Flames Owners are good guys

[BurningSteel]

https://calgaryherald.com/opinion/co...-gave-her-life


Good read. Also another "benefit" of having a pro hockey team here. I imagine there are many more stories similar in nature.

[rotten42]

But this goes against some people's agendas that Flames owners are nothing but thieving parasites that hurt fuzzy little animals. This will dampen their ability to be outraged.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by rotten42

But this goes against some people's agendas that Flames owners are nothing but thieving parasites that hurt fuzzy little animals. This will dampen their ability to be outraged.

Oh f--kin' please. The outrage has largely been targeted at Murray Edwards, and particularly heightened after it was revealed he changed his residency to London UK to avoid paying taxes... while trying to ensure that he got a shiny new toy using our taxes.


I've always heard Allan Markin's a good guy, my FIL knows him; they're neighbours.

[GullFoss]

Zomg guys. At the bottom of the arena debacle is the following:

1) it's not economic to build, or it would have already been built with private money. The gap between the cost (450-600m) and private benefit ($200-250m) is substantial

2) the flames are asking for public money to cover the difference between the private benefit and the cost. That isn't unreasonable.

3) it's not clear that the public benefit is as high as the subsidy the flames are asking for. If the public benefit doesn't exceed the public cost, the city can't agree to these terms. That also isn't unreasonable.

It's not personal and no one is being unreasonable. What's made it personal is Ken King and other staff taking shots at nenshi. And nenshi taking shots back.

It doesn't matter how good of people the flames owners are. If the public benefit doesn't meet or exceed the ask for public funds, we shouldn't use public funds to build it. If it does, then we should.

[Weitz]

Markin is definitely an interesting character. Met him while he was still at CNRL before he was forced out.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Zomg guys. At the bottom of the arena debacle is the following:

1) it's not economic to build, or it would have already been built with private money. The gap between the cost (450-600m) and private benefit ($200-250m) is substantial

2) the flames are asking for public money to cover the difference between the private benefit and the cost. That isn't unreasonable.

3) it's not clear that the public benefit is as high as the subsidy the flames are asking for. If the public benefit doesn't exceed the public cost, the city can't agree to these terms. That also isn't unreasonable.

It's not personal and no one is being unreasonable. What's made it personal is Ken King and other staff taking shots at nenshi. And nenshi taking shots back.

It doesn't matter how good of people the flames owners are. If the public benefit doesn't meet or exceed the ask for public funds, we shouldn't use public funds to build it. If it does, then we should.

All true, plus:

4) Public benefit is a nebulous concept involving tangible and intangible aspects.

5) If the City can't agree to terms and the present situation is uneconomical for the team, there's really only one solution.

[Locke]

I dont know if people have thought that the owners arent good people and even more, good Calgarians.

Unfortunately this is where the age old adage of 'its just business' seems to fall down.

They're doing what they're doing for the sake of their business, that doesnt make them good or bad people, but at the same time the City is doing what its doing for its constituents which puts people at odds and makes fans conflicted.

As fans of the team and citizens of the city we are placed in the unenviable position of being on both sides of the argument.

[pepper24]

Flames owners past and present are terrific people. Most of the owners started from humble beginnings and built their wealth through hard work and keeping that same character. Only fitting and not surprising how they give back to the community. Touching story about Amanda Lindhout.

[Shazam]

Yes, I'm sure some of them are good people.

No, it doesn't mean they deserve lots of public tax money.

EDIT: I write English good.

[Split98]

Originally Posted by rotten42

But this goes against some people's agendas that Flames owners are nothing but thieving parasites that hurt fuzzy little animals. This will dampen their ability to be outraged.

I really wish you let at least post #2 be focused on talking about this article rather than dumping on people's opinion.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by rotten42

But this goes against some people's agendas that Flames owners are nothing but thieving parasites that hurt fuzzy little animals. This will dampen their ability to be outraged.

