Official (Alberta) Oil Discussion Thread

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Frankly the Alberta energy sector is under attack because its easy to attack globally and then people pick up the cause because DiCaprio thinks its important, and because a ton of money is supporting the protests.

Nobody really attacks China, because China wouldn't give a crap nor would India.

Nobody attacks the California oil field disasters because of big money, and a President that is focused on global and not national climate issues.

Nobody protests the coal industry because its not sexy and that industry protects itself like a steroid boosted wolverine with rabies.

Globally the Oilsands, really isn't the biggest issue to be tackled, but its the easiest to be attacked.

I think you have to think a bit further on that and realize a lot of that has to do with geography and perceived political influence. Most Canadian environmentalists realize they have no hope in hell of influencing companies or governments in China, and it's also not in their own backyards. People will generally pick the battles they think they can win. I would also add that comes off as a bit disingenuous when the oil industry in AB says "stop picking on us, look at China," because it sounds more like a deflection than actual concern about what the Chinese are doing.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The oilsands aren't protected like Manufacturing because of the concentration of voters in Ontario manufacturing sectors. The automotive industry is never really going to be successfully attacked because of the number of people they employ and that the automotive industry controls the narrative.

Frankly the Alberta energy sector is under attack because its easy to attack globally and then people pick up the cause because DiCaprio thinks its important, and because a ton of money is supporting the protests.

Nobody really attacks China, because China wouldn't give a crap nor would India.

Nobody attacks the California oil field disasters because of big money, and a President that is focused on global and not national climate issues.

Nobody protests the coal industry because its not sexy and that industry protects itself like a steroid boosted wolverine with rabies.

Globally the Oilsands, really isn't the biggest issue to be tackled, but its the easiest to be attacked.

Coal is very much under the gun in North America.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/...-lands-n497401

https://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/...xUI/story.html

Worldwide - perhaps not, but I doubt India and China are up in arms over oilsands either.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I think you have to think a bit further on that and realize a lot of that has to do with geography and perceived political influence. Most Canadian environmentalists realize they have no hope in hell of influencing companies or governments in China, and it's also not in their own backyards. People will generally pick the battles they think they can win. I would also add that comes off as a bit disingenuous when the oil industry in AB says "stop picking on us, look at China," because it sounds more like a deflection than actual concern about what the Chinese are doing.

Personally and I think its probably over the top, but I think there's a harden group out there that will protest what makes them the most money and gets them the most funding.

Since a country like China or India doesn't give a crap it doesn't pay to protest them.

But there's tons of funds being spread around through various trusts for people that go after things like the Oil Sands.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Regorium

That's the kind of stuff we have to deal with, so as a someone in pipelines, I think that kind of shows where we're coming from when we get cynical about "environmental issues".

I went to a public consultation armed with similar studies, and was called an "earth-raping pedophile" by a guy with dreads (so many of them have dreads).

I consulted with an FN community that tried calling a record number of sick days because, as I found out later, they though the client paid sick days, and they wanted to prolong the consultation (more money) for as long as possible. Oh, it was the purest satisfaction when I got to tell them otherwise.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Ducay

Hovering around $29.60 this morning. Might have to take this into my own hands.

Scary thing for me about oil is that it keeps making lower lows.

I would have thought a bottom would have formed by now.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by peter12

I went to a public consultation armed with similar studies, and was called an "earth-raping pedophile" by a guy with dreads (so many of them have dreads).

Please tell me it was a white guy with dreads. Those dbags are the worst.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Please tell me it was a white guy with dreads. Those dbags are the worst.

Oh absolutely. Also, the many times that I have had my picture taken by people with masks on, and then had that picture posted to the group's Facebook page with a call out for information on my address and contact info.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by peter12

Oh absolutely. Also, the many times that I have had my picture taken by people with masks on, and then had that picture posted to the group's Facebook page with a call out for information on my address and contact info.

Oh man, I love white guys with dreads who bitch about cultural destruction/appropriation with zero irony.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by peter12

Oh absolutely. Also, the many times that I have had my picture taken by people with masks on, and then had that picture posted to the group's Facebook page with a call out for information on my address and contact info.

It would be nice if you could sue them, or criminally charge them.

