Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Even forgetting about old news like the Warroom or Keystone, the UCP recently sent back $130M to the federal government that was slated for abandoned oil well clean-up, that we didn't use. At the same time, the UCP promised oil companies $20B in royalty breaks (which is the same in reality as a cash reward) to fulfill their obligations to clean up their own wells, which they already signed agreements to do (so we essentially already paid for this).

The difference is that when the NDP spends money, at least we get SOMETHING for the expenditure. When the UCP does it, we get nothing, and it's on a bigger scale.

Uh. The $130M sent back a combination of poor planning by the Feds and Alberta energy. Blaming the ucp is being misleading.

[fotze2]

When did slava go from this left wing zealot recommending ethical funds to this right wing fanatical awful human he is today? He’s just the worst.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

I think I've made my stance clear here. Notley and her NDPs bungling of the PPAs almost cost me my job. I survived on a technicality. Unless she shows up on my doorstep with a cheque that has 7 figures on it she will never get my vote. Witch.

Danielle Smith is unhinged. An anti vaccine, Healthcare dismantling, Pawlowski sympthasizing hog. Alberta doesn't need to leave Canada to be better but that division is what she wants. Witch.

I have few alternatives to vote for, but barring any massive change, it will be for the Alberta Party.

My takeaways from this post are that you didn’t lose your job and unless Notley hands you a 7 figure cheque in payback for that she will “never get” your vote.

Basically you’re explicitly stating that you will never vote for Notley and that despite labelling Smith as “unhinged” you won’t explicitly state that you won’t vote her. You also don’t appear to have much to say about the alternative option you chose or whether you’re concerned about who between the NDP and UCP is more likely to win office as a result of your choice.

I’d be interested to hear how you justify feeling entitled to north of $1M in compensation for NOT losing your job. That figure is way north of how much the overwhelming majority of people could even hope to be awarded in a case where they have actually been unlawful dismissed.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

My takeaways from this post are that you didn’t lose your job and unless Notley hands you a 7 figure cheque in payback for that she will “never get” your vote.

Basically you’re explicitly stating that you will never vote for Notley and that despite labelling Smith as “unhinged” you won’t explicitly state that you won’t vote her. You also don’t appear to have much to say about the alternative option you chose or whether you’re concerned about who between the NDP and UCP is more likely to win office as a result of your choice.

I’d be interested to hear how you justify feeling entitled to north of $1M in compensation for NOT losing your job. That figure is way north of how much the overwhelming majority of people could even hope to be awarded in a case where they have actually been unlawful dismissed.

Is it that surprising people will vote based on their own perceived financial interests. I’m always told when someone shows you who they are you should believe them and notley did march against oil in Alberta. It would be curious to see how she governs without the threat of 2 conservative parties merging to easily replace her. A lot of Calgary votes are coming from this position rightly or wrongly.

Saying all that I think I’d be a bit better off personally voting ucp. But well crazy and all can’t do that. Notley may not be best personally for me but it’s the best option. At this point even not voting isn’t an option. And I even like my Mla.

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

despite labelling Smith as “unhinged” you won’t explicitly state that you won’t vote her.

From my last post:

"I have few alternatives to vote for, but barring any massive change, it will be for the Alberta Party."

Now read that again, just slower. Like real slowly. Now read it slower than a backwards dog rubbing it's ass on the grass.

Maybe one more time for good measure. You'll actually be happy to know it was a union that saved my job from auntie Rachel. Wow, now you don't know what to think do ya.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

From my last post:

"I have few alternatives to vote for, but barring any massive change, it will be for the Alberta Party."

Now read that again, just slower. Like real slowly. Now read it slower than a backwards dog rubbing it's ass on the grass.

I made reference to your choice in my post. Clearly you’re not interested in giving a proper respectful response, oh well. Can we now assume that you would vote for Smith without requiring her to give you the million dollar bribe that you’re requiring from Notley to vote for her?

Maybe one more time for good measure. You'll actually be happy to know it was a union that saved my job from auntie Rachel. Wow, now you don't know what to think do ya.

