Should the Flames fire Gulutzan?

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

And he holds heirarchy over Gulutzan when things aren't going well?



You are constantly framing the idea of Cameron as PP coach as an absolute, yet are unwilling to accept that power plays are not exclusively delegated. If you really think Gulutzan has minimal to no say on the power play right now, that speaks volumes in itself.

Cameron does not go over Gulutzan's head on the PP. To say that Cameron is "the guy that is responsible for the existing PP" is to absolve many people of blame for what the PP is. If there is an issue with the PP, whether tactical or personnel-wise, then it either falls just as equally (or more) on the head coach or you are suggesting the head coach is satisfied with letting someone else tank his team.



Likewise. How do you come to the conclusion about Cameron being "responsible" for the PP? He's an assistant coach. He may be bad at his job, but his job is not solely responsible for anything. And if it is, that itself is a failing on the part of the head coach to not nip it in the bud.

I dont even know what you are arguing about anymore...again.

So I will leave you with this..

GG hired DC because of his experience in a Canadian market and to run the PP (just like he gives control of the PK to Jerrard)....thats just the way it is whether you understand it or not. It was a specific reason DC was hired as a matter of fact.

As most all guys with people below them do, he gave DC the PP and allows him to do that task. I have no doubt GG has input as well, but the actual on ice calls/techniques are coming from DC. Thats, you know, his job.

Here...from the day after he was hired.

http://calgaryherald.com/sports/hock...n-as-assistant

[midniteowl]

Originally Posted by Jetfire

I could actually see GG timidly letting Cameron run the power play all on his own and not stepping in to correct it. GG actually thought he was potentially going to get fired early last year (like 20 games in) when we came out of the gate like crap. He doesn't come across as a confident coach and I can only imagine that would rub off on the team's collective confidence, if he had major doubts only 20 games into his tenure.

I do have a pretty reliable source for the above info and am not making it up on a whim, can PM me about it if needed, just not going to put a name out publicly.

I don't doubt what you're saying at all, looking at their body language, sometimes I wonder who's actually in charge, Gulutzan or Cameron.

Cameron came across as very strong minded and Gulutzan on the other hand, quite timid.

[1_Flames_Fan]

When the players call the coach "Gully" its time to move on.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

I would answer "yes" if there were a suitable (and likely) candidate to replace him. Just don't think that D Sutter, Tippett or Hartley are any of those. There may be a reason coaches haven't been fired this year yet --- there are not a lot of reasonable replacements.

The brand of hockey the Flames are playing is miserable, boring and predictable. And, predictably, non-aggressive except when they're down by several goals with mere moments left in the game. THEN they play well (mostly).

My vote is for Gaskal to take over the PP right now.....I've seen better analysis from him (assuming Gaskal is a "him") than from anyone on the Flames team so far. And likely would have better results.

I just don't see Tre doing anything. Not now, and maybe not until after Jan 25. And maybe not even then. All of which combines to just *&^%$ me off.

But, as I started this, I just also don't see a viable alternative right now.

OTOH, he *could* start by firing Cameron - but I'm not sure he can if Cameron was GG's hire.

Thats basically where I'm at too. Gulutzan strikes me as a Dead Man Walking, the only reason he hasnt been fired into the sun is the lack of a replacement so he keeps his job by default.

GG strikes me as an excellent Assistant coach, but he just doesnt have the presence or other intangibles needed to be a Head Coach. He gets the Xs and Os but he doesnt get the games within the game or understand how to motivate and at times even manipulate his players let alone have them ready.

And that is one thing that drives me up the wall insane.

"We werent ready."

Well thanks Sherlock, all of Alberta and most of Central California picked up on that about 2 minutes in.

Tell me, what more do you need to prepare a team of Professional Athletes to play a game? What do you need to get them up for it? Do you need a handbook? An Assistant? A taser? What? Because whatever you need get it together because losing because 'we just werent ready' is unacceptable.

Its one of the major parts of the coach's job and yeah, once in a while under extenuating circumstances you'll fail at it. But they are so unprepared so often it seems like hes not even trying.

[spuzzum]

If GG was fired, who are the best coaches available for this specific group to steer them in the right direction? Sutter. Ruff. Desjardins. Keenan. Crawford. Hartley.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by spuzzum

If GG was fired, who are the best coaches available for this specific group to steer them in the right direction? Sutter. Ruff. Desjardins. Keenan. Crawford. Hartley.

Sutter, Keenan, and Hartley are no-go's right off the bat. This team as they should will not look back to move forward. Crawford does have history with Burke but he doesn't seem like a Treliving coach as his teams are typically not great defensively. Dejardins I suppose although that's a little too similar to Gulutzan. I feel it's going to be Tippett unless his relationship with Treliving wasn't as good as you think it may be when they worked together in Phoenix.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by spuzzum

If GG was fired, who are the best coaches available for this specific group to steer them in the right direction? Sutter. Ruff. Desjardins. Keenan. Crawford. Hartley.

Desjardins is a coach who GG emulates. Would be a bad hire. No more old Canuck stank near this team please.

I want them to get Ruff.

[Roof-Daddy]

If you're gonna fire the coach mid season it's better IMO to interim somebody for the rest of the season.

You don't want to get married to another coach long term (Sutter, Ruff, Tippet, etc) and then have somebody really good shake loose in the off season (Quenneville, Vigneault maybe?) and not be able to take a run at them.

