10-11-2018, 10:21 AM
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#3461
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Lifetime Suspension
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I'd do Hamonic + Bennett for Nylander in a blink
Imagine Gaudreau feeding Nylander and his wrist shot on the powerplay
Gaudreau - Monahan - Lindholm
Tkachuk - Backlund - Nylander
Dube - Jankowski - Neal
Mangipane/Hathaway/Lazar - Ryan - Czarnyk
Giordano - Brodie
Hanifin - Stone
Valimaki - Andersson
Prout
Smith
Rittich
WCF bound at minimum
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10-11-2018, 10:29 AM
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#3462
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#1 Goaltender
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Love
I'd do Hamonic + Bennett for Nylander in a blink
Imagine Gaudreau feeding Nylander and his wrist shot on the powerplay
Gaudreau - Monahan - Lindholm
Tkachuk - Backlund - Nylander
Dube - Jankowski - Neal
Mangipane/Hathaway/Lazar - Ryan - Czarnyk
Giordano - Brodie
Hanifin - Stone
Valimaki - Andersson
Prout
Smith
Rittich
WCF bound at minimum
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How are the Flames signing Tkachuk now? Getting a starting goalie for next season?
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10-11-2018, 10:50 AM
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#3463
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Franchise Player
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That roster, without goalies, and Tkachuk and Nylander getting 7M each roughly translates to 75M next year. Add in Brouwer's buyout and it's at 76.5M. With a cap ceiling having an upper-end of 85M that's easily enough to sign goalies. Even if it only goes up to 83M it's plenty. At least short term.
The obvious exclusion is Frolik. With his contract vanishing, along with Bouma's buyout, that more or less makes up for Tkachuk's extension.
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10-11-2018, 10:56 AM
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#3464
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen
That roster, without goalies, and Tkachuk and Nylander getting 7M each roughly translates to 75M next year. Add in Brouwer's buyout and it's at 76.5M. With a cap ceiling having an upper-end of 85M that's easily enough to sign goalies. Even if it only goes up to 83M it's plenty. At least short term.
The obvious exclusion is Frolik. With his contract vanishing, along with Bouma's buyout, that more or less makes up for Tkachuk's extension.
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Frolik’s contract is likely only going to vanish via buyout. He is settling into the 4th line and I don’t see a team taking that deal on without sending money back.
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10-11-2018, 10:57 AM
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#3465
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#1 Goaltender
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Calgary - Transplanted Manitoban
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I just want Nylander to sign so we can stop talking about him.
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10-11-2018, 11:07 AM
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#3466
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Franchise Player
Join Date: May 2016
Location: ATCO Field, Section 201
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Which backup is set to be the next NHL starter? Dell?
If the Flames are trading for anything this year it will be a goalie.
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10-11-2018, 11:36 AM
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#3467
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imported_Aussie
Jiri is right - Flames need to use those assets for a goalie, not a forward.
While this is total fantasy, what if something like this could happen:
Flames send Leafs Hamonic + a younger, cost controlled forward (Bennett, Jankowski, etc.)
Leafs send Predators Nylander
Predators send Flames Saros
Then picks where it needs to be evened out.
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The Preds have been grooming Saros for a number of years to take over for Rinne.
With Rinne on the verge of FA, the time is next season.
It would certainly be a strange time to trade him, as they would immediately need to start searching for another goalie just like him.
I expect he'd be one of their last payers to get moved right now.
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10-11-2018, 11:38 AM
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#3468
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Fernando Valley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GioforPM
Hamonic is underrated if anything, especially on this board, I guess because he's a defensive defenceman.
As for contracts, he's 30 when the current one is done. I doubt he makes much more than he does right now, or is signed for more than, say, three years by anyone.