When someone says they got to keep their job due to a technicality rather than have their employment terminated, it’s almost a certainty that it was because of a Union so you’ll have to forgive me for not being surprised. Hey look at that, I guess I do know what to think after all

[timun]

Originally Posted by Slava

So, we’re accepting that Joe Ceci 2.0 is somehow going to figure it out

I don't understand why you act like such an intractable ####wit about this.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by timun

I don't understand why you act like such an intractable ####wit about this.

I don’t understand why you can’t discuss things like an adult without resorting to name calling and being so caustic. Anyway, they got bailed out by rising energy prices in the last two years of their term. It’s not hard to figure out.

[kermitology]

Originally Posted by Slava

I don’t understand why you can’t discuss things like an adult without resorting to name calling and being so caustic. Anyway, they got bailed out by rising energy prices in the last two years of their term. It’s not hard to figure out.

And what, pray tell, happened in the first two years that blew a hole in revenues requiring borrowing for operations?

You can’t conjure billions of dollars from nothing without borrowing.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by kermitology

And what, pray tell, happened in the first two years that blew a hole in revenues requiring borrowing for operations?

You can’t conjure billions of dollars from nothing without borrowing.

Sure, but there was a contributing factor in that the NDP made virtually zero cuts to anything and increased spending. The reality is they were told by ratings agencies not to take that path, and did anyway.

I get that we’re going to have the NDP back in power. I also understand there’s no other reasonable option at this point, and I’m probably grudgingly voting that way as well. But one of that means they were good fiscally.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by Slava

I don’t understand why you can’t discuss things like an adult without resorting to name calling and being so caustic. Anyway, they got bailed out by rising energy prices in the last two years of their term. It’s not hard to figure out.

Okay, but now set that resource revenue at a steady $5 Billion.
Give everyone an equal footing and compare how they do.

You do that, and all 4 NDP years are in the black (not borrowing for opperations).
The UCP on the other hand wind up with 2 of their 4 years in the red, and the ones where the UCP are in the black, it starts to look pretty close to break even.

Your response will likely be that the UCP had Covid to deal with. Sure that's fair. Why would we penalize a government for something that was out of their control? (You know, like you constantly do to the NDP).

So let's take a closer look at 2019-2020. That goes March 19-March 20, so it doesn't include the impact of Covid in any real way
Resource revenue for the UCP was higher than at any point in the NDP years.
But Operating Expenses are up $1 Billion.

Also what's that...taxes dropped...cause that's what they campaigned on.
So that's a year where the UCP borrowed to pay for operating expenses, and the majority of it is because of their own policy of lower taxes. (NDP Taxes dropped as well, that was largely due to lower mineral taxes, so tied directly to oil/gas prices, i.e. they get double whammied by low prices, UCP get to double dip on it for 21-22, and 22-23)

The NDP committed your cardinal sin because they had to (Resource revenue dropped >5 Billion)
The UCP committed your cardinal sin, in no small part because they chose to. (at least for their first year, before they really had to deal with Covid)

You just argued that the NDP made zero cuts and increase spending when a revenue drop was imposed on them.
Meanwhile the UCP made zero cuts and increase spending...and CREATED A REVENUE DROP.

Bit of an edit:

So sure, if you want to use borrowing to fund operations as a deal breaker for voting NDP, then you better be using it to disqualify the UCP as well, because I think there is case to be made that, at least the first instance of them doing it, was way more egregious than either time the NDP did it.

[Lubicon]

Sign battle on my street (Calgary NW) is now about 50/50 between UCP and NDP, the first few UCP signs appeared last night.

Anecdotally from work, I am in a small office (O&G service sector) of about 15 people. I'd say 4 or so of us keep politics to ourselves but of the remainder who voice their opinion there is unanimous support for the UCP. Which I suppose is not surprising but illustrates the uphill battle the NDP faces in Calgary.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Sign battle on my street (Calgary NW) is now about 50/50 between UCP and NDP, the first few UCP signs appeared last night.

Anecdotally from work, I am in a small office (O&G service sector) of about 15 people. I'd say 4 or so of us keep politics to ourselves but of the remainder who voice their opinion there is unanimous support for the UCP. Which I suppose is not surprising but illustrates the uphill battle the NDP faces in Calgary.

