Johnny Gaudreau: Trade or Keep?

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Yeah Barry Trotz and Craig Berube won the last two Stanley Cups and my take is they are very similar type of personalities to Bill Peters.

I don't think you need to be a "soft" coach at all to win in the new NHL.



I actually wonder if part of the reason that Peters has lost the room is from not holding his top guys accountable.

What type of "punishment" have Gaudreau, Monahan, etc had for their poor play this season?

Maybe they should see reduced ice time and being sat more if the poor play continues.

That doesn't jive at all with what I've heard about Peters. The opposite really.

Berube is transparent, doesn't mince words.

From what I was told about Peters, he keeps guys in the dark, makes examples out of guys without explanation. Some guys got a seat in the doghouse and never earn an opportunity to get out because they don't know what they did to land there.

Other guys get a pass or are collectively punished.

Some coaches believe they need to keep everyone off balance, coach from fear, to get results. Marc Crawford i've heard was very much like this. Hair trigger personality motivating from fear. Emasculating. Challenging and then undercutting.

The thing a 'player coach' does better than any other coach is get his players to see things from his point of view, to explain things in such a way as to promote buy-in.

Rick Tocchet is apparently a real players coach, and he's one of the hardest edges in the league. Rod Brind'Amour is a very intense guy, but everyone knows where they stand.

Someone told me that Laviolette was like the opposite of Peters. Constantly communicating. Explaining, teaching, pushing. His approach is if guys aren't getting it, it's because he's not communicating it effectively.

From the outside we all associate being tough with being successful, but the game is filled with brutal taskmasters that are being weeded out because the game just isn't played like that any more.

[SportsJunky]

THN article from today has some Gaudreau speculation. The author doesn't believe Johnny will be moved. https://thehockeynews.com/news/artic...keep-an-eye-on

Sam Carchidi of The Philadelphia Inquirer believes the Flyers should be front of the line if Gaudreau is available. Citing the winger’s youth, skill, South Jersey roots and affordable $6.75-million cap hit, Carchidi feels he would be a good addition to the Flyers’ core. Carchidi acknowledged landing Gaudreau would cost the Flyers some high draft picks. If the Flames want more immediate help, he proposed including a veteran winger such as Jakub Voracek or James van Riemsdyk in the deal.
Over the weekend, the New York Post’s Larry Brooks wondered if the Flames would consider swapping Gaudreau for New Jersey Devils left winger Taylor Hall if Calgary could re-sign him to a contract extension. Hall, 28, is slated to become an unrestricted free agent next July.

[Toonage]

Brooks is probably closer to the mark than Carchidi.

Neither is going to be right though.

[Torture]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

That doesn't jive at all with what I've heard about Peters. The opposite really.

Berube is transparent, doesn't mince words.

From what I was told about Peters, he keeps guys in the dark, makes examples out of guys without explanation. Some guys got a seat in the doghouse and never earn an opportunity to get out because they don't know what they did to land there.

Other guys get a pass or are collectively punished.

Some coaches believe they need to keep everyone off balance, coach from fear, to get results. Marc Crawford i've heard was very much like this. Hair trigger personality motivating from fear. Emasculating. Challenging and then undercutting.

The thing a 'player coach' does better than any other coach is get his players to see things from his point of view, to explain things in such a way as to promote buy-in.

Rick Tocchet is apparently a real players coach, and he's one of the hardest edges in the league. Rod Brind'Amour is a very intense guy, but everyone knows where they stand.

Someone told me that Laviolette was like the opposite of Peters. Constantly communicating. Explaining, teaching, pushing. His approach is if guys aren't getting it, it's because he's not communicating it effectively.

From the outside we all associate being tough with being successful, but the game is filled with brutal taskmasters that are being weeded out because the game just isn't played like that any more.

I've never coached a hockey team. But I would imagine the fundamentals of leadership and management in the business world apply.

Based on what you said, playing for Peters sounds like a nightmare. How can you improve if you don't know where you stand?
Laviolette sounds like a great leader.

[Roof-Daddy]

lol could you imagine the Flames trading Gaudreau, and having an older, more expensive and lower producing winger like Voracek or JVR as the main piece coming back?

Great idea fella.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

THN article from today has some Gaudreau speculation. The author doesn't believe Johnny will be moved. https://thehockeynews.com/news/artic...keep-an-eye-on

Nice proposals..