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I guess opinions are going to vary here but I've been somewhat underwhelmed with him and I know I'm not alone talking to other people. He brings nothing offensively and the rest of his game is very average. I get that he's a good character guy but he's kind of struggled for the past few seasons defensively which is not good when that's supposed to be his strength and I just don't see a talent you want to invest in long term as to me he's a replaceable guy. Maybe he has a better season and changes my mind but as of right now if the Flames can improve their team and he's part of the return I'm listening and considering it.
Last edited by Erick Estrada; 10-11-2018 at 11:40 AM.
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10-11-2018, 11:39 AM
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#3469
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
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Use assets for a #1 goalie we can use for a decade. It's the last thing left in the build. Smitty is gong to have a good year but we need to not rely on the idea that Rittich or Gillies will be able to handle a full work load next year.
Like I said, Nylander would be sweet but I really like where our FW's are at right now.
It's fascinating that there is still a few RFA's unsigned out there.
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10-11-2018, 11:43 AM
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#3470
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Fearmongerer
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Wondering when # became hashtag and not a number sign.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erick Estrada
I guess opinions are going to vary here but I've been somewhat underwhelmed with him and I know I'm not alone talking to other people. He brings nothing offensively and the rest of his game is very average. I get that he's a good character guy but he's kind of struggled for the past few seasons and I just don't see a talent you want to invest in long term as to me he's a replaceable guy.
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He was never brought in to be an offensive guy...that was known prior to acquisition.
I disagree he is "very average" defensively as well. Brodie was an anchor last year, and Hamonic was a victim in that regard.
This year? Just look how confident Hanifin is to join the rush and pinch deep when the opportunity exists. Hamonic has his back to do so, and NH knows it.
Stone is providing that to some extent as well, but once/if TH gets back and healthy and those two get a nice stretch of games together, I think we see that pairing flourish.
__________________
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10-11-2018, 11:53 AM
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#3471
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Franchise Player
Join Date: May 2016
Location: ATCO Field, Section 201
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I like the idea of the Flames not making any trades during the year. What good teams have is stability. the pens and caps in the years they won the cup never made many moves except for before the season and the trade deadline.
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10-11-2018, 12:01 PM
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#3472
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden
Which backup is set to be the next NHL starter? Dell?
If the Flames are trading for anything this year it will be a goalie.
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I agree on Dell, he looks poised to make a step up. Kinkaid is another backup who could do more IMO. Not sure if either is a high volume starter, but potentially a good 1A/1B split player.
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10-11-2018, 12:09 PM
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#3473
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
This year? Just look how confident Hanifin is to join the rush and pinch deep when the opportunity exists. Hamonic has his back to do so, and NH knows it.
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It is a stretch to conclude that after one game. And that one game was quite a disaster.
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10-11-2018, 12:17 PM
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#3474
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GioforPM
Hamonic is underrated if anything, especially on this board, I guess because he's a defensive defenceman.
As for contracts, he's 30 when the current one is done. I doubt he makes much more than he does right now, or is signed for more than, say, three years by anyone.
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If he does not sign for more in a world where the cap has gone up by about 33 percent by the time of the next contract I guess that means he is either not on a very good contract right now or he severely declines over the next 18 months.
For context, if he signed for 33 percent more than his last "value" contract he would be signing for about 5.1 million a year. That would be the equivalent of having the same "value" contract the Flames currently have in an 85 million dollar cap world. If he signed for the same amount as he did in 13/14 (3.857 million) his percentage of cap would go from 6 percent of the cap to 4.5 percent of cap (assuming an 85 million dollar cap). Most guys who are on good value contracts do not have their next contract at a lower percentage of cap percentage than their previous contract.
Last edited by Aarongavey; 10-11-2018 at 12:23 PM.
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10-11-2018, 12:31 PM
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#3475
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Springbank
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aarongavey
If he does not sign for more in a world where the cap has gone up by about 33 percent by the time of the next contract I guess that means he is either not on a very good contract right now or he severely declines over the next 18 months.
