The intellectual dark web

[icecube]

UNDRIP "provides a framework for justice and reconciliation, applying existing human rights standards to the specific historical, cultural and social circumstances of Indigenous peoples."

The United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples (“UN Declaration” or “UNDRIP”) passed on September 13, 2007, by an overwhelming majority of the United Nations General Assembly. One hundred and forty-four member States voted in favor of the UNDRIP, only eleven abstained, and only four (Australia, Canada, New Zealand, and the United States) voted against it.

At its core, is the UN Declaration’s recognition of indigenous peoples’ right to self-determination to “freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic, social and cultural development.” As explained by former U.N. Special Rapporteur on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, James Anaya, the right of self-determination is "to be full and equal participants in the creation of the institutions of government under which they live and, further, to live within a governing institutional order in which they are perpetually in control of their own destinies."

A copy of this report can be downloaded and read at this website

https://www.kairoscanada.org/what-we...-rights/undrip

[icecube]

In June 2015, the TRC released an Executive Summary of its findings along with 94 "calls to action" regarding reconciliation between Canadians and Indigenous peoples. The Commission officially concluded in December 2015 with the publication of a multi-volume report that concluded the school system amounted to cultural genocide. The National Centre for Truth and Reconciliation, which opened in November 2015, is home to the research, documents, and testimony collected during the course of the TRC's operation.

The calls to action can be read here. It's only a few pages long and contains solutions in areas of Child Welfare, Education, Language and Culture, Health, and Justice...

http://www.trc.ca/websites/trcinstit...n_English2.pdf

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Holy cherry-picking, Batman!

Were those not blanket statements you made? And do you understand what cherry picking is? Confronting you about specific statements you make is not cherry picking, nor am I taking them out of context. You specifically said that, amoung other things, "Why is it that your Asian co-worker is quiet and causes the least trouble?" That's nonsense. It's a blanket statement and all it takes is one anecdote from me, or anyone else to prove it wrong. Same with the other ones I highlighted. Now, perhaps you have an inherent bias, being Asian, that you think all these things to be true for 100% of Asians, but I can assure you, it is not.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Were those not blanket statements you made? And do you understand what cherry picking is? Confronting you about specific statements you make is not cherry picking, nor am I taking them out of context. You specifically said that, amoung other things, "Why is it that your Asian co-worker is quiet and causes the least trouble?" That's nonsense. It's a blanket statement and all it takes is one anecdote from me, or anyone else to prove it wrong. Same with the other ones I highlighted. Now, perhaps you have an inherent bias, being Asian, that you think all these things to be true for 100% of Asians, but I can assure you, it is not.

If you're going at it that way, then one anecdote can disprove anything. There is no discussion to be had if we're going down to that micro of a level every time.

We're trying to discuss trends and solutions. Let's hear your side.

[Fuzz]

Ok, my side is it sounds a bit racist of you to give reasons why Asians do better than blacks on the sole basis that they work harder and keep their head down and are non-confrontational,. all statements which are your opinion, not based on fact.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Ok, my side is it sounds a bit racist of you to give reasons why Asians do better than blacks on the sole basis that they work harder and keep their head down and are non-confrontational,. all statements which are your opinion, not based on fact.

Of course it's my opinion. I'm opining on facts and discussions that GGG, icecube and others are discussing.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by icecube

The calls to action can be read here. It's only a few pages long and contains solutions in areas of Child Welfare, Education, Language and Culture, Health, and Justice...

http://www.trc.ca/websites/trcinstit...n_English2.pdf

Thanks again. I really like it. I've read that some reservations are very successful and well-run and some reservations less so.

[sworkhard]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Can we improve work ethic in groups?

A big problem with reserves is the Indian act prevents them from having real property rights as they usually don't own the underlying title to the land they are on. As such, there's very little motivation for individuals to do productive things on the reserve. The Nisga'a is the only example I'm aware of that successfully negotiated rights to the underlying title and then subsequently privatized it's land, ultimately providing the motivation for people to maintain and develop property and wealth.

[SebC]

First Nations people ask the rest of Canada to give them equal outcomes while resisting participation in the culture and institutions that create those outcomes. Until they change that, their outcomes will suffer for it.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by SebC

First Nations people ask the rest of Canada to give them equal outcomes while resisting participation in the culture and institutions that create those outcomes. Until they change that, their outcomes will suffer for it.