A lot of these really militant people are actually just complete scum bags.

the best they deserve is a good swift boot up the a$$

[peter12]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

It would be nice if you could sue them, or criminally charge them.

A lot of these really militant people are actually just complete scum bags.

the best they deserve is a good swift boot up the a$$

Kinder Morgan tried that a while ago, but the cultural milieu was not forgiving.

[LanceUppercut]

Originally Posted by peter12

Kinder Morgan tried that a while ago, but the cultural milieu was not forgiving.

So these #######s don't need to obey the laws because they are "protesting"? If the situation were reversed they would be out for blood.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by peter12

Kinder Morgan tried that a while ago, but the cultural milieu was not forgiving.

Which is ridiculous, because these morons are actually putting you in a threatening situation or exposing you to unwanted harrasment.

Again Ezra Levant is a nutbar, but I used to love it when he'd go to these protests and interview some of these people, especially the ones that showed up all over the country, had no clue about the facts that they were protesting and were the biggest racist, zionist conspiracy theory angry people ever.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by LanceUppercut

So these #######s don't need to obey the laws because they are "protesting"? If the situation were reversed they would be out for blood.

Many of the protesters that I encountered were well-trained professionals with a keen understanding of the law. In Canada, you can do almost anything in public short of touching somebody. Uttering threats (many people threatened my life and safety during my years as a pipeline consultant) is impossible to prove unless filmed. In rough spots, we were always accompanied by private security with body cameras.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Which is ridiculous, because these morons are actually putting you in a threatening situation or exposing you to unwanted harrasment.

Again Ezra Levant is a nutbar, but I used to love it when he'd go to these protests and interview some of these people, especially the ones that showed up all over the country, had no clue about the facts that they were protesting and were the biggest racist, zionist conspiracy theory angry people ever.

One of my colleagues was followed around a town he was staying in, and finally, threatened by a group while he was eating dinner.

Another of my colleagues was identified via her social media accounts, and was subject to disgusting slander and hate - including threats of sexual assault.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by peter12

Many of the protesters that I encountered were well-trained professionals with a keen understanding of the law. In Canada, you can do almost anything in public short of touching somebody. Uttering threats (many people threatened my life and safety during my years as a pipeline consultant) is impossible to prove unless filmed. In rough spots, we were always accompanied by private security with body cameras.

Personally I would be filming everything.

Then I would set up a face book page and publish it.

I am fully on board with the right to protest, and the right to free speech. But some of these more professional protesters are pretty disgusting.

One of the things that I really wanted to see implemented by the Harper government was forcing people to open their books about the money they were receiving from some of these international groups like Tides etc.

Groups like Tides Canada etc should have to show who they're receiving their donations from and if its coming from Tides in the US who its receiving that money from. Then you yank their tax free status.

[Bill Bumface]

For the graybeards, how is the feel so far compared to the 80s?

Obviously things flattened out after quite a while, I'm just wondering when I can expect the pit of despair to stop opening up, and if you somehow still have a job, how long until I don't feel like I'm looking over my shoulder waiting to be sniped at any moment?

[CaptainCrunch]

Thats a tough question, I was in my early teens.

Here's what I know, we lost our car, my parents lost their business, we almost lost the house, but ended up selling a lot of our stuff to keep it.

Downtown was dark.

There was a lot more anger, I know that much, when I talk to my old man about it there was an air of rebellion when it came to anything Ottawa.

I would think that the general layoffs, business dying and everything is going to be similar.

I think with the NEB crisis, the feeling was it would eventually stop and things would turn around. I get the sense here that nobody thinks that this is going to turn around for a long time and that we'll never fully bounce back oil industry wise.

The anger is also a lot more directed North then West as well.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The anger is also a lot more directed North then West as well.

I think I might but slow at this moment, but what does this mean?

[BigNumbers]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I think I might but slow at this moment, but what does this mean?

Anger @ Provincial NDP this time, not the Libs in Ottawa as was prevalent in 86-88 due to NEB. The West refers to anger @ BC for no pipe to tide water.

#DecryptingtheCaptain

[CliffFletcher]

I was a summer student/mail room guy at a major in the 88-91 period, and there were still layoffs every year like clockwork. A regular culling of the herd just became part of the corporate climate.