You Know What Really Grinds My Gears? Now with 3x more gears...

[bc-chris]

Originally Posted by Locke

I have ranted about this a million times, but we have to breed better pedestrians.

Having 'Right of Way' is all well and good, but its small consolation if you get hit by a car.

I love it when a pedestrian looks into traffic, makes eye-contact, makes sure they see me and I see them and that traffic is stopping for them before just stepping into the road.

But too often you see the pedestrians with their headphones in, hoodie up and eyes glued to the phone and just walking into the street without making sure its safe.

"Oh, they'll stop for me, I have the right of way!!"

Cyclists are just a Wild Card. You just never know what they're going to do, I try and avoid them like the plague.

There are good ones and there are terrible ones, but you never know which is which and they are unpredictable.

Even just today, I was behind a cyclist and he was on the road then quickly pulled over into a crosswalk through an intersection and then proceeded on the sidewalk.

Okay, nothing bad happened there, but prior to him doing that was there any way I could have predicted he'd switch from vehicle to pedestrian on a whim? Not a chance.

And regardless of whether you're a Cyclist, Pedestrian or Motorist, you have to be aware of whats happening around you. You can listen to music, but make sure you can still hear whats happening around, you should never deprive yourself of one of your senses when in any form of traffic.

Do you need to have your hoodie up to kill your peripheral vision? Do you need to have your music so loud you cant hear ambient noise? Do you need to be looking at your cell phone tunneling your sight away from your surroundings?

Its just common sense but it happens so often and thats how bad things occur.

And honestly, I'll echo your sentiment about cell phones and driving. Easily one of the most dangerous things you can do. If you're looking at your cell phone you are not paying attention to what is happening around you and even slow traffic moves fast.

i wish i could thank this more than once!

[Cecil Terwilliger]

There are way more bad and dangerous drivers than there are unsafe pedestrians.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

There are way more bad and dangerous drivers than there are pedestrians.

Cool.

When cars hit cars thats a relatively low-danger outcome.

When cars hit pedestrians that is a high-danger outcome.

Pedestrians looking out for their own safety will solve more problems than all traffic legislation can.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Locke

Cool.

When cars hit cars thats a relatively low-danger outcome.

When cars hit pedestrians that is a high-danger outcome.

Pedestrians looking out for their own safety will solve more problems than all traffic legislation can.

That’s always been such a bad counter to people pushing for drivers to be better. “Well, the big heavy chunk of metal wins, so watch out!”

Ok and? So that excuses crappy unsafe drivers? It’s just a way for bad drivers to excuse their ####ty driving.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

That’s always been such a bad counter to people pushing for drivers to be better. “Well, the big heavy chunk of metal wins, so watch out!”

Ok and? So that excuses crappy unsafe drivers? It’s just a way for bad drivers to excuse their ####ty driving.

I see. Cool.

Dont let 'Perfect' be the enemy of 'Good.'

All parties are going to make mistakes. There is no perfect Pedestrian. There is no perfect Cyclist and there is no Perfect Motorist.

If all parties do their best to operate safely and intelligently by just doing small little safe things, that overlap will help eliminate most dangerous scenarios.

But yeah, there are 'Bad Drivers' ergo all traffic incidents are the fault of motorists.

Thats a great policy. I'm sure that will be very conducive to achieving the desired end result of greater safety.

Dont worry about anyone else taking any personal responsibility for their own wellbeing, just trust that drivers will take care of it.

[CaptainYooh]

Originally Posted by Locke

… just trust that drivers will take care of it.

Yes. And the Government. THE GOVERNMENT, JERRY!

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

There are way more bad and dangerous drivers than there are unsafe pedestrians.

Yup… so don’t be a dumb pedestrian.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Yup… so don’t be a dumb pedestrian.

And don’t be a bad driver.

I don’t see what’s so complicated about all this. Don’t hit people with your car and don’t walk into traffic. Are people actually struggling with these concepts? I mean, clearly yes based on the fact this discussion is happening but it shouldn’t be that hard.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

I don’t see what’s so complicated about all this. Don’t hit people with your car and don’t walk into traffic.

Thanks for joining the prevailing opinion from like eleven posts ago.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Thanks for joining the prevailing opinion from like eleven posts ago.

Anything else you don’t understand and need me to explain?

[GirlySports]

The car is not jumping the curb the people are standing with their toes off the curb or even feet entirely onto the street.

With the amount of one way streets downtown, cars are making sharp left hand turns on another one way street.

[Barnet Flame]

Originally Posted by 81MC

A pedestrian standing at the curb waiting for the light to change is stationary. Just like, don’t take that extra step before you stop, and you’ll get exactly where you need to be at the exact same time.

Traffic on the other hand is thousands upon thousands of pounds moving is several directions all at once. The margin of error that might out a mirror or side of a high cube chassis over the curb is way tighter than a pedestrian not being a dummy.

It’s like the simplest thing in the world someone can do to improve safety yet they stand right where the road meets the sidewalk like it’s the start line at an Olympic sprint.

How about not driving so close to the curb that it’s an issue?

