Justin Trudeau says marijuana should be legalized

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by ranchlandsselling

Yeah - because they thought they'd waste years of research studies, millions of dollars of grants, hospital hours, nurse and patient hours and Dr.'s time when they could have gotten that little tidbit from you. If only everyone involved in all these studies had come to you first for that little gem!

http://www.cbc.ca/player/Shows/Shows...ID/1398511775/

Holy necroquote! But seriously, way to act like a catty bitch in response to an off the cuff comment made to play devil's advocate. Superstar.

[ranchlandsselling]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Marijuana is pretty much available right now for people who want it. The legality of it is a completely different issue and doesn't necessarily change who has access to the drug. If anything, I would trust someone at a liquor store selling it, than some Hell's Angels associate at a night club or pool hall.

Not too mention, there is a myriad of diseases that people have genetic predispositions to but we don't make triggers for those illegal.

As a responsible and mature adult, I should be able to choose if I want to use marijuana for recreational or medicinal purposes without the fear of crimination. Someone else's unfortunate genetic situation shouldn't be a determination for the rights of people without that condition. I have a genetic predisposition to heart disease, so why aren't there laws in place to protect me from bacon?

This is hilarious! It's amazing to see an actual display of ignorance rejecting science because they feel it rejects something one is in favour of. I didn't once mention the legality of it yet my one comment brings out the "omg buying from a store is better than the gangs111!! 11" or "why isnt bacon illegal"

You're starting a debate that didnt exist earlier or began with the rejection of the science I commented on. It being true doesnt jeprodize you're want to take part in taking drugs. Marajuana users are so paranoid.... sheesh, its like there's a correlation between...... oh wait

[jayswin]

Good lord, could you tone down the obnoxiousness a bit there, ranchlandselling?

[ranchlandsselling]

Originally Posted by Reaper

Holy necroquote! But seriously, way to act like a catty bitch in response to an off the cuff comment made to play devil's advocate. Superstar.

Awww, sounds like someone else is the sensitive one.

Why make the witty remark if you're not able to support it? And if you're not able to and just trying to sound cool and want to just have it stand as a witty remark then don't get sad when someone replies and suggests its not accurate.

[ranchlandsselling]

Originally Posted by flameswin

Good lord, could you tone down the obnoxiousness a bit there, ranchlandselling?

Sorry, didnt mean to come accross like that. Obviously let my interest in the subject get the better of my typing. I apologize.

I also thought my little paranoia joke showed I wasnt being too serious.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by ranchlandsselling

This is hilarious! It's amazing to see an actual display of ignorance rejecting science because they feel it rejects something one is in favour of. I didn't once mention the legality of it yet my one comment brings out the "omg buying from a store is better than the gangs111!! 11" or "why isnt bacon illegal"

You're starting a debate that didnt exist earlier or began with the rejection of the science I commented on. It being true doesnt jeprodize you're want to take part in taking drugs. Marajuana users are so paranoid.... sheesh, its like there's a correlation between...... oh wait

I'm not rejecting science. I'm rejecting the notion that even if what you are saying is correct (which I can't say one way or the other if it is because I have not looked at the data), that it has any value to the legality debate. And the legality of marijuana is the topic, so forgive me if I assumed your post had something to do with that. Honestly, it's hard to tell what you are rambling on about.

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by nik-

Is it?

Yes. Different people have different levels of susceptibility to different mental disorders, notably in the topic of conversation is schizophrenia including severe hallucinations and delusions. Generally people will have it or they won't around the age of 21-23 (with there obviously being exceptions).

It's like a spectrum of susceptibility and including marijuana in the brain during the early adult years has been shown to increase the likelihood of the hallucinations and delusions occurring when they otherwise would have remained dormant and never been triggered. This is one of the serious concerns with marijuana; that and the concern with adolescents using it. It poses harm before people are 21 because during that time the brain is behaving in a neuroplastic manner in which the physical shape of the brain is still taking form and introducing marijuana can inhibit or affect the way in which it is forming.

[Flacker]

Originally Posted by ranchlandsselling

Sorry, didnt mean to come accross like that. Obviously let my interest in the subject get the better of my typing. I apologize.

I also thought my little paranoia joke showed I wasnt being too serious.

Is that a financial interest?

Bake Em Away Toys!!

[ranchlandsselling]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I'm not rejecting science. I'm rejecting the notion that even if what you are saying is correct (which I can't say one way or the other if it is because I have not looked at the data), that it has any value to the legality debate. And the legality of marijuana is the topic, so forgive me if I assumed your post had something to do with that. Honestly, it's hard to tell what you are rambling on about.

Fair enough.
I did clarify what I was saying had nothing to do with the legal debate. I was responding to some posts rejecting the link between cannabis use and mental illness.
I'm also phone typing from a boring conference. So it's tough to not ramble.

[Reaper]

nm

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by MattyC

I don't presume to know the effect of smoking pot when you're schizophrenic. I imagine it varies as does much as the illness does. But is there actual data saying it can CAUSE schizophrenia?

I have never heard of or seen any actual data in regards to Marijuana causing the disease. Everything I know (which is admittedly very little) is that it's a hereditary disease and because of that I fail to see how it could be attributed to smoking Marijuana. I would wager its simply a fear monger's response to dissuade people from using.

What irks me is that we are wasting time discussing pot legalization when there are much more pressing matters that people should be basing their opinions on.

