Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Go Back   Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community > Main Forums > Fire on Ice: The Calgary Flames Forum
Ivrnet

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 10-10-2018, 05:21 PM   #21
Bouw N Arrow
First Line Centre
 
Bouw N Arrow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Exp:
Default

Atta boy Raanta, now if only the Yotes could score a ####ing goal!
Bouw N Arrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 06:10 PM   #22
Magnum PEI
First Line Centre
 
Magnum PEI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen View Post
I was going to make a list of the centres that have more goals than Monahan over the last 3 years to talk about how this list was nonsense to leave Monahan off as only Crosby, Tavares, Malkin, Seguin and Pavelski do. However, I realized that Pavelski was left off the list. What the ####?

If you don't have Pavelski as a top 20 centre due to your data analyzing method, it's time to look at new ways to analyze because you ####ed up.
Pavelski was listed as RW until last year. It's a bit questionable because he took more draws than Thornton and Thornton usually played on the right boards in the O-zone.
Magnum PEI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 06:44 PM   #23
Oling_Roachinen
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magnum PEI View Post
Pavelski was listed as RW until last year. It's a bit questionable because he took more draws than Thornton and Thornton usually played on the right boards in the O-zone.
I would cut the guy a break and assume he had Pavelski at center as he had prior. Otherwise, if his stats are arguing that Atkinson and Craig Smith had been better right wingers over those last three years, how could even he take his stats seriously?
Oling_Roachinen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 07:19 PM   #24
jlh2640
Powerplay Quarterback
 
jlh2640's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Regina
Exp:
Default

Mono should be there. Happy Smith got his ranking
jlh2640 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 07:49 PM   #25
Love
Powerplay Quarterback
 
Love's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Exp:
Default

No Monahan????

Oh wait. That was obvious lol. An objective breath of fresh air is always nice.
Love is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 07:52 PM   #26
ForeverFlameFan
Franchise Player
 
ForeverFlameFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Love View Post
No Monahan????

Oh wait. That was obvious lol. An objective breath of fresh air is always nice.
Ok
ForeverFlameFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 08:15 PM   #27
Always Earned Never Given
Backup Goalie
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen View Post
Here's a definitive list of the top 10 left wingers over the last 3 years, as produced by NHL.com. While I chose the criteria used, because the result was from strictly data, it's not an opinion it's entirely fact. Because it's entirely data, there's no way to criticize it. Checkmate. Sorry Gaudreau fans, he didn't quite make the cut - in fact he's not in the top 30. He must really be overrated as data can't be manipulated.

What? That doesn't make sense as Gaudreau had over 220 points in the past 3 seasons. Plus another 7 this year as stats you pulled out also includes games this year.
Always Earned Never Given is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 08:20 PM   #28
ForeverFlameFan
Franchise Player
 
ForeverFlameFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen View Post
Here's a definitive list of the top 10 left wingers over the last 3 years, as produced by NHL.com. While I chose the criteria used, because the result was from strictly data, it's not an opinion it's entirely fact. Because it's entirely data, there's no way to criticize it. Checkmate. Sorry Gaudreau fans, he didn't quite make the cut - in fact he's not in the top 30. He must really be overrated as data can't be manipulated.

What list are you looking at? Because if we are looking back 3 years (15/16, 16/17,ad 17/18) then Gaudreau is in 5th place with 223 points in 231 games. I don't know where you are pulling your stats from.

Check mate, Gaudreau is a top 5 LW.
ForeverFlameFan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 08:26 PM   #29
Always Earned Never Given
Backup Goalie
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan View Post
What list are you looking at? Because if we are looking back 3 years (15/16, 16/17,ad 17/18) then Gaudreau is in 5th place with 223 points in 231 games. I don't know where you are pulling your stats from.

Check mate, Gaudreau is a top 5 LW.
Top 3 as his stats include this year's games so tied with Ovi at 230..and by the end of the year, should be close to 1st...
Always Earned Never Given is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 08:27 PM   #30
djsFlames
Franchise Player
 
djsFlames's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Where opinions are fact
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Textcritic View Post
It drives me crazy to see Leon Draisaitl continuously classified as a centre. He may play a considerable amount of time down the middle, but his offence is a product of playing on the wing. If he spent an entire season centring the second line he would not come close to touching lists like these.
Truth.

A very good complimentary winger but a complimentary winger none the less. He isnt the straw that stirs the drink. As a center he's signifucantly less proven than Monahan tbf.
djsFlames is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 08:32 PM   #31
Vox
Scoring Winger
 
Vox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Calgary, AB
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Always Earned Never Given View Post
What? That doesn't make sense as Gaudreau had over 220 points in the past 3 seasons. Plus another 7 this year as stats you pulled out also includes games this year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan View Post
What list are you looking at? Because if we are looking back 3 years (15/16, 16/17,ad 17/18) then Gaudreau is in 5th place with 223 points in 231 games. I don't know where you are pulling your stats from.

