[PGT] Flames squander another crucial one. 5-3 VGK

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

The end of the Iginla era had different issues including just a lack of talent.

Though there was also a deeper issue with the teams captain and best player undermining how the team wanted to play - creating a rift in the dressing room.

Like when Brendan Morrison was drawing up powerplay strategies. Ugly times, that coach hasn't sniffed the NHL since either.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

The end of the Iginla era had different issues including just a lack of talent.

Though there was also a deeper issue with the teams captain and best player undermining how the team wanted to play - creating a rift in the dressing room.

I don't really agree with the lack of talent. The teams in 2007 and the few years afterwards had talent. Some years arguably more than the current squad maybe, but that is debatable.

I feel like you're kind of ignoring the coaching and organizational issues and trying to scapegoat things on one player, Iginla and now Gaudreau.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by united

Kind of depressing when considering their respective roles/usage at even-strength, and opportunity as it relates to the powerplay. Tied in even-strength points this season, believe it or not. Not good.

Can any team really expect to have any kind of success with this kind of play out of their supposed #1 C?

For as much as we all debate everything on here, this seems like an inescapable issue for this team.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by AC

Imagine being an adult in Calgary that shows up to a game wearing a Vegas jersey.

Yikes.

I don't get this sentiment.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Monahan’s last 10 games he has 5 g 3 a and is +5

That’s not so bad

[Elkyiv]

Originally Posted by Buff

I don't get this sentiment.

It's just bizarre behavior. I don't even get the kids wearing them, let alone adults. But yeah, I always wonder why.

The team is less than 3 years old. I don't think anyone is flying from Las Vegas to Calgary to watch them play. It screams contrarian and pretentious.

[AC]

Originally Posted by Buff

I don't get this sentiment.

If they're not from Vegas, then it's embarrassing as hell IMO. Being a fan of any other team is at least somewhat justifiable but choosing an expansion team is shameful.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by AC

If they're not from Vegas, then it's embarrassing as hell IMO. Being a fan of any other team is at least somewhat justifiable but choosing an expansion team is shameful.

Yep, bandwagon fans.... especially considering how many there are. Team is in its third year FFS

[Oil Stain]

Originally Posted by AC

If they're not from Vegas, then it's embarrassing as hell IMO. Being a fan of any other team is at least somewhat justifiable but choosing an expansion team is shameful.

Why is being a fan of an expansion team shameful?

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Elkyiv

It's just bizarre behavior. I don't even get the kids wearing them, let alone adults. But yeah, I always wonder why.

The team is less than 3 years old. I don't think anyone is flying from Las Vegas to Calgary to watch them play. It screams contrarian and pretentious.

I still don't get why people are upset that there are Vegas fans.

I'm a Vegas fan. I'm a Flames fan first and cheer for them over the Golden Knights, but I'll cheer for VGK in their other games.

Why do people have to pick the Flames because they live in/near Calgary? Maybe a casual hockey fan considered themselves Flames fan but became tired of the years of mediocrity and decided that this is a good time to start fresh. Who cares? I'm just happy that there are people who love this wonderful sport of hockey. I don't care who they cheer for. Oh, I'll judge the heck out of Oiler fans, because that one is obvious, but why be critical of people who cheer for any of the other 29 teams.

Guess what? There is going to be a sudden influx of Seattle fans too. Those may not last if they don't make the playoffs in their inaugural year but you'll see their jerseys in the crowd.

[AC]

Originally Posted by Oil Stain

Why is being a fan of an expansion team shameful?

As Elkyiv said above, it comes across as contrarian and pretentious. If you don't have an actual connection to the city or team I feel it's an embarrassing look to support a bandwagon expansion team over any local team you should be supporting.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by united

Kind of depressing when considering their respective roles/usage at even-strength, and opportunity as it relates to the powerplay. Tied in even-strength points this season, believe it or not. Not good.

The difference between this year and last IMO is gaudreau's threat to score at 5-5.

I believe he had 24 even strength goals last season by the all star break.

Since then he has 18. That's in 101 games. Derek Ryan has 17.

Same time frame, Mangiapane has 25.

Draisaitl has 39.

Monahan is playing just 18 minutes a game this year. He had 22 even strength goals last year and this year has 14. It's a decline, but not nearly as much as gaudreau's 29 to 12.

