American Politics 3.0 - Back to Brunch

[Cali Panthers Fan]

It's funny to me how the "fact of life" in America isn't seen in literally any other country on Earth. I wonder what makes America an outlier in the school shooting metric....hmm....

[Senator Clay Davis]

It's cause the purple Teletubby unleashed the gates of hell, duh.

[Texas Blueliner]

All this talk about media bias and trimming quotes when his actual statement was that he hates that school shootings are a fact of life.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

There was a lot of talk about Biden's mental decline until he dropped out.

Not sure why everybody (the media) isn't having the same conversation about Trump. He's clearly unwell.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Texas Blueliner

All this talk about media bias and trimming quotes when his actual statement was that he hates that school shootings are a fact of life.

Sorry, no. It's not a fact of life. It's a fact of American culture and laws.

And if he hates it so much, I'd like to see a meaningful proposal of policy and law from him on it. But he won't, because conservatism is about not making any changes and sticking to the old ways.

You know who else was a gun enthusiast and changed his ways after a school shooting? You know who decided to put in place common sense laws like background checks and getting rid of concealed carry laws? Tim Walz, the anti-Vance if you will.

https://www.npr.org/2024/09/05/nx-s1...z-nra-election

“Look, I know guns. I'm a veteran. I'm a hunter. I was a better shot than most Republicans in Congress and I have the trophies to prove it," he said. "But I'm also a dad. I believe in the Second Amendment, but I also believe that our first responsibility is to keep our kids safe.”

Sorry, but if someone just bemoans the problem and says "hey, more guns and officers are the solution", they're an idiot. Look at Trump almost being assassinated. He had a ####-ton of armed guards around him, and he was an inch away from dying from a crazy shooter who had easy access to weapons and a strange history.

If I come off as super pissed about this it's only because I'm trying to raise kids in this god-forsaken environment. We have armed security personnel on our kids' school campus, and it's like Fort Knox to come in and just pick up our own kid. It shouldn't be this way, and it's because nobody wants to do the right thing and just clamp the #### down on the availability of guns for all without restrictions.

It's just ####ing stupid.

[Texas Blueliner]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Sorry, no. It's not a fact of life. It's a fact of American culture and laws....

Oh I agree, he and his kind will never take the steps to solve it. But he was misquoted/had his statement manipulated. I hate it when the red ties do it, gonna hate it when the blue ties do it.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Texas Blueliner

Oh I agree, he and his kind will never take the steps to solve it. But he was misquoted/had his statement manipulated. I hate it when the red ties do it, gonna hate it when the blue ties do it.

*groan*

This is why we never do anything meaningful. "Hey those guys are bad, but these guys are equally bad".

Cool. Now where is the proposal for change in that discussion?

As long as we keep fighting each other, nothing ever happens. Congress has been in gridlock for almost a decade because it's about winning the political game, not about helping the public.

It's why I'm tired of the "both sides, many sides" discussion. It serves nothing and keeps us distracted from the real issues.

Get someone in place that will actually try to do something meaningful and good. Anything else is just bull####.

[Texas Blueliner]

My post was simply a comment on media manipulation/misreporting. NOT about gun control or lack there of.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Texas Blueliner

My post was simply a comment on media manipulation/misreporting. NOT about gun control or lack there of.

Noted. And I'm on your side on the issue generally. But it's not what's important.

The sooner we all realize this and ask our leaders to take action instead of winning points through media, the better.

We are stuck in a quagmire of rhetoric without action.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by dino7c

As someone who has voted right for 95% of my life I must say reality skews left at the moment.

Hate to break it to you, brother, but that's been the case for a very long time.

I know I'm considered "extreme left" around these parts, but I used to be about as conservative as they come. Unfortunately, conservative positions just do not hold up under any evidence-based scrutiny.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Yeah, if you're actually able to decipher anything from that verbal diarrhea, you realize that Trump apparently actually believes that putting duties and tariffs on the importing of foreign products is a tax on the origin nation, not a tax on American businesses doing the importing (which will then either go out of business or pass the increased costs on to their customers by raising prices on everything).

If you're a pro-business/anti-regulation conservative, how could you possible support Trump with what he's saying?

This is a massive oversimplification, it depends on a lot of factors.

For starters, the price of a product in a market economy is primarily decided by supply and demand, not costs. If you tax a product that's in competition with non-taxed products, it's quite unlikely that the tax will all go into the prices. Likewise if you tax a product where the product is going to sell less at a higher price point, it's likely that the seller will eat some or even all of that tax.

