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Old 01-11-2021, 07:01 PM   #361
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Originally Posted by afc wimbledon View Post
I have no idea who either of those people are and on some level I feel proud of this.
Very confusing comment. Care to elaborate?
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Old 01-11-2021, 07:02 PM   #362
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A couple of points I would like to make in regards to my earlier post. It was late at night and sometimes I have too many thoughts in my head and don't communicate them properly when I type.

For social media, I think it's all garbage on those platforms and they are a huge reason for the anxiety, depression, division and a million other factors in our day to day life. Trump being banned or not, these companies have insane levels of power. Did Trump violate the terms and does he spew garbage on that platform? Yes, 100%. Should have been banned? Probably. Do we need to limit what power these tech companies have? Yes because they just got emboldened and even more powerful.

We also need to hold them extremely accountable. I want to see the new US administration put massive restrictions on them for fake news, have them pay publishers for their content and for them to be accountable for future election interference in all countries. Can we reasonably the Biden administration to just hammer these companies? I personally doubt they will. Who's interest are we protecting? American and global democracy or shareholders? I'll say it f*** Trump but these companies need their wings clipped. This isn't a left or right issue as much as people want to bring their own biases or political party to it. I don't even use their services since it's such trash.

As for the Ivermectin and this critical care alliance for Covid 19. I am not expert or anything but there appears to be some significant credibility with them. They are running ICU department's in some of America's largest and most successful hospitals. They have been interviewed by significant amount of mainstream media in regards to Covid, the situation in their respected hospitals, how treatment's have evolved and more.

The one Dr has been heralded worldwide for his success in treatment , workload and photo hugging an elderly patient during a personal crisis. Nicknamed the Covid Hunter. https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-53576427

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...h-varon-covid/

Another Dr was testifying before Congress on their clinical data from around the world regarding Ivermectin.

Normally media interviews and congressional testimony aren't granted unless you got something important to say regarding the topic at hand. They appear to be leaders in their field and have shown clinical data from around the world showing therapeutic benefit and from their own bedside experience.

They also bring up some very very valid questions regarding certain biases within the pharma and political world. We got Trump, pharma, Faucci, FDA, CDC, WHO saying this medicine works, and that medicine works and than all of a sudden it's a reversal.

All they are saying is that since the USA and the globe is getting crushed with Covid 19, look at this new data from late 2020 , early 2021. The current recommendations against Ivermectin in use other than from trials are from the summer of 2020, they may be out dated. Some other treatments such as Remdesivir, Hydroxycholroquine, Regeneron antibody cocktail and others have been touted as the bee's knee's without large RCT or even a thought of their effectiveness.

As I have said before, even the global vaccine rollout that is currently underway is happening without vaccine's who have completed clinical trials or even been APPROVED by local health agencies. They are only authorized for emergency use. Let's just make sure we are applying the rules evenly and let's make sure that we don't slap everybody's wrist for asking questions. Questions need to be answered and since the world is getting crushed with Covid, let's make sure we have the suggestion box wide open.

The point about podiatrists and snake oil was more of a joke. No offence to any podiatrists. More of a comment about being a leader in your field, being on the front line's of Covid 19, having in your mind and many other's some effective treatments. If you have credibility, than let's hear what you have to say.
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Old 01-11-2021, 07:18 PM   #363
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The fact that HCQ was touted as the bee's knees without an RCT is instructive.

Lots of doctors thought it worked. When the RCTs finally came around they were shown that it had no discernable benefit. Doctors are great but their experience is just anecdotal, and the plural of anecdote isn't data.

And the vaccines being rolled out have completed clinical trials (albeit small ones)
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Old 01-11-2021, 07:21 PM   #364
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@curves Please don't use apostrophes to indicate plurality, it's annoying to the reader.

As for your talking points regarding this drug you're trying to promote (ie: "leave the suggestion box wide open", etc), these are the same kind of talking points that people typically use when they want to promote a drug that does not have the approval of the medical community. We saw this song & dance before with some doctors (and a certain president) going rogue and promoting Hydroxychloroquine.