For context, if he signed for 33 percent more than his last "value" contract he would be signing for about 5.1 million a year. That would be the equivalent of having the same "value" contract the Flames currently have in an 85 million dollar cap world. If he signed for the same amount as he did in 13/14 (3.857 million) his percentage of cap would go from 6 percent of the cap to 4.5 percent of cap (assuming an 85 million dollar cap). Most guys who are on good value contracts do not have their next contract at a lower percentage of cap percentage than their previous contract.
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Hamonic is on an exceptional contact right now as far as cap hit, but he actually makes $4.875. I just think Treliving has him at peak and he will drive a hard bargain for an extension.
It is, as far as cap hits, a value contract. But guys on good value contracts aren't usually 30 when negotiating the next one. So 33% would probably be too high a raise for an end of career type.
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10-11-2018, 12:46 PM
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#3476
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First Line Centre
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Would still love to see the flames bring in a legit #1 goalie who could take us on a playoff run. I don't have faith in Smith for an entire season, no matter how well he plays in stretches.
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10-11-2018, 12:50 PM
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#3477
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GioforPM
Hamonic is underrated if anything, especially on this board, I guess because he's a defensive defenceman.
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He's a defensively average "defensive" defenseman coming off a season of offensive uselessness.
He's probably still the best option as our #4 but if we're going to have a D in the lineup who struggles offensively I would prefer it be an actual shutdown guy like Chris Tanev.
__________________
"May those who accept their fate find happiness. May those who defy it find glory."
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10-11-2018, 12:56 PM
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#3478
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GranteedEV
He's a defensively average "defensive" defenseman coming off a season of offensive uselessness.
He's probably still the best option as our #4 but if we're going to have a D in the lineup who struggles offensively I would prefer it be an actual shutdown guy like Chris Tanev.
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I think Hamonic has actually been really steady...
The only guy who can seemingly play with Brodie and not look bad is Gio, and Hamonic actually started to look better after a while last year and especially towards the end of the season.
I really think the flames have a very underrated dman in Hamonic and that he brings a ton of stability, the alternative is stone or brodie on the PK which is just terrifying
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10-11-2018, 01:03 PM
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#3479
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Boy Wonder
The only guy who can seemingly play with Brodie and not look bad is Gio,
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Stone? Russell? Heck we once made the playoffs with Engelland playing with Brodie and won a round.
Brodie might have had some unforced errors last year but Hamonic was definitely part of the problem on the second pair last year and that carried through to when Brodie got injured to close out the season.
Maybe Hamonic and Hanifin have perfect chemistry. I sure hope so. But he isn't a shut down defenseman.
__________________
"May those who accept their fate find happiness. May those who defy it find glory."
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10-11-2018, 01:03 PM
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#3480
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GioforPM
Hamonic is on an exceptional contact right now as far as cap hit, but he actually makes $4.875. I just think Treliving has him at peak and he will drive a hard bargain for an extension.
It is, as far as cap hits, a value contract. But guys on good value contracts aren't usually 30 when negotiating the next one. So 33% would probably be too high a raise for an end of career type.
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I would say a value contract is Roman Josi. He currently has a cap hit (what they make each year seems irrelevant) of 4 million dollars.
When he signed he signed for 6.2 percent of the salary cap.
If Josi signed for the same percentage on a 85 million dollar cap he would sign for 5.27 million dollars a year. Roman Josi, despite being 30 years old when he signs his next contract will definitely sign for more than that, thus indicating he is on a value contract.
Hamonic is almost certainly going to sign for less than 5.1 million, so unlike Josi he is going to sign for less of a percentage of the cap than the original contract he signed, this despite them both being 30 years old.
Hamonic is the 76th highest paid dman in the NHL. I suspect someone could make a pretty strong argument he is no higher than the 76th best dman in the NHL, thus somewhat indicating that what he makes is right around the value he holds across the league. Saying he is on a value contract was just kinda something that was made up to justify giving up a 1st and two 2nds for a number 3-4 dman.
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