the supposed plan on the table to the city from the Flames, and now appears to be the most active poster in defending the Flames apparently backing away from that plan.

I don't get it.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by erikk3 View Post
Hell yeah neck tats let's go
Flash Walken is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Flash Walken For This Useful Post:
Old 09-12-2017, 06:32 PM   #3305
Jay Random
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed View Post
Are the two very critical things I mentioned not enough?
Not hardly. CSEC did not need the City's help or permission to talk to the Stampede board. And they certainly didn't need the City to tell them where the arena has to be built, take it or leave it.

Based on his latest statements, it looks to me awfully like Mr. Nenshi wants a billion-dollar bauble in Victoria Park to be his legacy, and he wants the Flames to pay for a big chunk of it. They get to build it where he wants, when he wants, how he wants, and they also get to pay the entire cost themselves. Now, how could anybody refuse an offer like that?
__________________
WARNING: The preceding message may not have been processed in a sarcasm-free facility.
Jay Random is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Jay Random For This Useful Post:
Old 09-12-2017, 06:33 PM   #3306
Senator Clay Davis
Franchise Player
 
Senator Clay Davis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Maryland State House, Annapolis
Exp:
Default

^^That definitely makes some sense Flash. Would certainly explain a lot.
__________________
"Think I'm gonna be the scapegoat for the whole damn machine? Sheeee......."
Senator Clay Davis is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:36 PM   #3307
nik-
Franchise Player
 
nik-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flash Walken View Post
Is IamNotKenKing astroturfing?

I suppose that may not be the most applicable terminology, but is it an attempt to 'manage' opinion?

Seems to have been the only one talking yesterday about the supposed plan on the table to the city from the Flames, and now appears to be the most active poster in defending the Flames apparently backing away from that plan.

I don't get it.
I would hope that astroturfing would be a little more intelligently subtle. Granted, if it's a Flames directive, it would make sense for it to be so hamfisted.
nik- is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:42 PM   #3308
You Need a Thneed
Voted for Kodos
 
You Need a Thneed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Random View Post
Not hardly. CSEC did not need the City's help or permission to talk to the Stampede board. And they certainly didn't need the City to tell them where the arena has to be built, take it or leave it.

Based on his latest statements, it looks to me awfully like Mr. Nenshi wants a billion-dollar bauble in Victoria Park to be his legacy, and he wants the Flames to pay for a big chunk of it. They get to build it where he wants, when he wants, how he wants, and they also get to pay the entire cost themselves. Now, how could anybody refuse an offer like that?
But CSEC didn't do those things. They have not made any serious proposal to date, that the public has knowledge of.

Meanwhile, the city has been preparing plans for exactly what the Flames should want, all the while requesting that CSEC join them in planning.

If the Flames are seriously still stuck on CalgaryNEXT, I don't know what to say. That proposal was dead on the evening it was announced. That project on that site withvthat funding model is 100% impossible to happen, no matter who sits on council.
__________________
My LinkedIn Profile.
You Need a Thneed is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:50 PM   #3309
Jay Random
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed View Post
But CSEC didn't do those things. They have not made any serious proposal to date, that the public has knowledge of.
CSEC didn't talk to the Stampede Board? Gee, considering that the Stampede Board is their current landlord, I wonder how they managed not to talk to them.

As for the location in Victoria Park, whether it's suitable or not is a matter of opinion. It may be highly suitable for Mr. Nenshi's proposed legacy playground, but not suitable for a private party to invest $450 million in.

As for the ‘serious proposal’, IAmNotKenKing, who apparently has some sort of inside knowledge, says that just such a proposal has been sitting on the mayor's desk for some time, awaiting a response. I don't know whether that's true, but neither am I prepared to state outright that it is false. Whether the public has knowledge of it is rather beside the point.
__________________
WARNING: The preceding message may not have been processed in a sarcasm-free facility.
Jay Random is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:50 PM   #3310
Moneyhands23
First Line Centre
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: victoria
Exp:
Default

Iv been a flames gan since the early 80's. Just not happy in general about any of this
Moneyhands23 is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 06:55 PM   #3311
Roughneck
Scoring Winger
 
Roughneck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: the middle
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Random View Post
And they certainly didn't need the City to tell them where the arena has to be built, take it or leave it.
Their original proposal was using city land, and so is Plan B, so yeah, hey do need the city to tell them where the arena will be built.
Roughneck is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 07:01 PM   #3312
Flash Walken
Franchise Player
 
Flash Walken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed View Post
How does King still have a job?
I know this is uncomfortable to consider, but:

Because he's doing his job and his bosses love him for it.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by erikk3 View Post
Hell yeah neck tats let's go
Flash Walken is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 07:05 PM   #3313
getbak
Franchise Player
 
getbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Calgary, AB
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by heep223 View Post
He says that he's for a rink, as long as it provides public benefit, and then says that a rink doesn't provide public benefit if it uses any public dollars.
Show me one time he has ever said that.
__________________
Turn up the good, turn down the suck!
getbak is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 07:13 PM   #3314
Jay Random
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roughneck View Post
Their original proposal was using city land, and so is Plan B, so yeah, hey do need the city to tell them where the arena will be built.
Plan B uses land owned by the Stampede Board, which is not the City. If the City is not going to contribute a single dollar, as a number of people here have suggested, there's no good reason why CSEC should not please themselves and buy land where they choose.
__________________
WARNING: The preceding message may not have been processed in a sarcasm-free facility.
Jay Random is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 07:17 PM   #3315
heep223
Could Care Less
 
heep223's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Exp:
Default

"I continue to say that, as always, public money must be spent for public benefit and if we can figure out a way that there's public benefit in an interesting project in Victoria Park, we'll take that to the citizens and see what they think."

Literally the first article I googled. If he thought there was public benefit in an arena, he'd be ok using public dollars for it. He's clearly not seeing the public benefit, which is his opinion and it's fine, but why does he bother spewing BS about how he wants an arena?

Both sides are full of it is all I'm saying. Just all ego.
heep223 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to heep223 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-12-2017, 07:24 PM   #3316
getbak
Franchise Player
 
getbak's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Calgary, AB
Exp:
Default

Where does he say this: "a rink doesn't provide public benefit if it uses any public dollars"?


This: "if we can figure out a way that there's public benefit in an interesting project in Victoria Park, we'll take that to the citizens and see what they think", is pretty much the opposite of saying he doesn't believe a rink provides any public benefit.
__________________
Turn up the good, turn down the suck!
getbak is offline  
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to getbak For This Useful Post:
Old 09-12-2017, 07:29 PM   #3317
You Need a Thneed
Voted for Kodos
 
You Need a Thneed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flash Walken View Post
I know this is uncomfortable to consider, but:

Because he's doing his job and his bosses love him for it.
He is very literally losing the team money because he's been wasting years that could have already been in a new arena.

I stand by my words that he should have been fired the evening of the CalgaryNEXT proposal. He had years to prepare, and came up with a presentation that could have been prepared by someone competent in a couple hours, and the proposal itself was very clear at the start that it was completely unworkable, simply by doing a little math on the back of a napkin.
__________________
My LinkedIn Profile.
You Need a Thneed is offline  
Old 09-12-2017, 07:29 PM   #3318
KevanGuy
Been There, Banned That
 
KevanGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Estonia
Exp:
Default

I think with the news tonight we'll close this one up.
KevanGuy is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:26 AM.

Calgary Flames
2016-17




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Calgarypuck 2016