Gaudreau isn't going, and if he does, it wouldn't be for couple picks and spare parts/aging vets, or solely Hall who is not as good and will be more expensive.

Try again Brooksie.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

lol could you imagine the Flames trading Gaudreau, and having an older, more expensive and lower producing winger like Voracek or JVR as the main piece coming back?

Great idea fella.

Same thing with Hall. Older, produces less, and will likely cost $2 million+ more per season.

[GioforPM]

You know, with guys with a solid history of production like Gaudreau, perhaps they've earned some rope. I remember in 2011-12 Ovie sunk to "only" 65 points and was kind of lazy. People said he was on the way out, they should trade him, etc. Joe Thornton dipped pretty dramatically in 03-04 and got traded the next year. Bad move.

there's lots of other examples.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Hall doesn't look like the same player pre-injury. Hes been almost a non-factor for NJ so far

[chedder]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

You know, with guys with a solid history of production like Gaudreau, perhaps they've earned some rope. I remember in 2011-12 Ovie sunk to "only" 65 points and was kind of lazy. People said he was on the way out, they should trade him, etc. Joe Thornton dipped pretty dramatically in 03-04 and got traded the next year. Bad move.

there's lots of other examples.

I've been tough on Johnny since last year's playoff embarrassment but maybe, hopefully, his slump has been entirely to do with the now ex coach? He seems like the type of young player that would not do well under a tyrrant. Hoping for the best going forward. That said, if he doesn't pick it up and/or prove something in the playoffs I think you have to look at trading him this summer.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

You know, with guys with a solid history of production like Gaudreau, perhaps they've earned some rope. I remember in 2011-12 Ovie sunk to "only" 65 points and was kind of lazy. People said he was on the way out, they should trade him, etc. Joe Thornton dipped pretty dramatically in 03-04 and got traded the next year. Bad move.

there's lots of other examples.

Patrick Kane is another example. He dipped to 66 points in 82 games during his 24 year old season. He's done pretty good since then.

[Badgers Nose]

Remember how it felt watching Marty St. Louis hoist the Cup?

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

Remember how it felt watching Marty St. Louis hoist the Cup?

This/thread

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

Remember how it felt watching Marty St. Louis hoist the Cup?

i don't remember this at all.

the whole night is missing.

[Strange Brew]

I have spent zero seconds of my life watching anything that happened that night after the final whistle.

[bubbsy]

I agree that Gaudreau shouldn't be moved, but there needs to be another high end playmaker/finisher added to this team, ideally a C.

Monahan is a level below a true/elite #1 C, and Backlund is back to being a level below a contending team's #2 C, offensively.

I don't think midyear trade is possible to rectify this. Either this strange year continues and you hopefully draft this piece (byfield, mmm) or use a core piece to upgrade (Monahan, Backlund, Giordano, hanifan being pieces i think the flames use to get it).

[DJones]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

I agree that Gaudreau shouldn't be moved, but there needs to be another high end playmaker/finisher added to this team, ideally a C.

Monahan is a level below a true/elite #1 C, and Backlund is back to being a level below a contending team's #2 C, offensively.

I don't think midyear trade is possible to rectify this. Either this strange year continues and you hopefully draft this piece (byfield, mmm) or use a core piece to upgrade (Monahan, Backlund, Giordano, hanifan being pieces i think the flames use to get it).

Ya this is my thought, I'd trade pretty much anyone if we could get an upgrade on Monahan but that seems unlikely so wait for the summer.

[ComixZone]

If this year goes off the rails, I'd consider moving Gaudreau at the draft - and sure, if the Flyers wanted to include JVR, I'd be okay with that...so long as it was for cap purposes and the deal included their 2020 and 2021 first round draft picks, as well as a good prospect.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

If this year goes off the rails, I'd consider moving Gaudreau at the draft - and sure, if the Flyers wanted to include JVR, I'd be okay with that...so long as it was for cap purposes and the deal included their 2020 and 2021 first round draft picks, as well as a good prospect.

JVR+Myers+Frost do it for ya?

[Dube]

Originally Posted by Nadal Fan

Keep him, but build around him. It's not like he is making $10 mill a year. Chicago was able to win multiple Cups with Patty Kane as their best player because they put a great team around him with multiple scoring threats.

Trading a good players for multiple okay players didn't work out when we traded Phaneuf to the Leafs.

Lol Johnny couldn’t hold a candle to Kane