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Old 01-11-2019, 11:30 AM   #41
CroFlames
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Yet if Mangiapane had ripped his chances into the net instead of denting the cross bar, we wouldn't be saying that.

He brings skill and speed to the lineup. That's what the NHL is about.

Hathaway is a strong, physical guy. But I take a skilled fast guy over that any day.

We need more from our bottom 6 in terms of scoring. You don't get that by reducing the skill level of the bottom 6.

I'll warrant that Hathaway is faster than Mangipane.



Hathaway has 5 goals. I'm not sure you can expect much more from him. Do you think Mangiapane would have more goals to date if he was given the same number of games? I have my doubts.
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:31 AM   #42
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Brouwer is way up there on my list of most disliked ex-Flames

Never felt he was in it for more than the paycheques
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:33 AM   #43
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I am 5-0-1 and so far at the Dome this year.



Hopefully the no loss streak continues.
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:33 AM   #44
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Awesome line-up, only missing Juuso Välimäki.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Lindholm
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Bennett- Jankowski - Neal
Mangiapane - Ryan - Czarnik

Giordano - Brodie
Hanifin - Hamonic
Kylington - Andersson

Rittich
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:46 AM   #45
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Not a fan of taking Hathaway out for Mangiapane.



Hathway has proved he can be an NHL-caliber PKer and chip in offensively. His skating is average to above-average.



Mangiapane seems like he doesn't know what to do with the puck.
Therein lies the debate.

Hathaway has great PK numbers if you look at the results, but not the how it's happening.

He leads all Calgary penalty killers in goals against per 60 minutes short handed, but is well off the mark in shots against per 60, scoring chances against per 60, and high danger chances against per 60.

Is he a good PK guy or is Rittich making more saves for him than others?

He's their best for playing with edge, but the worst forward on the team for creating offense.
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:48 AM   #46
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I am 5-0-1 and so far at the Dome this year.



Hopefully the no loss streak continues.
Wow that's great luck! You should buy season tickets man!
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:49 AM   #47
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I feel like Hathaway puts his body through the most abuse for the limited minutes he plays. Likely a testament to how hard he plays, but he could probably use a break.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:09 PM   #48
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Calgary seems to have trouble with some middle or low-performing teams (Dallas, Vancouver, St. Louis, Philadelphia (close call wins) even Edmonton). Let's not get cocky here.
We can be as cocky as we want to be. None of our personal feelings have any effect whatsoever on the outcome of tonight's game, or any game.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:10 PM   #49
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Therein lies the debate.

Hathaway has great PK numbers if you look at the results, but not the how it's happening.

He leads all Calgary penalty killers in goals against per 60 minutes short handed, but is well off the mark in shots against per 60, scoring chances against per 60, and high danger chances against per 60.

Is he a good PK guy or is Rittich making more saves for him than others?

He's their best for playing with edge, but the worst forward on the team for creating offense.
I just don't see how any of those stats can be directly on Hathaway or any one player for that matter? Please do correct me if I'm wrong though.

There are so many variables to consider beyond simply saying these are one specific players figures against /60 as a pker that it seems pretty haphazard to apply them to anything more than the entire unit as a whole.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:12 PM   #50
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I don't know if I'm the minority in here but Mike Smith should have been given the leash to start this game and the game on Sunday against Arizona.

Oh Calgary. Always known to overplay goalies.
Flames are on a 5 game home stand and they had a day off between games. There's no reason whatsoever why Rittich shouldn't get the start. Flames can pad their lead in the Pacific tonight with a win, and then Smith can start on Sunday against the Coyotes. That would give Rittich 4 days off to rest up before the Buffalo game on Wednesday.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:13 PM   #51
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Yeah surprised Hathaway is out. The Pk units should not be touched at all.

Who are the 3 pairings again?
Lindholm/Backlund
Janko/Frolik
Flip them around a bunch
and then Ryan/Hathaway. All 6 of those FW's are amazing at their responsibilities.

So who do they slot into Hathaways spot on the PK? Mangipane?

Last edited by dammage79; 01-11-2019 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:13 PM   #52
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I feel like Hathaway puts his body through the most abuse for the limited minutes he plays. Likely a testament to how hard he plays, but he could probably use a break.
A break is never a bad thing to keep players motivated either. I like that Peters is keeping his bottom six hungry.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:15 PM   #53
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Brouwer-play vs PoweRyan

Who will "win?
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:15 PM   #54
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I don't know if I'm the minority in here but Mike Smith should have been given the leash to start this game and the game on Sunday against Arizona.

Oh Calgary. Always known to overplay goalies. (Hey Kipper!) We get it. Smith is awful this year. But he needs some opportunity to succeed. And one is to make him play against a pretty meh team. Make sure also that the workload handed to BSD and Smitty are balanced!

Overplaying Smith last year is still fresh in our minds, Bill Peters. We had to rely on AHL goaltending (Gillies and pre-BSD Rittich) and that cost us a playoff spot.
I disagree, and don't believe that is happening here. Peters actually has a history of managing his goalies, and setting a priority on keeping them fresh. I think we are at the point of the schedule where Rittich should and will play three of four games. Smith will almost certainly get the start on Sunday, and pacing Rittich at around 50-starts is not going to cripple him.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:17 PM   #55
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Yeah, I will stay away from the fatigue issue discussion. Some of the smartest guys in the room have in their heads an ideal number of starts unsubstantiated by data.
Gee. I wonder who that could be?
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:17 PM   #56
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We can be as cocky as we want to be. None of our personal feelings have any effect whatsoever on the outcome of tonight's game, or any game.
lol
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:19 PM   #57
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Jeez man, the amount of leash Smith has been given could stretch to China. And every time he’s been given it, he’s run to the nearest tree as fast as he can to hang himself with it. Enough with this guy, he had his “opportunity to succeed” and he blew it, over and over and over. He’s done, and that’s the whole story.

Give him back-to-backs until the trade deadline when hopefully an actual NHL-caliber backup is brought in. Then cut him loose.
We are past the point of "opportunity to succeed" for Smith, but that does not mean the coaching staff should just abandon their plan for goalies outright. They still need to stagger some of their starts.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:25 PM   #58
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Rittich will probably have less than 60 starts this year. Seems pretty good for a starter.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:27 PM   #59
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Rittich will probably have less than 60 starts this year. Seems pretty good for a starter.
Well, yeah. The only way Rittich would get to 60 starts is if he plays every single remaining game of the regular season.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:30 PM   #60
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I just don't see how any of those stats can be directly on Hathaway or any one player for that matter? Please do correct me if I'm wrong though.

There are so many variables to consider beyond simply saying these are one specific players figures against /60 as a pker that it seems pretty haphazard to apply them to anything more than the entire unit as a whole.
Wouldn't say correct you, you're right ... on ice stats are attributable to every player on the ice at that time.

But at the same time when certain things happen more or less to others when you're not on the ice the numbers start to suggest a component to the player.

Hathaway is ranked 1st in terms of results, but Jankowski is second in results, and 1st or 2nd in every measure of what happens when he's on the ice for example (shorthanded)
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