[Rumour] LeBrun: Flames have interest in Toffoli (and other RHS top 6 forwards)

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by getoverit

His price keeps going up. Lol

Price for Martinez is going up every game the flames allow 4 or more

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

When the rumour about the Flames first having interest came out is when it should've been done.

When he was everyone's plan C and not doing a whole lot on the score sheet.

I don't know what Treliving is doing and I don't know what amazing other options are out there worth holding out for that don't require overspending. At least this one has a palatable price tag.

How do we know what the price tag is?
If the kings have been asking for a first are you criticizing Tre for not doing it?

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

How do we know what the price tag is?
If the kings have been asking for a first are you criticizing Tre for not doing it?

Tre shouldn't be criticized for not paying up, this team is clearly not one or two pieces away. But he does deserve criticism for sitting on his hands the last two years and letting it get to this point.

If he isn't a seller at the deadline, or if he comes back with another set of excuses for not getting things done, he should be given his pink slip. Enough is enough.

[Johnhitbox]

A week before the situation with peters, and the team was doing awful,Brad was interviewed and said something along the lines of. “ i need to be doing a better job” and since then, he hasn’t done anything at all.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rhino]

Originally Posted by Johnhitbox

A week before the situation with peters, and the team was doing awful,Brad was interviewed and said something along the lines of. “ i need to be doing a better job” and since then, he hasn’t done anything at all.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It was that everyone needs to do a better job including himself. Johnny has 1 move and that’s to go outside .... pull up, turn and look for a trailer. Teams know this and are fine to let him stay to the outside and pick up the trailers on the play. He is no threat to drive the net and does not have a hard enough shot to wire one from the circle. He is not THE GUY but could be A GUY surrounded by other players.

[Roof-Daddy]

Treliving clearly should have hired some thugs behind the scenes to help convince Kadri to waive his NTC for Calgary.

Or to make sure that Shero agreed to his offer instead of AZI's offer for Hall.

I mean, I can't picture the guy sitting on his hands.

He's not perfect, but what is he supposed to do?

It takes two GM's to agree to a deal, and then in his case he usually has to also deal with not only having to convince the player he wants to agree to come to Calgary, but apparently he has to get the OK from micromanaging higher ups within the Flames organization.

[Johnhitbox]

Originally Posted by rhino

It was that everyone needs to do a better job including himself. Johnny has 1 move and that’s to go outside .... pull up, turn and look for a trailer. Teams know this and are fine to let him stay to the outside and pick up the trailers on the play. He is no threat to drive the net and does not have a hard enough shot to wire one from the circle. He is not THE GUY but could be A GUY surrounded by other players.

Yeah, but if Johnny is limited, why not pull the trigger? Move him to a team that can utilize his skill set, or bring in someone that can can assist him.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Treliving clearly should have hired some thugs behind the scenes to help convince Kadri to waive his NTC for Calgary.

Or to make sure that Shero agreed to his offer instead of AZI's offer for Hall.

I mean, I can't picture the guy sitting on his hands.

He's not perfect, but what is he supposed to do?

It takes two GM's to agree to a deal, and then in his case he usually has to also deal with not only having to convince the player he wants to agree to come to Calgary, but apparently he has to get the OK from micromanaging higher ups within the Flames organization.

How about not targeting players with Calgary on their NTC list? Lots of time went into constructing that deal only to have it fall apart because kadri wouldn’t waive, which wasn’t a surprise. Target players with no trade protection or ones that don’t have Calgary on their list.

Kadri and Hall were potential home runs. Problem is that those percentages are small. Let’s take some singles and doubles, moves that improve us incrementally but still improve the team. Instead of ending up with nothing which is where we are now.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

How about not targeting players with Calgary on their NTC list? Lots of time went into constructing that deal only to have it fall apart because kadri wouldn’t waive, which wasn’t a surprise. Target players with no trade protection or ones that don’t have Calgary on their list.

Kadri and Hall were potential home runs. Problem is that those percentages are small. Let’s take some singles and doubles, moves that improve us incrementally but still improve the team. Instead of ending up with nothing which is where we are now.

He can target whoever he wants, but only a select number of legit top 6 forwards get traded. If you target players that nobody wants to move then you're going to have to overpay to get them, which presents another problem.

Which top six forwards, especially top 6 C's, have been dealt since the Kadri trade that Treliving should have targeted? He can't just decide which players he wants and then magically they become available.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

He can target whoever he wants, but only a select number of legit top 6 forwards get traded. If you target players that nobody wants to move then you're going to have to overpay to get them, which presents another problem.

Which top six forwards, especially top 6 C's, have been dealt since the Kadri trade that Treliving should have targeted? He can't just decide which players he wants and then magically they become available.

Better to overpay for an asset that is attainable than one that you have no chance of getting.

You can argue that treliving put too much emphasis on d (and g) at the detriment of the F.