[ranchlandsselling]

Originally Posted by Reaper

Fine. Here it is: Correlation does not always equal causation. Just because two factors are present does not mean that one caused the occurrence of the other.

To suggest that correlation equals causation is ridiculous. Here's an example. The incidence of rape in Central Park in NYC is linked to sales of ice cream from street vendors. When ice cream sales drop so does the incidence of rape. If both activities are linked then surely one must cause the other, right?

Of course not. Both ice cream sales and the occurrence of rape in Central Park decrease IN WINTER. This is because in cold weather ice cream vendors generally don't operate and because below freezing temperatures kill boners.

While both factors are linked there is no incidence of causation.

lol dork, support it with respect to the post you responding to.

[Reaper]

nm

[AcGold]

He was joking around

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by AcGold

He was joking around

Are you strombad to his Mr. Yamamota?

[Daradon]

The way I understand the marijuana - schizophrenia link is that it brings it out in people who are already at risk for it (or have it, but do not know they have it). Not that it causes it. There is a difference.

People who have, who are at risk for schizophrenia, or who have shown tendencies, are generally supposed to stay away from all drugs, even alcohol. That's because drugs cause people to disassociate from reality. Marijuana does this. Perhaps people who are used to it don't think about that too much because they have built something of a physical and mental tolerance to it, but marijuana can be quite dissociative.

If you already have a condition that causes you to separate from reality, obviously any drug is just going to make it worse. The problem with schizophrenia is that it often isn't diagnosed before a fairly serious incident.

I'll end by saying, I'm not a doctor, this is just the understanding that I have from reading on the subject. If anyone who knows more about schizophrenia wants to jump in to agree, disagree, or correct, I'm definitely here to listen.

As well, I'll add that this doesn't mean I'm against making it legal either. I think we should. Just that there are some things to consider when drafting up policy.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Marijuana, when eventually legalized, should be treated no different than alcohol and cigarettes. Educate people on the risks and dangers, and so long as you do that then it's on people to enjoy in moderation. But there are risks to drinking and smoking cigs, just as there is marijuana. The legal age should probably be 21 just to be safe.

A few weeks ago New York Times columnist Maureen Dowd went to Colorado and tried some edibles and had a really bad trip....because she didn't take even the slightest initiative to find out about what she was consuming. She bought it and ate it, didn't ask for any information as she purchased, didn't research anything at all. Had she known that the bar was divided into 16 pieces and that 1 piece is a single dosage (of course she ate 4 times that), she wouldn't have had the bad experience.

She proceeds to write a column about her experience and rightfully gets ripped (no pun) by most people for not finding out what she was doing. Your first time drinking, you don't go out and get a bottle of Everclear. That's what needs to be done when pot is eventually legalized, there needs to be education as to how to best enjoy pot in moderation. That's what's good about Amsterdam, the budtenders at the coffee shops are helpful to people who don't smoke regularly.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by ranchlandsselling

That's not what they're saying at all. It's if you have a susceptibility to certain mental illness smoking weed can immensely increase onset of said mental illness and actually make it worse than it would have been.

It's becoming more common knowledge that individuals have risk factors for mental illness, they might not ever experience onset, but the risk factor is there. The research is showing that marijuana use can increase the odds of this onset. Drastically.

Yeah I get that. The thing that some people seem to be missing is that this does not mean weed is the cause. I said in an earlier post at the top of this page that I won't pretend to know the affects of weed on someone who has a mental illness, and that the affects likely range just as much as the illnesses do, but to claim it as a cause is false.

Can It be dangerous for people with mental illness? Yeah I can definitely see how it could and I would certainly not advocate for them to smoke. As long as people are aware of the effects and what they may mean to them personally, it shouldn't cause any issues outside of the obvious (loss of short-term memory, health considerations, etc..). Does that mean that people with mental illness won't smoke? No, it will happen and maybe could have some pretty harsh negative effects for some people, but so can many things and not just the old alcohol and cigarettes argument. What happens if a kid with a genetic mental illness gets a concussion in hockey? I honestly have no clue, but I would venture to say that traumatic brain injury would have an affect on an onset mental illness. Outlaw hockey? Football? Sports in general?

We as people do many dangerous and stupid things for various reasons. For some its drugs, for some its basejumping. Telling me some kid might smoke pot and trigger a mental illness sounds no worse to me than a kid getting into his parents prescription pills and doing similar damage. Or booze or whatever. It is sad for sure, but the vast majority of people do not have these geneitic predispositions, so why am I a criminal for having a joint in privacy of my house?

[Trumbull]

Originally Posted by Reaper

Since you're being an obnoxious twat about the whole thing.

If marijuana caused schizophrenia then wouldn't all marijuana consumers develop schizophrenia? Yes, if marijuana was a cause of schizophrenia then it would be true.

Since the evidence only shows that marijuana usage and schizophrenia have coexisted in some study subjects it only shows that they are linked but it would be illogical to suggest that one causes the other.

Not all people are susceptible to side effects the same.

One could easily use your logic to say smoking cigarettes doesn't lead to the variety of lung diseases and cancers associated because practically no one gets them, right? The notion that "all users" need to get it is a conjured criteria I guarantee is not accepted by people who practice in healthcare and medicine.

[undercoverbrother]

Is there another drug that is used, like pot, for both recreational and medicinal purposes?