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Old 01-12-2021, 10:58 PM   #81
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Its worth it. There could be a sellers market once the trade deadline comes and cap space will be the gold for contending teams.
If it’s a sellers market maybe those depth defensemen cost an extra pick this year. Could the $60K or so make a difference in who the Flames could afford? Not impossible I guess.
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:58 PM   #82
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Didn't the Flames finish the regular season 2nd overall in the NHL and first in the Western Conference two years ago?
And what happened right after that? Help me refresh my memory.
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:59 PM   #83
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A total of five right-shooting forwards platyed for the 2020 Stanley Cup champions. I think it is an aspect of team construction whose importance is greatly exaggerated.
Plus I think about 36 percent of nhlers are right shots
Don’t know the breakdown for forward but basically it would put the flames slightly below average
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:06 PM   #84
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Assuming that's going to be our opening night roster, and comparing it to 2019 opening night:

Czarnik, Frolik, Jankowski and Ryan are replaced by Leivo, Simon, Nordström and Dubé.

Brodie, Hamonic and Kylington are replaced by Tanev, Nesterov and Välimäki.

Rittich is replaced by Markström.

Overall 7 new guys out of 20, or a 35% turnover, mostly in defense and goal. Can't disagree with that, considering I thought last season that it was our defense that was in biggest need of upgrades.

Gonna be weird without Brodie :/
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:09 PM   #85
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I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again.

Derek Ryan does nothing at 2x replacement level except win face offs and refuse to go to tough areas (elite at this)

And yet he makes ~3 mil which is generously above 2x replacement level (league min)

This team will be better off if either a) he sits on taxi all year and they get enough cap room to bring in up to an $8m / year player at the deadline or b) gets claimed on waivers and is no longer blocking guys like ruzicka, gawdin, etc.

I bet Tre wishes he’d only signed Ryan for 2 years.
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:10 PM   #86
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Yeah I like what Ryan has brought as a bottom 6 C the last two years, but I am glad his contract is up this summer

Last edited by btimbit; 01-12-2021 at 11:14 PM.
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:11 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by Flaming Homer View Post
And what happened right after that? Help me refresh my memory.
They were defeated by a team who surged into the 8th spot and has since become one of the top teams in the league lead by arguably a top 2 player
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:32 PM   #88
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They were defeated by a team who surged into the 8th spot and has since become one of the top teams in the league lead by arguably a top 2 player
Fair enough, but let’s use the context of the original comment in question. Which alludes to using one top line of Lindholm-Monahan-Gaudreau.

Lindholm 5gp 1g 1a 2pts
Monahan 5gp 1g 1a 2pts
Gaudreau 5gp 0g 1a 1pts


If your top players can’t score together in the playoffs I don’t care what they did in the regular season.

Last edited by Flaming Homer; 01-13-2021 at 06:25 AM.
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:40 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by The Boy Wonder View Post
I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again.

Derek Ryan does nothing at 2x replacement level except win face offs and refuse to go to tough areas (elite at this)

And yet he makes ~3 mil which is generously above 2x replacement level (league min)

This team will be better off if either a) he sits on taxi all year and they get enough cap room to bring in up to an $8m / year player at the deadline or b) gets claimed on waivers and is no longer blocking guys like ruzicka, gawdin, etc.

I bet Tre wishes he’d only signed Ryan for 2 years.
Don't forget the fact that Ryan reliably produces more than 3 times as many points as Nordström while being better defensively. Say what you will about plus/minus, but Nordstrom was a -6 on a Presidents Trophy-winning Boston team. Ryan was a +9 on a Flames team that barely made the playoffs.

In fact, Ryan was 7th on the Flames in points per 60 minutes among regular players. 1.759. Not much lower than Backlund and Mangiapane.
Nordstrom was 24th on the Bruins with 0.723 points per 60.

Last edited by 1qqaaz; 01-12-2021 at 11:50 PM.
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:53 PM   #90
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Ryan absolutely scores far better than replacement level, unless scoring 35 points a year no longer qualifies as any good.

He's good offensively and terrific defensively. Not sure what more you want.
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:57 PM   #91
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Pretty significant turnover (although I'm pretty sure Ryan will be in the opening lineup). Six new skaters though - hope they gel quickly after a short preseason to go along with a short season.

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Old 01-12-2021, 11:57 PM   #92
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Fair enough, but let’s use the context of the original comment in question. Which eludes to using one top line of Lindholm-Monahan-Gaudreau.
alludes*
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:01 AM   #93
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Ryan absolutely scores far better than replacement level, unless scoring 35 points a year no longer qualifies as any good.

He's good offensively and terrific defensively. Not sure what more you want.
Remind me what he did in the playoffs when it actually counts though... guy was invisible

I’d like a bottom 6 player who can throw a hit, dig out a loose puck, not be scared to skate through the middle of the ice.

You can find guys who contribute roughly the same defensively at 1/3 the cost.

He’s the destitute man’s yannic Perrault
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:01 AM   #94
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If it’s a sellers market maybe those depth defensemen cost an extra pick this year. Could the $60K or so make a difference in who the Flames could afford? Not impossible I guess.
Absolutely it could. Won't be many picks in play with the idea of a long term flat cap. Teams will become younger.
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:04 AM   #95
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Remind me what he did in the playoffs when it actually counts though... guy was invisible

I’d like a bottom 6 player who can throw a hit, dig out a loose puck, not be scared to skate through the middle of the ice.

You can find guys who contribute roughly the same defensively at 1/3 the cost.

He’s the destitute man’s yannic Perrault
There are six spots in the bottom six. There's plenty of room for rough and tumble guys like Lucic and Bennett... and also for skill guys like Ryan, who was phenomenal on the PK in the playoffs. Best on the team at preventing high-expected goal chances.
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Old 01-13-2021, 12:56 AM   #96
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Not sure I would call Ryan a “skill guy”
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:06 AM   #97
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Ryan is a key part of the bottom 6 and has been our most consistent bottom 6 forward the last two seasons.

Very versatile and does a lot of the little things on the ice right. Plus he produces at a good offensive clip no matter who his line mates seem to be.
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Old 01-13-2021, 01:43 AM   #98
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I like Ryan but let’s not pretend we can’t win without him.

Our most important forwards are the obvious eight.

I would consider the rest replaceable.

I still really like Ryan and Lucic and am still waiting to see how Leivo and Simon do but let’s not kid ourselves here.

Having said all that, we are a better team with Ryan in the lineup, especially over a guy like Nordstrom.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:03 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by Itse View Post
Assuming that's going to be our opening night roster, and comparing it to 2019 opening night:

Czarnik, Frolik, Jankowski and Ryan are replaced by Leivo, Simon, Nordström and Dubé.

Brodie, Hamonic and Kylington are replaced by Tanev, Nesterov and Välimäki.

Rittich is replaced by Markström.

Overall 7 new guys out of 20, or a 35% turnover, mostly in defense and goal. Can't disagree with that, considering I thought last season that it was our defense that was in biggest need of upgrades.

Gonna be weird without Brodie :/
When you put it that way, I think the team has improved, especially considering three of those guys from last year are still here and in reserve.

For me, high hopes that Valimaki can fill Brodie's shoes. A big ask, but I am heartened by his play in Finland and cautiously optimistic.

Should also add, Ward in for Peters...
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Old 01-13-2021, 07:53 AM   #100
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We have to remember Ryan fell to the 4th line when Ward took over and his minutes are significantly less now than when Peters used him as the 3rd line centre.


Also, Lucic is too good for the 4th line.
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