Check mate, Gaudreau is a top 5 LW.
Um, I believe he is making the point that by selecting whatever criteria he wants he can make the list look like whatever he wants, and by not telling you what the criteria is, he is pointing out a flaw in the process. Or, more simply put - sarcasm.

Of course, if you already knew this and are assisting his sarcasm, then bad on me. If on the other hand he is serious - then I quit.
Vox is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Vox For This Useful Post:
Old 10-10-2018, 08:42 PM   #32
the2bears
Franchise Player
 
the2bears's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Bay Area
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Love View Post
No Monahan????

Oh wait. That was obvious lol. An objective breath of fresh air is always nice.
Sadly predictable post from you.
__________________
the2bears - the indie shmup blog.
the2bears is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2018, 09:32 PM   #33
Oling_Roachinen
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan View Post
What list are you looking at? Because if we are looking back 3 years (15/16, 16/17,ad 17/18) then Gaudreau is in 5th place with 223 points in 231 games. I don't know where you are pulling your stats from.

Check mate, Gaudreau is a top 5 LW.
http://www.nhl.com/stats/player?aggr...,goals,assists

The list was based on a combination of offense and defense. For offense, I used point production over the last 3 years. For defense, I thought it was important for a player to be able to push people out of the way, therefore I used height as a criteria.

The point was in response to CorsiHockeyLeague's assertion that stats like these are not opinion. They are. They are based on many assumptions and opinions that can easily make them biased or near useless, like my list -despite it being formed by only data. Pavelski, a player on a team I don't like, representing a national team of a rival, there's no bias there. But, weighted or not, over the last three years he's been a top 20 complete center, a list without him, in my opinion, is invalid. His omission should be used as reason to relook at the data, not argue that Pavelski wasn't a top 20 center (or right winger if that's what he put him as).
Oling_Roachinen is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Oling_Roachinen For This Useful Post:
Old 10-10-2018, 09:38 PM   #34
DeluxeMoustache
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Exp:
Default

^ haha. Using size as a criterion.

For some reason brought this to mind.

DeluxeMoustache is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to DeluxeMoustache For This Useful Post:
Old 10-10-2018, 09:57 PM   #35
Bend it like Bourgeois
#1 Goaltender
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Exp:
Default

Ugh the stats crowd has really jumped the shark of late.

The plural of numerical anecdotes is not stats, data, or even close to facts.

It’s like an entire industry spring up around the CP posters ‘grit index’ of a couple years ago. Random dudes making stuff up but assigning it a value so it becomes ‘stats’.
Bend it like Bourgeois is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Bend it like Bourgeois For This Useful Post:
Old 10-11-2018, 01:25 AM   #36
FBI
Franchise Player
 
FBI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Flames fan in Seattle
Exp:
Default

Hey Love, how many goals does Monahan have to score to make you like him this year? Would 40 be satisfactory? 50? If he scores 60 is he still useless?
__________________

(F)oo (B)ennett Jankowsk(I)
FBI is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 07:32 AM   #37
driveway
A Fiddler Crab
 
driveway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Taipei, Taiwan
Exp:
Default

What this shows me is that Mark Giordano is the most underrated player in the NHL by a country mile.

Been one of the five best defensemen in the league every single year since ... what 2010? 2011? Finished 6th, 8th, 10th, 16th! in Norris voting. And I'll bet you could find a metric ton of people who would rather have Gostisbeher or Reilly or for that matter Hamilton on their team.

Sure, youth, blah blah Giordano is better today and has been better for most of a decade
driveway is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to driveway For This Useful Post:
Old 10-11-2018, 05:37 PM   #38
Party Elephant
Powerplay Quarterback
 
Party Elephant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Queenstown, NZ
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by driveway View Post
What this shows me is that Mark Giordano is the most underrated player in the NHL by a country mile.

Been one of the five best defensemen in the league every single year since ... what 2010? 2011? Finished 6th, 8th, 10th, 16th! in Norris voting. And I'll bet you could find a metric ton of people who would rather have Gostisbeher or Reilly or for that matter Hamilton on their team.

Sure, youth, blah blah Giordano is better today and has been better for most of a decade
Gostisbehere is a stud and one of if not the best power play QB in the league. But yeah no way I would take Reilly over Gio.
Party Elephant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-11-2018, 08:33 PM   #39
driveway
A Fiddler Crab
 
driveway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Taipei, Taiwan
Exp:
Default

Gostisbehere is a very good defenseman. I’d love him on the Flames. He is not now as good as Gio and he has never been as good as Gio at any point so far. He may surpass him, but I am doubtful, and if I was running a team the youth factor would be a huge bonus in Ghost’s favor.

However, if I needed to win tonight and had to choose between the two, I’d take Gio and it wouldn’t be a hard choice at all.
driveway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-2018, 02:37 AM   #40
Party Elephant
Powerplay Quarterback
 
Party Elephant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Queenstown, NZ
Exp:
Default

Gostisbehere is a badass on the point during power plays. He has a cannon of a shot, and his vision and distribution are among the best in the league. Defensively I still prefer Gio though.
Party Elephant is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:16 PM.

Calgary Flames
2017-18




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Calgarypuck 2016