If you put a tax on a product where an equivalent American alternative exists, consumers are unlikely to end up paying that, at least not in full, because they can buy American.

In non-essential products people can just not buy that product and use their money on something else.

Of course if you tax something where no alternatives exist, and it's essential like energy, then taxes are likely to just go straight into consumer prices. But in most situations, things are complicated and dependent on a whole bunch of factors.

[marsplasticeraser]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

And if he hates it so much, I'd like to see a meaningful proposal of policy and law from him on it. But he won't, because conservatism is about not making any changes and sticking to the old ways.

I see "New" conservatism making a lot of changes. Major policy and legal changes that dramatically impact all citizens. Look at the changes around reproductive rights and making guns more accessible than cigarettes.

The problem is that the GOP is closer to the Taliban in their core ideologies, so the changes are baffling to the average person in most other democracies.

Ultimately, the end-goal for the GOP is a theocracy, only instead of having a religious leader they have chosen a complete jack-ass for their supreme leader.

[SutterBrother]

Originally Posted by marsplasticeraser

Ultimately, the end-goal for the GOP is a theocracy, only instead of having a religious leader they have chosen a complete jack-ass for their supreme leader.

He's a useful idiot.

He distracts the public with all his lunacy, so they won't worry about the dark money behind the GOP.

He doesn't have any actual positions. He'll just do as he's told (see the Florida 6 week abortion ban, and the "maybe we should take the guns first?" flip flop). Literally a puffed up empty suit.

He motivates the yokel base and the tech bro billionaires. They're hoping to squeeze out one more term while they incubate a slightly less erratic replacement since Meatball Ron and Weird JD weren't palatable enough.

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Hate to break it to you, brother, but that's been the case for a very long time.

I know I'm considered "extreme left" around these parts, but I used to be about as conservative as they come. Unfortunately, conservative positions just do not hold up under any evidence-based scrutiny.

The left has turned into your parents telling you to eat the green beans, brush your teeth, go to bed at a decent hour and if you can't say anything nice then don't say anything at all. Makes you think that nothing you do is right, but keeps you on the straight and narrow.

The right has turned into that fun uncle who will take you out shooting up stop signs at 3 am, catcalling the girls walking down and the sidewalk and give you your first beer. Makes you feel good short term until you end up having to learn how to drive on your own because he is passed out in the back seat.

[Itse]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1829693338565689854

[Titan2]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

FFS, Texas has purged 1MM names from their voter rolls. The fix is in.

I am not in tune enough to know if texas is in play. If not, who cares?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Titan2

I am not in tune enough to know if texas is in play. If not, who cares?

There is a good argument that it would potentially be in play if not for these types of shenanigans. In fact, Ken Paxton actually bragged that his voter discouragement / removal of voting rights strategies are the only thing that prevented Texas from being a swing state in the last election.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

There is a good argument that it would potentially be in play if not for these types of shenanigans. In fact, Ken Paxton actually bragged that his voter discouragement / removal of voting rights strategies are the only thing that prevented Texas from being a swing state in the last election.

Yeah, I don't think Texas is in play, but it does really sound like Florida is back in play. Harris and Walz are making campaign stops there, lots of Harris/Walz signs on lawns even in places like central Florida, huge surge in volunteers, etc.

Even if they can't win Florida, it'll be nice if Trump is forced to play defense there.

[Titan2]

An interesting discussion about media above.

I very much skew left in my political podcasts, Slate Political Gabfest, Pod Save America and offshoots. But I have been listening to All In as well to try to get a sense from the right. Occassionally, they make an interesting point that makes me think but usually it is just Elon and Trump taint tickling which makes me ill.

Of course my main sources of news are the Daily Show and Last Week tonight. I only partially kid.

Can anyone recomend some 'skews right' podcasts that would even out my consumption? Preferably focused on discussions about policies and proposals.

As far as actual media goes, I 'truth check' things with AP or other similar sources which don't seem to pander to one side or the other as much. WP and the NYT seem ok for the most part. The WSJ also has an interesting take most of the time if from the right.

[Ped]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Yeah, I don't think Texas is in play, but it does really sound like Florida is back in play. Harris and Walz are making campaign stops there, lots of Harris/Walz signs on lawns even in places like central Florida, huge surge in volunteers, etc.

Even if they can't win Florida, it'll be nice if Trump is forced to play defense there.

Based on the way they've been purging voters, certainly it's clear someone was afraid Texas might be in play.