[Barnet Flame]

Originally Posted by RichieRich

Go ahead and hang ten that sidewalk. You’re “dead right” about it being ok.
But consider that whilst the majority of drivers will avoid you… what if you get bumped? What if that vehicle is long or has a trailer that cuts the corner (statistically speaking this is one of the more likely ways to do from that habit).

Lastly… really it’s only in Canada that I’ve repeatedly heard it expressed that you have the right to be there. Sure, you do. Travel the world and you’ll see most other cultures start with “the vehicle will win in a fight so maybe avoid them and watch yourself…”. Basically take some responsibility for reducing your own risk.

If you’re standing on a sidewalk/footpath/footway or whatever it’s called, you’re entitled to expect not to be hit by a car.

If you’re a driver and you hit anyone standing on a sidewalk, regardless of where they are on that sidewalk, you shouldn’t have a licence because it shouldn’t be an issue of tonnes of metal impacting a human being standing on a sidewalk.

I can’t believe this is even a topic of debate.

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by Locke

I have ranted about this a million times, but we have to breed better pedestrians.

We should be sending the worst offenders over to Vietnam to spend a few weeks walking around Hanoi. The only way you're crossing the street there is by paying close attention, not hesitating, walking in a smooth and predictable motion, and letting the traffic flow around you. There is no concept of "right of way" over there, everyone has someplace to be and they will all try to avoid hitting anyone, but zero effort is made to accommodate strugglers. I loved it

Same goes for drivers too, I became a much calmer and zen driver after spending some time on Vietnamese roads. You will get cut off, cars will cut in front of you at random, but most of the time it's because that's the only way to get around with millions of people on the roads with very little traffic infrastructure. If Canadian drivers had to experience that just for a little bit, we'd all be more courteous drivers. Someone made a left turn in front of you causing you to hit the brakes a bit? Who cares, that move likely saved them several minutes or more of sitting at a stop sign waiting for the "perfect" turn opportunity and only caused you half a second to slightly slow down. I saw countless people getting "cut off" in Vietnam, but nothing close to a collision and no one getting angry because you expect it to happen. I'd bet a good chunk of Canadian road accidents happen because drivers rely on their "right of way" 100% and have zero situational awareness of what's actually going on around them

[GirlySports]

there is right of way in vietnam, biggest vehicles on the left to smallest vehicles on the right. The smallest vehicles can only take the left lane if there are no larger vehicles there. And in general you only have to yield to a vehicle larger than you.

Additionally, if you're passing on the left, you have to honk your horn to let people know. So the entire city is noisy with horn honking.

Pedestrians don't count, they just cross and hope vehicles go around them.

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

And in general you only have to yield to a vehicle larger than you.

That's not a right of way, that's physics

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

That's not a right of way, that's physics

hahaha no, even on left turns and such

In Canada if you're driving a van and you're turning left, you still have to yield to a bike going straight. In Vietnam you don't. The van just starts turning left and the bike will figure the rest out.

btw, driving a scooter in Vietnam is really fun.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

We should be sending the worst offenders over to Vietnam to spend a few weeks walking around Hanoi. The only way you're crossing the street there is by paying close attention, not hesitating, walking in a smooth and predictable motion, and letting the traffic flow around you. There is no concept of "right of way" over there, everyone has someplace to be and they will all try to avoid hitting anyone, but zero effort is made to accommodate strugglers. I loved it

Same goes for drivers too, I became a much calmer and zen driver after spending some time on Vietnamese roads. You will get cut off, cars will cut in front of you at random, but most of the time it's because that's the only way to get around with millions of people on the roads with very little traffic infrastructure. If Canadian drivers had to experience that just for a little bit, we'd all be more courteous drivers. Someone made a left turn in front of you causing you to hit the brakes a bit? Who cares, that move likely saved them several minutes or more of sitting at a stop sign waiting for the "perfect" turn opportunity and only caused you half a second to slightly slow down. I saw countless people getting "cut off" in Vietnam, but nothing close to a collision and no one getting angry because you expect it to happen. I'd bet a good chunk of Canadian road accidents happen because drivers rely on their "right of way" 100% and have zero situational awareness of what's actually going on around them

This is sort of what I'm trying to get after, Pedestrians, Cyclists and Motorists have to actually give more credence to one another and look out for themselves and each other.

Its like the concept of 'Right of Way' has overridden the understanding of being responsible for yourself and each other.

Nobody is perfect, there are idiots of all walks, but if everyone is looking out for each other it would eliminate a lot of the incidental problems.

[Fuzz]

I've spent time in Vietnam and many other developing countries, and I get what you are saying, but it also comes at cost. Vietnam has a vehicular death rate over 4x higher than Canada per inhabitant and 6x higher per number of vehicles. Sure, the system moves more people quicker, but it also removes more of them from being in the way permanently.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...ted_death_rate

[DownInFlames]

To make a right turn you’re supposed to pull over close to the curb first so you don’t obstruct traffic that is continuing straight. I usually get about a foot away but if someone is standing on the edge then that isn’t a safe distance. I’d have to turn 3-4 feet out, just to be safe. That could make the drivers behind me slow down.

So, yeah, stay away from the edge of the curb.