After Alberta removes itself from Canada, collapses, and then asks to come back, every Albertan should have to spend one election in a different province. It’s ####ing insane how much people talk about it in Alberta. It’s so ####ing weird, especially when you move away. It’s like hearing people in foreign countries proclaiming unwavering loyalty to their government. They sound INSANE. Brainwashed. Indoctrinated. I’m hearing about this election from friends and family, how evil the NDP is… wake up already.

[Red Slinger]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

After Alberta removes itself from Canada, collapses, and then asks to come back, every Albertan should have to spend one election in a different province. It’s ####ing insane how much people talk about it in Alberta. It’s so ####ing weird, especially when you move away. It’s like hearing people in foreign countries proclaiming unwavering loyalty to their government. They sound INSANE. Brainwashed. Indoctrinated. I’m hearing about this election from friends and family, how evil the NDP is… wake up already.

Sounds like leftist woke agenda to me. Get him!

[you&me]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

After Alberta removes itself from Canada, collapses, and then asks to come back, every Albertan should have to spend one election in a different province. It’s ####ing insane how much people talk about it in Alberta. It’s so ####ing weird, especially when you move away. It’s like hearing people in foreign countries proclaiming unwavering loyalty to their government. They sound INSANE. Brainwashed. Indoctrinated. I’m hearing about this election from friends and family, how evil the NDP is… wake up already.

Outside of checking on this thread, I would be blissfully unaware of a pending election if I was to rely on my daily interactions... It's lovely.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

After Alberta removes itself from Canada, collapses, and then asks to come back, every Albertan should have to spend one election in a different province.

I found it quite a personal growth experience to live in another province (and still do), including recently going through a provincial and municipal election. It's a very sobering process to see how other people live, operate, and think when there are different things they care about. There are a lot of similarities among provinces but priorities can be different.

I love Alberta, but growing up there it is very much a proverbial micro-climate of ideology, life expectations and pace. I didn't really see the juxtaposition until I left for a considerable amount of time. Of course other provinces have their own micro-climates too, but it's very much accentuated back home - partly because of the how loud the province is politically and how proud Albertans can be.

I still love it to pieces though and hope to come back one day. But I agree, I think Canadians should live in other provinces if they have the mobility and freedom to do so. It's a huge country and it's worth experiencing.

[Fuzz]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1654129504217071616


That time Smith donated other people's money to a "law firm" that has 2 of its "lawyers" criminal charged. What wonderful judgment she has. Looking forward to more of this kind of excellent thinking for 4 more years.

[DoubleF]

I've always wondered how many people who speak about politics are even aware of the concept of politically orphaned. I just got tongue lashed by some lady saying never to protest vote and she agreed she too along with the vast majority of Albertan's were likely politically orphaned.

Vote from the heart or strategically she said. Never take for granted your right to universal suffrage was the message.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I found it quite a personal growth experience to live in another province (and still do), including recently going through a provincial and municipal election. It's a very sobering process to see how other people live, operate, and think when there are different things they care about. There are a lot of similarities among provinces but priorities can be different.

I love Alberta, but growing up there it is very much a proverbial micro-climate of ideology, life expectations and pace. I didn't really see the juxtaposition until I left for a considerable amount of time. Of course other provinces have their own micro-climates too, but it's very much accentuated back home - partly because of the how loud the province is politically and how proud Albertans can be.

I still love it to pieces though and hope to come back one day. But I agree, I think Canadians should live in other provinces if they have the mobility and freedom to do so. It's a huge country and it's worth experiencing.

I think having a home team government does lead to people over-rating the changes that will happen if you switch governments every once in a while. Sometimes you just need to vote a party out because they are going insane (Trudeau Liberals at the Federal level at pretty much at this point as well with corruption). You can go back to them in 4 years or whatever assuming they get back on track.

But every once in a while - you just need to boot a party out so they get back on track. You could vote in the Greeniest Green Party every elected and they aren't going to crush the Alberta O&G industry in 4 years.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by DoubleF

Vote from the heart or strategically she said. Never take for granted your right to universal suffrage was the message.

That's what my grandparents always said too. Honestly, it's poignant advice. My grandfather fought for the Polish army in WWII again oppressive regimes. They would be crushed knowing that someone didn't vote / didn't care to vote - there's many people around the world that would die to be able to have an opportunity to do so.