If you know of a drug that you think can help the world in its fight against covid, there are proper channels for bringing attention to that drug via the medical community. And no, there's no giant conspiracy amongst them to downplay this or any other drug.
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Old 01-11-2021, 08:30 PM   #365
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Originally Posted by Mathgod View Post
Very confusing comment. Care to elaborate?
I'm old as f and sometimes this is a good thing I guess
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Old 01-11-2021, 08:31 PM   #366
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Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug View Post
[In my best, southern drawl]

Careful there Johnny B, that sounds a whole lot like socialism...
That's fine by me. I would consider myself a supporter of both capitalism and globalisation, but the role of government should be to set the guardrails and make sure enforcement has teeth such that public interests are served. Capitalist markets bounded by socialist governance is a good situation for society. Capitalism is out of control in the US now and could do with some increased socialist guardrails protecting the public interest.
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Old 01-11-2021, 08:37 PM   #367
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Originally Posted by curves2000 View Post
A couple of points I would like to make in regards to my earlier post. It was late at night and sometimes I have too many thoughts in my head and don't communicate them properly when I type.

For social media, I think it's all garbage on those platforms and they are a huge reason for the anxiety, depression, division and a million other factors in our day to day life. Trump being banned or not, these companies have insane levels of power. Did Trump violate the terms and does he spew garbage on that platform? Yes, 100%. Should have been banned? Probably. Do we need to limit what power these tech companies have? Yes because they just got emboldened and even more powerful.

We also need to hold them extremely accountable. I want to see the new US administration put massive restrictions on them for fake news, have them pay publishers for their content and for them to be accountable for future election interference in all countries. Can we reasonably the Biden administration to just hammer these companies? I personally doubt they will. Who's interest are we protecting? American and global democracy or shareholders? I'll say it f*** Trump but these companies need their wings clipped. This isn't a left or right issue as much as people want to bring their own biases or political party to it. I don't even use their services since it's such trash.

As for the Ivermectin and this critical care alliance for Covid 19. I am not expert or anything but there appears to be some significant credibility with them. They are running ICU department's in some of America's largest and most successful hospitals. They have been interviewed by significant amount of mainstream media in regards to Covid, the situation in their respected hospitals, how treatment's have evolved and more.

The one Dr has been heralded worldwide for his success in treatment , workload and photo hugging an elderly patient during a personal crisis. Nicknamed the Covid Hunter. https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-us-canada-53576427

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...h-varon-covid/

Another Dr was testifying before Congress on their clinical data from around the world regarding Ivermectin.

Normally media interviews and congressional testimony aren't granted unless you got something important to say regarding the topic at hand. They appear to be leaders in their field and have shown clinical data from around the world showing therapeutic benefit and from their own bedside experience.

They also bring up some very very valid questions regarding certain biases within the pharma and political world. We got Trump, pharma, Faucci, FDA, CDC, WHO saying this medicine works, and that medicine works and than all of a sudden it's a reversal.

All they are saying is that since the USA and the globe is getting crushed with Covid 19, look at this new data from late 2020 , early 2021. The current recommendations against Ivermectin in use other than from trials are from the summer of 2020, they may be out dated. Some other treatments such as Remdesivir, Hydroxycholroquine, Regeneron antibody cocktail and others have been touted as the bee's knee's without large RCT or even a thought of their effectiveness.

As I have said before, even the global vaccine rollout that is currently underway is happening without vaccine's who have completed clinical trials or even been APPROVED by local health agencies. They are only authorized for emergency use. Let's just make sure we are applying the rules evenly and let's make sure that we don't slap everybody's wrist for asking questions. Questions need to be answered and since the world is getting crushed with Covid, let's make sure we have the suggestion box wide open.