The Flames have scored 20 less 5 on 5 goals this season as compared to last at this time. Gaudreau splitting the difference between the two would go along way.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by AC

As Elkyiv said above, it comes across as contrarian and pretentious. If you don't have an actual connection to the city or team I feel it's an embarrassing look to support a bandwagon expansion team over any local team you should be supporting.

Meh. Lots of people moved to Calgary over the past 20 years. Some might have become Flames fans, some didn’t.

I liked Vegas when they came out because I liked Fleury and Engelland, also admired the way Gallant had them playing

I can’t renounce my Flames fandom after sinking a bunch of years and dollars into supporting the team... but if I did, would you blame me? I mean, they haven’t done a lot for me lately.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by AC

As Elkyiv said above, it comes across as contrarian and pretentious. If you don't have an actual connection to the city or team I feel it's an embarrassing look to support a bandwagon expansion team over any local team you should be supporting.

I fully expect to see you cheer for the Oilers. They have been around for a long time and they are from the same country as you.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by AC

As Elkyiv said above, it comes across as contrarian and pretentious. If you don't have an actual connection to the city or team I feel it's an embarrassing look to support a bandwagon expansion team over any local team you should be supporting.

I was born in Saudi Arabia and my first blanket was a Flames blanket. Among a motley collection of brown babies with full heads of black hair, I was a pure white Adonis with a head so bald and perfect I sued Patrick Stewart at two days old, all the while rocking the Flaming C.

So unless you were born inside the Saddledome and delivered by Craig Conroy, none of you will ever be as true a fan as me. So cheer for whoever you want, because none of you were ever good enough to even count as traitors, anyway.

[stone hands]

i think bashing people for the coloured laundry they cheer for is pretty pretentious also because everyones reason is completely arbitrary and not more valid than another

[SuperMatt18]

I think it depends if you actually started cheering for Vegas at the start of that season, or only once they were good and made it to the finals.

If you cheered from them from the start of the season then it's actually admirable IMO.

That was a team that was expected to be bad, expansion teams are usually bad, but you still choose that team since you likely wanted a team with no history or baggage that you could say you've been a fan of since day 1.

If you ended up cheering for Vegas once they were in the finals and the cool team to like all of a sudden then that's lame. You are the true definition of a bandwagon fan in that scenario.

[Elkyiv]

Originally Posted by stone hands

i think bashing people for the coloured laundry they cheer for is pretty pretentious also because everyones reason is completely arbitrary and not more valid than another

Cheering for a local team is anything but arbitrary

[djsFlames]

What I don't understand is growing up in calgary, ignoring sports for most your life (not this part - to each their own) but then one day deciding you want to be a fan of hockey, then going out and buying merch for a team from a city you've never visited, with no familial connection to of any kind, but just cause you want to be different. There are a number of people that will do this.

It is a little weird, and I wouldn't buy into your fandom. It looks more like you're "trying on the hockey fan thing" for a bit but without understanding the meaning and rationale behind actually being one.

People have given me the strangest, most obscure reasons for why they support a team and I always just come back to "why don't you just support your local/hometown club? It's a better reason.

But dont get me wrong, I can understand wanting to like a team that is easier to cheer for from year to year. I personally just couldn't abandon my hometown ties, as they are too deep.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don't really agree with the lack of talent. The teams in 2007 and the few years afterwards had talent. Some years arguably more than the current squad maybe, but that is debatable.

I feel like you're kind of ignoring the coaching and organizational issues and trying to scapegoat things on one player, Iginla and now Gaudreau.

This type of miss-representation of other peoples views is why these debates go down hill. I literally just said those teams didn't have enough talent. How can I say that while at the same time be scape-goating things on one player?
I don't think those teams had enough talent up front, and even the defense never came together as thought.

My view to trade Johnny is in part because I don't think he's truly committed to what he needs to do to win, but moreso because, as I've stated numerous times, one of the following 3 things will happen in the next 2 years
- Johnny is traded
- Johnny walks
- Johnny is signed to another deal, that is likely very risky and not great long-term.

So in my view the best option is the first one.

I'm not ignoring coaching. I literally said today that I'm in favor of both changing the roster and bringing in a more proven coach. How is that ignoring coaching?