It's too bad that "agendas" are getting in the way of simply a nice story about kindness and generosity.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Zomg guys. At the bottom of the arena debacle is the following:

1) it's not economic to build, or it would have already been built with private money. The gap between the cost (450-600m) and private benefit ($200-250m) is substantial

2) the flames are asking for public money to cover the difference between the private benefit and the cost. That isn't unreasonable.

3) it's not clear that the public benefit is as high as the subsidy the flames are asking for. If the public benefit doesn't exceed the public cost, the city can't agree to these terms. That also isn't unreasonable.

It's not personal and no one is being unreasonable. What's made it personal is Ken King and other staff taking shots at nenshi. And nenshi taking shots back.

It doesn't matter how good of people the flames owners are. If the public benefit doesn't meet or exceed the ask for public funds, we shouldn't use public funds to build it. If it does, then we should.

The owners employ Ken King, maybe they should look at hiring a better person to represent them then a guy who most of the fan base thinks is an incompetent boob.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

The owners employ Ken King, maybe they should look at hiring a better person to represent them then a guy who most of the fan base thinks is an incompetent boob.

The owners of NHL Franchises employ Gary Bettman. The fact that he does a good job aside, they do it so that he can be the Villain.

Individual owners are no different. King is the frontman. Sometimes thats all awesome and sometimes that sucks. Its his job.

[JBR]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

The owners employ Ken King, maybe they should look at hiring a better person to represent them then a guy who most of the fan base thinks is an incompetent boob.

The owners know much more about the business of the Flames, how it’s run and represented than you, myself and the entire fan base. From their perspective, who cares if the fans think KK is not running the business properly. It’s their company to run as they see fit.

[Split98]

I'd love to get back to this if we can:
"“I’m just so humbled and grateful that Amanda is alive,” the 72-year-old philanthropist said of Saturday evening. “But you know, I’m nobody in particular,” he added, modestly.

Markin acknowledged that he cut a cheque for $750,000, “back at a time when I had too much money,” to ensure Lindhout’s release from 460 days of captivity, that included bouts of torture and almost daily rapes from multiple captors."

Out here I don't know much about the owners besides what's written on CP, so I don't know much about Allan Markin. But wow, that's the kind of guy you're proud to share a country with - let alone a hockey team!

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

It's not personal and no one is being unreasonable.

That's your opinion... my opinion is that the Flames are being very unreasonable and I consider the level of deception coming from Ken King to be of such a level that it basically constitutes lying. YMMV but I consider someone lying to the public in order to extract money from the public (of which I am a part) to be personal.

God I hope he's fired or sent into "voluntary" retirement. If he'd been a straight shooter about the whole thing from the start it might be different but instead he's been a smarmy deceiver at every opportunity.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Parallex

That's your opinion... my opinion is that the Flames are being very unreasonable and I consider the level of deception coming from Ken King to be of such a level that it basically constitutes lying. YMMV but I consider someone lying to the public in order to extract money from the public (of which I am a part) to be personal.

God I hope he's fired or sent into "voluntary" retirement. If he'd been a straight shooter about the whole thing from the start it might be different but instead he's been a smarmy deceiver at every opportunity.

yep back on topic ...

[Cycling76er]

Is this a Sam Bennett thread yet?

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by Bingo

yep back on topic ...

Shrug... maybe Rotten and Gull et al shouldn't have changed it then?

Yes, Markin did a wonderful thing... and if other folk had let the conversation be just about that wonderful thing I'd have either commented on just that. If you want to go delete every comment that isn't implicitly or explicitly about that I won't object.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Parallex

Shrug... maybe Rotten and Gull et al shouldn't have changed it then?

Yes, Markin did a wonderful thing... and if other folk had let the conversation be just about that wonderful thing I'd have either commented on just that. If you want to go delete every comment that isn't implicitly or explicitly about that I won't object.

The post right above you made an attempt to put things back on track.

But all good, we certainly need another topic hammering on King and the owners.