The point about podiatrists and snake oil was more of a joke. No offence to any podiatrists. More of a comment about being a leader in your field, being on the front line's of Covid 19, having in your mind and many other's some effective treatments. If you have credibility, than let's hear what you have to say.
By doctors, researchers other experts in august peer reviewed journals I agree whole heartedly, but by #### wombles and other moronic numpties on social media no, no drug at all should be 'reviewed' by the idiots that are barely able to tie their shoe laces and wipe their arses that inhabit twitter and facebook, nothing important should ever be discussed on facebook or twitter, not drugs or politics, I realize that's probably not possible but that is the bar we should at least be trying to reach.
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Old 01-11-2021, 08:38 PM   #368
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Originally Posted by JohnnyB View Post
That's fine by me. I would consider myself a supporter of both capitalism and globalisation, but the role of government should be to set the guardrails and make sure enforcement has teeth such that public interests are served. Capitalist markets bounded by socialist governance is a good situation for society. Capitalism is out of control in the US now and could do with some increased socialist guardrails protecting the public interest.
It was just a joke, but meant to highlight how difficult a position that might be in the US. There is plenty of room for improvement through properly funded regulatory agencies.
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Old 01-11-2021, 10:02 PM   #369
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Originally Posted by afc wimbledon View Post
I'm old as f and sometimes this is a good thing I guess
Errrrrr... ok... half the board thumbed up your comment, so I wasn't sure if there was some kind of underlying point you were trying to make. I'm guessing there was though.
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That's fine by me. I would consider myself a supporter of both capitalism and globalisation, but the role of government should be to set the guardrails and make sure enforcement has teeth such that public interests are served. Capitalist markets bounded by socialist governance is a good situation for society. Capitalism is out of control in the US now and could do with some increased socialist guardrails protecting the public interest.
Oh absolutely. The idea that you're a socialist simply because you see the obvious flaws of LFC... is absurd. It doesn't make you a socialist, it just makes you a reasonable, sensible person.

Trump has ways that he can still communicate with his followers (or, you know, the country as a whole for a change...) He can post a video to the white house youtube channel, he can use the whitehouse.gov website, he can phone in to Fox & Fiends, etc... he has hardly been silenced...

Last edited by Mathgod; 01-11-2021 at 10:10 PM.
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Old 01-12-2021, 12:49 AM   #370
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Errrrrr... ok... half the board thumbed up your comment, so I wasn't sure if there was some kind of underlying point you were trying to make. I'm guessing there was though.

Oh absolutely. The idea that you're a socialist simply because you see the obvious flaws of LFC... is absurd. It doesn't make you a socialist, it just makes you a reasonable, sensible person.

Trump has ways that he can still communicate with his followers (or, you know, the country as a whole for a change...) He can post a video to the white house youtube channel, he can use the whitehouse.gov website, he can phone in to Fox & Fiends, etc... he has hardly been silenced...
well I suppose I was highlighting that being older means a huge chunk of modern on line culture escapes me but it is so shallow and vapid that it's a good thing.

but to be honest mostly it was that I haven't a clue who they are and yet clearly they have some level of influence, there was a Swedish DJ that died a few years ago who was massive, like U2 level massive (as explained to me by my 26 year old ex foster son) and I had literally never heard of him, not just couldn't recognize a song but wasn't in the slightest aware of his existence, it was strange to say the least
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:45 AM   #371
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Ron Paul blocked on facebook after posting article critical of big tech censorship and how they handled trump.

https://www.newsweek.com/ron-paul-bl...ndards-1560639

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"With no explanation other than 'repeatedly going against our community standards,' @Facebook has blocked me from managing my page. Never have we received notice of violating community standards in the past and nowhere is the offending post identified," Paul wrote on Twitter Monday.
Pretty quick for such an aggressive move, but it makes sense that they need to be setting precedents that they can do what they want while public sentiment is still largely in their favour. Interesting that they've also targetted one of the few staunchy anti-war politicians.


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Old 01-12-2021, 09:56 AM   #372
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Pepsi follows me around making snarky digs multiple times a week. He seems to have turned it into some kind of game. I know that’s how he gets his kicks on this forum, but I’m not interested in playing that game.

You're talking about an internet cool guy and his merry band of hyena's. I wouldn't let it bother me.
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:00 AM   #373
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It's like watching babes wander out of the woods seeing conservatives finally starting to complain about censorship on social media.

Just absolutely precious.
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:13 AM   #374
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So I just browsed Ron Paul's columns....I think I need to wash my eyes, the guy has gone off the deep end it seems. If you're into the classic "both sides, many sides" (with a few sprinkles of QAnon theories), you'll love his views for sure.

His views on the Capitol Hill riots explain it all:
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It wasn’t insurrection, despite endless repetitions to that effect by mainstream and left wing media. Insurrection means, “an act or instance of rising in revolt, rebellion, or resistance against civil authority or an established government.” What we saw was not a revolt – marchers intended to influence an upcoming actions and decisions by the Congress and the Vice President. It was not a rebellion – marchers went to the accepted headquarters of the legislature to influence them, not to replace or destroy them, or steal their stuff.