Threads like this are good because it allows ignoramuses with racist beliefs to out themselves.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by icecube

Threads like this are good because it allows ignoramuses with racist beliefs to out themselves.

Found the well-poisoner.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by SebC

Found the well-poisoner.

Yeah, look in the mirror pal. What do you hope to accomplish with a post like yours? You don't think what you said is racist at all?

You're post was the typical "blah blah handouts" victim blaming bullcrap. I'm fed up with it and I'll call it out for the thinly veiled racism it is every time I see it from now on.

It's funny how racist people don't like being called out for spouting racism.

You don't think there are plenty of First Nations out there that live productive, healthy lives? For the most part those that are successful have suffered less trauma and have more healthy supports in their family, friends or communities.

You think that the one's whose lives are dysfunctional enjoy being poor and self medicating their pain with addictions?

Do you still not understand why First Nations who are dysfunctional are the way they are?

Everyone wants to be happy and function normally. It isn't as simple as hard work for a lot of people whose lives are in the gutter compared to yours. Have some god damn compassion and empathy.

[SebC]

Racism is treating people differently because of their race... which is exactly what maintaining different rights and responsibilities for first nations people is.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by SebC

Racism is treating people differently because of their race... which is exactly what maintaining different rights and responsibilities for first nations people is.

Yes. I agree that it is racist and shameful that Canada treats First Nations like second class citizens. Why do they maintain better rights for non indigenous people?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by SebC

Racism is treating people differently because of their race... which is exactly what maintaining different rights and responsibilities for first nations people is.

Racism also includes sweeping generalisations of an entire race, especially those that posit that race as inferior or otherwise less than one’s own.

You know, sweeping generalisations like “First Nations people ask the rest of Canada for equal outcomes... “ etc.

It’s either racist, ignorant, or poorly worded. It’s not really something to stand behind either way. It was a stupid post.

Not to say you personally are any of those things, people just often don’t think, and just speak without putting it together.

EDIT: I’d also be curious as to what “participating in Canadian culture” looks like to the types of people that suggest it be a requirement. Namely, a definition of what that IS, without resorting to laziness that is no more than naming the “First Nations things” they should stop doing.

How do you define Canadian culture? And how do you separate those contributing to your version of it, and those who aren’t?

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by sworkhard

A bit problem with reserves is the Indian act prevents them from having real property rights as they usually don't own the underlying title to the land they are on. As such, there's very little motivation for individuals to do productive things on the reserve. The Nisga'a is the only example I'm aware of that successfully negotiated rights to the underlying title and then subsequently privatized it's land, ultimately providing the motivation for people to maintain and develop property and wealth.

There has to be a way to move reserves closer to cities. It's very hard to adequately service some communities that are remote and have very small populations.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

There has to be a way to move reserves closer to cities. It's very hard to adequately service some communities that are remote and have very small populations.

No different than remote rural communities.

Newfoundland is buying out people's house to shutdown towns.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by SebC

Racism is treating people differently because of their race... which is exactly what maintaining different rights and responsibilities for first nations people is.

Fulfilling contracts which you have failed to live up to for over a hundred years is significantly different that maintaining different rights for different people.

[DiracSpike]

"Participating" means joining the rest of us in cities that are consistently rated the most livable in the world and leaving reservations where the drug abuse, teen pregnancy, suicide, single motherhood, crime, illiteracy, and alcoholism rates are all sky high.

I should add, it's not their fault that they're born into these environments. I just truly believe that most FN people would be better off living with the rest of the population because most reserves are objectively terrible places to grow up and live.

[sworkhard]

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

"Participating" means joining the rest of us in cities that are consistently rated the most livable in the world and leaving reservations where the drug abuse, teen pregnancy, suicide, single motherhood, crime, illiteracy, and alcoholism rates are all sky high.

I should add, it's not their fault that they're born into these environments. I just truly believe that most FN people would be better off living with the rest of the population because most reserves are objectively terrible places to grow up and live.

I don't know the stats, but I'd be surprised if most FN people don't already live outside reserves for that reason.