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Old 01-13-2021, 03:55 PM   #81
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Man Scorp let Tanev play a game for us first. You sure hate that signing as much as placing Ryan on waivers
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:58 PM   #82
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Man Scorp let Tanev play a game for us first. You sure hate that signing as much as placing Ryan on waivers
It's almost as if those two things are linked...

I just don't think it made a lot of sense considering how many other defensemen signed more reasonable contracts. I think Tanev could very easily rebound next to Giordano but I think it's very fair to be skeptical of it. But I was skeptical of Lucic, too, and he was genuinely good last year, so who knows.
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:59 PM   #83
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Lol at the OEL comments. The guy is an 8 million dollar hockey player being paid 8.25M but may become a 6 million dollar hockey player before his contract is up. Barely concerning, and certainly not even the worst contract on his team.

OEL gave a list of two teams he would be willing to trade to and both teams made offers that the Coyotes turned down. If they wanted his contract gone, it would have been gone, which is not something that can be said about the actual worst contracts in the league.
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Old 01-13-2021, 03:59 PM   #84
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He played that much last year, too, fully healthy, and was genuinely not very good at all. Poor offensively, poor defensively. Do I think he could rebound? Sure. But he hasn't yet.

Lucic, on the other hand, has changed his game to the point where he's valuable as a defensive forward. Tanev is billed as a defensive defenseman but he made a guy like Quinn Hughes worse defensively when they were on the ice together.
You've gone full Blaster86 here. And you never go full Blaster86.

Tanev is a top 4 defenseman. And his contract is fair market value (for a UFA). Lucic' contract does not reflect his value. Period.

Might Tanev's contract become a bad contract in 3 or 4 years? Yes, of course. Is it now? No.

He didn't make Hughes worse last year. The coach played them together for a reason. Hughes got better as the season went on, but that has nothing to do with Tanev. Also, if you want to compare underlying stats, you need to factor in who was in net too, because the Nucks were a different team when Markstrom was in net vs when he wasn't. Just saying 'Tanev was bad because the underlying stats were bad' is lazy and meaningless.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:03 PM   #85
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We fundamentally disagree on this player, and that's fine. The games begin tomorrow and we'll both get our chance to see what happens.

But I don't think it makes any sense to call $18 million for Tanev fair market value. In this market? With the pandemic and the flat cap? Not a chance.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:07 PM   #86
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It's almost as if those two things are linked...

I just don't think it made a lot of sense considering how many other defensemen signed more reasonable contracts. I think Tanev could very easily rebound next to Giordano but I think it's very fair to be skeptical of it. But I was skeptical of Lucic, too, and he was genuinely good last year, so who knows.
You are under the impression that he was bad last year. That is where you have gone wrong. Tanev is a good defenseman.

I mean, if you want to debate whether he is worth $4.5M per year, that is something that at least warrants discussion. But you are talking like Tanev shouldn't be on an NHL roster. Which is ridiculous. He is a top 4 defenseman on any roster.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:09 PM   #87
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OEL, Ristolainen and Tanev are NOT worse than Lucic, come on.

I refused to go any further than that.
OEL was #5 on the Athletic's worst contracts list this year. Lucic didn't even make the honorable mentions list.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:09 PM   #88
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We fundamentally disagree on this player, and that's fine. The games begin tomorrow and we'll both get our chance to see what happens.

But I don't think it makes any sense to call $18 million for Tanev fair market value. In this market? With the pandemic and the flat cap? Not a chance.
It was signed before the bottom fell out of the market.

By the standard you just presented, every single contract signed in the first few days of free agency (or for the prior year, for that matter) was bad. But that isn't fair.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:10 PM   #89
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I'm not saying Tanev doesn't belong on an NHL roster at all. Not in the slightest. I think he has been a good player in the past who has endured through a couple of bad years. This year will be a litmus test indicative of whether the last two years have been an aberration or the beginning of a decline. Considering his age, I think the latter is a safer bet. But I've said many times that I think he could rebound if he finds good chemistry with Giordano.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:26 PM   #90
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Scorp, that list needs some serious editing. Duncan Keith making basically the same money and (remaining) term as Lucic? Josh Anderson, 6 years his junior? JP Pageau making less?

He doesn't have the worst contract, but it is still bad. Really bad.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:30 PM   #91
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I stand by all three of those...

- Duncan Keith is just not good anymore at all. He has been an extremely ineffective defenseman over the last three years. Far worse than Lucic has ever been.
- Josh Anderson has been good and could be good but is signed to an enormous money figure for seven more years after scoring one goal in a season. Being younger doesn't mean he's better. That contract is Clarkson-esque.
- Pageau is also signed for twice as long as Lucic and has been a relatively pedestrian player his whole career — until this past year, when his shooting percentage skyrocketed.
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:32 PM   #92
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I sure hope Lucic's shooting percentage skyrockets
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Old 01-13-2021, 04:42 PM   #93
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What exactly are you expecting Lucic to produce this year? I get that it isn't all counting stats with him, but honestly, what would be unacceptable before you move him down the list?
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Old 01-13-2021, 05:17 PM   #94
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Skinner, Bob and Karlsson for sure.
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Old 01-13-2021, 05:29 PM   #95
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Lol at the OEL comments. The guy is an 8 million dollar hockey player being paid 8.25M but may become a 6 million dollar hockey player before his contract is up. Barely concerning, and certainly not even the worst contract on his team.

OEL gave a list of two teams he would be willing to trade to and both teams made offers that the Coyotes turned down. If they wanted his contract gone, it would have been gone, which is not something that can be said about the actual worst contracts in the league.
I think you are missing the 3 years 10.5 after this year before it goes back to 6 for the final 2 years. The fact he is quite overpaid at 8M right now doesn't bode well for the next 3 years where he is getting 10.5.
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Old 01-13-2021, 05:58 PM   #96
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I'm thinking Bobrovsky or Skinner.



Also considering Karlsson especially based on what they traded him for and then doubled down with the crazy contract extension.
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Old 01-13-2021, 07:40 PM   #97
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It was signed before the bottom fell out of the market.

By the standard you just presented, every single contract signed in the first few days of free agency (or for the prior year, for that matter) was bad. But that isn't fair.
Many of them are which is why many teams stay away.

But it certainly wasn’t the least bit surprising that the UFA market was awful for players this year. Was that not rather expected?
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Old 01-13-2021, 07:47 PM   #98
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There's a decent chance Tanev underperforms his contract as early as this season, but it's not even close to one of the worst contracts in the league. There is no way he offers less than the likes of Eriksson, Ladd, and Okposo, and that's just for starters.


As for Myers, he may have had an okay season, but the chances of him even being worth half of his contract over the life of it are pretty much nil.
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