And holy ####, what happened to you Ron?
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Unlike what any self-respecting “right wing” would be after, Trump populism (and his army of 74 million) sought to expand power to the people, and disrupt elitist, politicized, administrative tyranny of the state. There is a reason Trump successfully expanded his base, year after year, with immigrants, Black and Hispanic voters, as well as young, old, men, and women of all religions, races, and occupations. These actual trends belie any accusations by mainstream media talking heads – funded by big defense and big pharma – that his supporters, or the man himself, was “right wing.”
Read the rest here for a good laugh: http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives...-insurrection/
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:24 AM   #375
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What? You mean we couldn't just take Ron at face value when he said he was banned for no reason?

Well I never...A lying politician. What has this world come to?
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:39 AM   #376
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Originally Posted by Looch City View Post
So I just browsed Ron Paul's columns....I think I need to wash my eyes, the guy has gone off the deep end it seems. If you're into the classic "both sides, many sides" (with a few sprinkles of QAnon theories), you'll love his views for sure.

His views on the Capitol Hill riots explain it all:
The best part is the complete lack of awareness as he outlines the definition of insurrection then, essentially, lays out exactly why it was insurrection.

Rising in revolt, rebellion, or resistance - "Stop the Steal"

Against a civil authority or established government - where did they think they were and who did they think was inside the building? He even says "marchers went to the accepted headquarters of the legislature".

"not to replace or destroy them" - "Hang Mike Pence"

"or steal their stuff":

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Old 01-12-2021, 10:49 AM   #377
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Slippery slope we are going down here. Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Google, texting, etc have caused violent riots (don't care your cause as anytime there is violence it is no longer a protest). I am on neither side as I think right/left are both wrong whenever there is looting/rioting/violence. There is always a middle and I think we need to get back to a balance not right or left. It is called discussion, communication and dialogue. We need to use our words more often to heal then hurt. Also go back to logic, facts not opinions and feelings.
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:50 AM   #378
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Slippery slope we are going down here. Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Google, texting, etc have caused violent riots (don't care your cause as anytime there is violence it is no longer a protest). I am on neither side as I think right/left are both wrong whenever there is looting/rioting/violence. There is always a middle and I think we need to get back to a balance not right or left. It is called discussion, communication and dialogue. We need to use our words more often to heal then hurt. Also go back to logic, facts not opinions and feelings.
I truly don't understand your point in the context of this thread
Are you saying Twitter was wrong to ban Trump because it limits discussion?
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:57 AM   #379
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Slippery slope we are going down here. Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Google, texting, etc have caused violent riots (don't care your cause as anytime there is violence it is no longer a protest). I am on neither side as I think right/left are both wrong whenever there is looting/rioting/violence. There is always a middle and I think we need to get back to a balance not right or left. It is called discussion, communication and dialogue. We need to use our words more often to heal then hurt. Also go back to logic, facts not opinions and feelings.
Tell me, where's the middle ground between fascists who attempted to violently overturn the results of a free and fair election and liberals who believe in the principles of democracy? What kind of dialogue and discussion am I supposed to have when a neo-Nazi wearing an Auschwitz shirt and a racist waving a Confederate flag?
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Old 01-12-2021, 11:01 AM   #380
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Originally Posted by Looch City View Post
So I just browsed Ron Paul's columns....I think I need to wash my eyes, the guy has gone off the deep end it seems. If you're into the classic "both sides, many sides" (with a few sprinkles of QAnon theories), you'll love his views for sure.

His views on the Capitol Hill riots explain it all:



And holy ####, what happened to you Ron?


Read the rest here for a good laugh: http://ronpaulinstitute.org/archives...-insurrection/
"What happened to you Ron?"?

This is the same guy that said he would've voted against the Civil Rights Act because the government overstepped their boundaries and business owners should be able to run their business as they see fit (including segregation!) and let the free market decide.

But oh, when a business doesn't serve him then it's real, real bad guys. It's bad news. And that's definitely why he was suspended. Definitely for no other reason. Don't worry, Matata checked the facts on this one. 100% honest Ron Paul.
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