06-18-2020, 12:11 PM
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#1
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Franchise Player
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2019/2020 Trade Speculation and Rumors 2.0
Transplant has a point. Another is that it takes a longer amount of time to be an effective player of defense, it's a more difficult skill set. So you do see some defensemen come out of the draft with an emphasis on the offensive side.
I'm not sure what to do with the 4 defensemen on the left. Gio is not going anywhere, and neither is Valimaki. Hanifin has the better overall talent level compared to Kylington, but Kylington is the best skater on the team and spent all year concentrating on the defensive side of the game.
I almost lean towards trading Hanifin because I like Kylington's work ethic and dedication to his position. It was thought that he would be an offensive specialist, but now I'm starting to think that if he can build his defensive game he can more easily recapture the offense after the fact.
I worry that Hanifin is floating on natural ability, and it hasn't sunk in that he needs to work as hard as Kylington to maintain his place on the second pairing.
If you trade one, there is a chance that player is going to explode on the new team. I mean, good problem to have I guess.
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"We don't even know who our best player is yet. It could be any one of us at this point." - Peter LaFleur, player/coach, Average Joe's Gymnasium
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06-18-2020, 12:29 PM
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#2
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First Line Centre
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I feel like Kylington has a higher hockey IQ than Hanifin, is a better skater, and while he still needs to learn his craft in terms of the defensive side - I actually see higher potential with Kylington. He's smooth af and has some excellent offensive awareness.
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06-18-2020, 12:46 PM
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#3
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Uncle Chester
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Am I in the Hot Takes thread?
I don’t agree at all. I may be frustrated with Hanifin’s progress but he doesn’t make gaffs like Kylington for the most part.
Last edited by SportsJunky; 06-18-2020 at 12:48 PM.
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06-18-2020, 12:50 PM
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#4
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Crash and Bang Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy
I like Hanifin, I just don't think he has the upside, especially offensively, that we'd hoped. I could be wrong.
I'd be OK flipping him for a good young top 6 forward, or as part of a package to get a really good, young C.
Risky though, especially since he's one of only 3 regular Flames Dmen still under contract going forward.
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I think the upside is definitely there. The thing is it's hard to see it playing behind Gio. In the 8 games that Gio missed where Hanifin and Andersson stepped in to be the top pairing, here were their numbers.
Hanifin:5A, +3
Andersson: 1G 3A, +4
and if I'm not mistaken that includes the one atrocious game that saw him end up a -4 or something like that.
So small sample size, yes, but 5 points in 8 games and a +3 is pretty good totals for playing first pairing minutes. And that is not being sheltered defensively either. That equals a 50 point season and +30.
I think starting next year the flames should be deploying a Hanifin - Andersson pair as like the 1A. Gio and hopefully Brodie but whoever they retain to play with him (please god don't keep Hamonic) would be 1B and roll out Valimaki - Kylington as the sheltered third pair. (I believe it's been mentioned before that Kylington played RD in sweden and is comfortable on that side.)
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06-18-2020, 12:54 PM
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#5
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SportsJunky
Am I in the Hot Takes thread?
I don’t agree at all. I may be frustrated with Hanifin’s progress but he doesn’t make gaffs like Kylington for the most part.
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Me too.
I see the talent with Kylington but I have yet to see any consistent application of those skills. For me he's expansion-bait.
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06-18-2020, 12:59 PM
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#6
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Crash and Bang Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Lime
Transplant has a point. Another is that it takes a longer amount of time to be an effective player of defense, it's a more difficult skill set. So you do see some defensemen come out of the draft with an emphasis on the offensive side.
I'm not sure what to do with the 4 defensemen on the left. Gio is not going anywhere, and neither is Valimaki. Hanifin has the better overall talent level compared to Kylington, but Kylington is the best skater on the team and spent all year concentrating on the defensive side of the game.
I almost lean towards trading Hanifin because I like Kylington's work ethic and dedication to his position. It was thought that he would be an offensive specialist, but now I'm starting to think that if he can build his defensive game he can more easily recapture the offense after the fact.
I worry that Hanifin is floating on natural ability, and it hasn't sunk in that he needs to work as hard as Kylington to maintain his place on the second pairing.
If you trade one, there is a chance that player is going to explode on the new team. I mean, good problem to have I guess.
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Everybody is trying to solve the problem of what to do with 4 NHL calibre LD but I think we are missing the most obvious solution. As I said above Kylington is comfortable on the right side, he has played that position in Sweden. Let him switch to the right side and keep Gio, Hanifin, Valimaki in their most comfortable roles.
And then while Valimaki gets back up to speed with everything, really test Hanifin to see what we have. Give Hanifin-Andersson the tough minutes but also the offensive roles. If Hanifin isn't up to snuff, think about trading him and giving Valimaki a shot to see what he can do.
I like Hanifin and I'm not against trading him but I am against trading him before we give him the chance to be what he was drafted to be. He has never been given the opportunity the way some guys like Werenski are and it's not because he never seized the opportunity its because there was never any need for him to be forced into those roles. He has always been a part of a deep defence.
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06-18-2020, 12:59 PM
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#7
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First Line Centre
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Yea I want to keep all our young dmen and give all of them top 6 mins moving forward.
Gio, Andersson, Valimaki, Kylington and Hanifin should all be in the top 6 next season.
I think if Stone sticks around it’s as the #7 cause I’d feel more comfortable with someone being re-signed or brought in to strengthen the depth.
Yelesin and Mackey can be the first call ups.