Also, I wonder if we are being overly impatient with coaching due to the picks Tre dealt away this off season. It's understandable for sure, but maybe this team just isn't ready to take the next step yet and making big changes now will do more harm than good? Certainly possible, the core up front is still very young. The Jets are currently being rewarded for staying patient with Maurice and their young squad over the last two seasons, where if Jets fans had any say he would have been canned 2 or 3 years ago.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Frank MetaMusil

I want them to get Ruff.

As with Crawford I doubt Treliving would be enamoured with the lack of attention to defense.

[nemanja2306]

I'd like to hear from the people who said 'no' what is the reasoning for putting Mangipiane with literally the two worst players on the roster?

Here you have a prospect who is playing his first ever NHL game, who will probably be a bit nervous and instead of putting him in a position to succeed, you put him (certainly) in a position to fail?

His roster and line decisions are awful.

Sent from my WAS-LX1A using Tapatalk

[TheScorpion]

If Treliving fires Gulutzan, I want him to fire (Gary Oldman voice) everyone. Just figure out something that's completely different, please.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

I'd like to hear from the people who said 'no' what is the reasoning for putting Mangipiane with literally the two worst players on the roster?

Here you have a prospect who is playing his first ever NHL game, who will probably be a bit nervous and instead of putting him in a position to succeed, you put him (certainly) in a position to fail?

His roster and line decisions are awful.

Sent from my WAS-LX1A using Tapatalk

Easing a call up into the lineup by starting him on the 4th line isn't unusual. I'm not going to over-react to lines observed in practice. If Eat Bread plays well - he'll move up, much like Jankowski has.

I know people are frothing at the mouth at literally everything GG is doing right now but holy crow - the degree of over-reaction to something like this is stunning.

Often the call up would not play at all until they at least got 1 practice in.

Now I'll sit back and wait for people to melt down over the notion that perhaps starting Eat Bread on the 4th isn't completely nuts.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

If you're gonna fire the coach mid season it's better IMO to interim somebody for the rest of the season.

You don't want to get married to another coach long term (Sutter, Ruff, Tippet, etc) and then have somebody really good shake loose in the off season (Quenneville, Vigneault maybe?) and not be able to take a run at them.

Also, I wonder if we are being overly impatient with coaching due to the picks Tre dealt away this off season. It's understandable for sure, but maybe this team just isn't ready to take the next step yet and making big changes now will do more harm than good? Certainly possible, the core up front is still very young. The Jets are currently being rewarded for staying patient with Maurice and their young squad over the last two seasons, where if Jets fans had any say he would have been canned 2 or 3 years ago.

I know this will be unpopular but when Cameron took over the Senators with 55 games remaining after a disastrous start to the 2014/15 season he coached them to .655 hockey for the rest of the season into the playoffs. He's a hot head and maybe enough of a change from Gulutzan to light a fire under this team for the remainder of the season. Give that a try and see what happens then the team can conduct a thorough search for the next head coach in the offseason.

[OldSam]

A taser. What a great idea, Locke. I'd prefer a cattle prod myself.

[Hey Connor, It's Mess]

One of the things I don't understand is that despite Bennett showing great chemistry with Gaudreau in the pre-season, he's never been tried on that line once in the regular season. With the top line struggling recently, would it hurt to try Bennett on the right wing? Or Tkachuk?

[Manhattanboy]

And now the end is nigh.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

I'd like to hear from the people who said 'no' what is the reasoning for putting Mangipiane with literally the two worst players on the roster?

Here you have a prospect who is playing his first ever NHL game, who will probably be a bit nervous and instead of putting him in a position to succeed, you put him (certainly) in a position to fail?

His roster and line decisions are awful.

Sent from my WAS-LX1A using Tapatalk

Because the team already had 3 established lines who’ve all practiced and played with eachother for weeks or months. To throw a new kid from the minors into a heavy pressure role while playing a lot of minutes in his first NHL game would have actually been the most foolish of moves.

GG made the right decision. Playing Mangiapane on his correct side while easing him into the line up and pace of play worked out really well because the 4th line was actually the best line of the 1st period.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I know this will be unpopular but when Cameron took over the Senators with 55 games remaining after a disastrous start to the 2014/15 season he coached them to .655 hockey for the rest of the season into the playoffs. He's a hot head and maybe enough of a change from Gulutzan to light a fire under this team for the remainder of the season. Give that a try and see what happens then the team can conduct a thorough search for the next head coach in the offseason.

If you're willing to give a shot to a guy who's team caught fire a single time in the second half, why not someone who has done the same thing 2/2 times?

I just don't want Cameron to be head coach because when he loses 2 games in a row, the conversation will turn to outrage over his transitions lenses. Can't be a serious coach with presence and coach-y demeanor with transitions lenses.

[Freeway]

Gulutzan runs the bench. The on-ice product is entirely up to him. He may delegate the intricacies of the PP and PK and forward and defensive deployments somewhat, but it's ultimately all on him.

Similarly, Treliving runs hockey ops. He may delegate the day-to-day of pro and amateur scouting or the AHL team to others, but it's ultimately all on him.

[The Fonz]

Was curious about how well we're doing in regulation since GG's arrival, compared to our divisional rivals:

ANA 55-37 .598, 10-7 PO
SJ 54-41 .568, 2-4 PO
EDM 50-45 .526, 7-6 PO
LA 42-46 .477
CGY 44-49 .473, 0-4 PO
VAN 34-51 .400
ARZ 24-69 .258

Also included the playoff stats if applicable.

Now I'm late for supper, so not able to comment further just yet, but figured I'd share.