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06-18-2020, 01:12 PM
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#8
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Franchise Player
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Maybe Kylington is actually more effective on the right side, ala Brodie.
This all seems like a 2022 problem, if Mackey is good enough to start making a push. Calgary's strength is in the defense, so the concentration should be on a revamp of the offensive core with the defense there to back them up.
It would be great if all six of Andersson, Hanifin, Valimaki, Kylington, Yelesin and Mackie are monsters on long term low AAV deals when future 7 time Vezina winner Wolf gets to the NHL.
__________________
"We don't even know who our best player is yet. It could be any one of us at this point." - Peter LaFleur, player/coach, Average Joe's Gymnasium
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06-18-2020, 01:13 PM
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#9
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SportsJunky
Am I in the Hot Takes thread?
I don’t agree at all. I may be frustrated with Hanifin’s progress but he doesn’t make gaffs like Kylington for the most part.
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Ha! well Hanifin has made his fair share of bone-headed gaffs.
That being said, Hanifin was really making the most of his increased ice-time down the stretch which I failed to take into account
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06-18-2020, 01:19 PM
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#10
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dissentowner
Skinner will be a compliance buyout. Any time there has been stoppage in season play there has been compliance buyouts. Given the unknown cap situation going forward it is an almost certainty.
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You sure about that one?
Skinner has 7 years left at 9 million per. that's a 42 million dollar buyout. You're pretty sure the Pegula's are going to write that cheque huh? 42 million over 14 years for someone not to play on your team.
Are you even aware of what is happening in the world right now?
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06-18-2020, 01:35 PM
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#11
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Franchise Player
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Yeah, I think if there is a CBO the Sabres will use it on Okposo and give Skinner a chance to get his mojo back. Hard to give a guy an 8 year deal and then buy it out one season later.
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06-18-2020, 01:38 PM
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#12
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Acerbic Cyberbully
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: back in Chilliwack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CliffFletcher
Lindholm is a better centre than Monahan.
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I am not convinced of that.
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06-18-2020, 02:00 PM
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#13
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Lifetime Suspension
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Some of the takes in here make my whole body cringe.
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06-18-2020, 02:06 PM
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#14
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dammage79
IMO, if Monahan is being traded you might as well blow it up.
You have 2 top 6 centers and you trade away the youngest one.... its dumb dumb dumb.
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Something around Monahan and Tkachuk for Eichel interest you? Gaudreau would likely want to stay if he had Eichel as his C
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06-18-2020, 02:15 PM
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#15
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CliffFletcher
Lindholm is a better centre than Monahan.
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Maybe. But he seems to be better as winger.
I was all for playing Lindholm playing at C but not so sure anymore.
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06-18-2020, 02:22 PM
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#16
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus
Something around Monahan and Tkachuk for Eichel interest you? Gaudreau would likely want to stay if he had Eichel as his C
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Not overly. I really dislike that style of team building. I'm pretty happy.overall with how tree is trying to build an all around roster where there is no glaring hilaripus weakness because one guy eats so much cap you can't ice 3 or 4 competent line. Or a decent 6 d men.
I'd rather move Gaudreau and keep one of the best centers in team history and a younger more all arpund player like Tkachuk.
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06-18-2020, 02:29 PM
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#17
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Alberta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strange Brew
Maybe. But he seems to be better as winger.
I was all for playing Lindholm playing at C but not so sure anymore.
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To me it's like having a Marian Hossa and saying "gee we should really put him in at centre because of his two way ability" not recognizing that he just plays the ice better from the wing!
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06-18-2020, 02:35 PM
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#18
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Phoenix, AZ
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You don't trade Hanifin unless it is an absolute no brainer kind of deal (overpayment from the other team involved) or we desperately need the cap space to make our team better. Hard to do the latter with finding a defenseman of Hanifin's caliber signed to a contract that he is currently signed to.
I like Kylington, has the potential to be a top 4 D. He still needs another season on the bottom pairing, and maybe some top 4 time when an injury on D occurs.
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06-18-2020, 02:37 PM
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#19
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Alberta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus
Something around Monahan and Tkachuk for Eichel interest you? Gaudreau would likely want to stay if he had Eichel as his C
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1. I say absolutely not to any Tkachuk trade, unless we are getting the first overall in a good draft.
2. I am not sure that bit about Johnny is true. The reasons stated for him wanting to leave are: less flying time, so more games in close proximity, during the season (hates flying)- this is only achievable in the Eastern Conference, and proximity to his family (health concerns about his father) which is only achievable in the NE or some central locations maybe.
It has nothing to do with winning or the chance of winning, and everything to do with lifestyle outside of the rink. I don't think it will matter who we bring in, it's the geographic location that is the problem for johnny.
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06-18-2020, 02:42 PM
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#20
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan
You don't trade Hanifin unless it is an absolute no brainer kind of deal (overpayment from the other team involved) or we desperately need the cap space to make our team better. Hard to do the latter with finding a defenseman of Hanifin's caliber signed to a contract that he is currently signed to.
I like Kylington, has the potential to be a top 4 D. He still needs another season on the bottom pairing, and maybe some top 4 time when an injury on D occurs.
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I agree I think Hanifin is the type of player you only move if the right deal comes along and there is a definite replacement coming in. For instance if the Flames did something along the lines of Gaudreau for Montour and the 7th overall pick and then swapped Hanifin for Domi I could understand. If Hall is being signed to replace Gaudreau and Domi is simply added to the top 6 that is an offensive upgrade. Montour, Valimaki in but Hanifin and likely Brodie and Hamonic out does weaken the blueline significantly
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