We have given up so many picks to fortify our D and G but not so much to improve the F ranks. With a finite amount of picks, you can’t throw your eggs all in one basket and go all in on d. Spent 2 first rounders and 4 second rounders on Hamilton and Hamonic. That’s a lot of assets, not to mention the high picks that he spent on Elliott and Smith, as well as drafting McDonald and Parsons with disappointing results.

Small wonder we have a problem at F. Yes, we was able to redeem himself with Hanifin and Lindholm but point remains we overloaded our D at the expense of F, not to mention the lost opportunity to draft F with high picks due to trading them away for D and drafting g with those high picks.

As for top 6 f that get traded since kadri, yes, limited trades since then but there are factors such as the cap which have ground trades to a halt. We should be looking at players that are stuck on organizations (bracco for one but there are others) which could come in and slot in. Much more attainable than a player that has a ntc with Calgary on their list.

[Jiggy]

Do people really think GM's would try to trade for a guy that 100% did not want to go to a certain city? Kadri was originally open to coming to Calgary (from a trusted source). That's why there was a deal in place, but once they needed Kadri's sign off he got cold feet and didn't want to leave Toronto. The thing is Toronto was done with Kadri, so once he said no to going to Calgary the Leafs leaked the deal.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Johnhitbox

A week before the situation with peters, and the team was doing awful,Brad was interviewed and said something along the lines of. “ i need to be doing a better job” and since then, he hasn’t done anything at all.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

He convinced lucic not to retire.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Jiggy

Do people really think GM's would try to trade for a guy that 100% did not want to go to a certain city? Kadri was originally open to coming to Calgary (from a trusted source). That's why there was a deal in place, but once they needed Kadri's sign off he got cold feet and didn't want to leave Toronto. The thing is Toronto was done with Kadri, so once he said no to going to Calgary the Leafs leaked the deal.

Nice that you have trusted sources where you can get that info. I don’t. So from an outsiders view it looked like an iffy proposition at best. Without that info that you are privy to I hope you can see why some of us question the process of pursuing a player with Calgary on their ntc list.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

Nice that you have trusted sources where you can get that info. I don’t. So from an outsiders view it looked like an iffy proposition at best. Without that info that you are privy to I hope you can see why some of us question the process of pursuing a player with Calgary on their ntc list.

How many top 6 forwards, let alone RHS, have some form of a NMC? Aside from those on entry level contracts (who in all likelihood are not getting moved anyway) I would have to think most.

Does Vincent Trocheck? If so, should Treliving pursue him? Treliving' job is to make the team better. He obviously felt pursuing Kadri was worth the effort, and rightly so IMO. I would say that deal would have ended up in favour of the Flames.

A lot of the criticism directed towards Treliving is completely devoid of any rationale context. If landing a top 6 F is simple, go ahead and call your shot.

[rhino]

Originally Posted by Johnhitbox

Yeah, but if Johnny is limited, why not pull the trigger? Move him to a team that can utilize his skill set, or bring in someone that can can assist him.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I guess that was my point.... lol. I think we could add some real nice pieces for the long term success of this team.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

How do we know what the price tag is?
If the kings have been asking for a first are you criticizing Tre for not doing it?

At this point the longer Treliving holds on the more I have at least some faith in him. I hope he makes no moves right until deadline day. The Canucks and Oilers both have two games at hand so by then it should be obvious if the Flames no longer have a shot at 1st or 2nd in the division and at that point there's no point in trying to upgrade the team if you know home ice advantage is improbable. Best course of action would be to sell on Brodie but this is the Flames so I would be happy with simply standing pat as that would at least show the GM realizes that he can't afford to part with a 1st round pick that isn't guaranteed to be a lottery pick. The team's record was pointing down prior to the injuries so there really are no signs that they are close to breaking out even when Gio and Hamonic come back.

[browna]

^
I think no matter what happens with the Oilers and Canucks and Coyotes this week with results and games in hand, any team is a 2 or 3 game streak from going worst to first in the division, or the other way, the rest of the way.
Cavaeat, that is with one or both of Gio or Hamonic (or newly acquired solid d man) back sooner than later for the Flames. The injuries have put to much on guys that aren't yet ready for the ice time and responsibilities,and last night showed.

For the Flames to keep up, it is also going to be aided by some sort of roster acquisition, as I think the current roster needs to have that occur for the added skill on the ice, but also the bump up of having the GM step up to strengthen things and give the mental side of the team, a boost.

So, saying that, make the trade today, or in the 4 days off, don't have to wait to Monday to do something big or small, and get that first move or two out of the way with the plan to be in the playoffs and have a good chance of winning a round, and then see next Monday if prices come down on some of the "nice to have but not required" options.

And as I said, think if the Flames make it into the playoffs and not in a wild card, they will win a round given who they would play, so decision should be based on that.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

How about not targeting players with Calgary on their NTC list? Lots of time went into constructing that deal only to have it fall apart because kadri wouldn’t waive, which wasn’t a surprise. Target players with no trade protection or ones that don’t have Calgary on their list.

Kadri and Hall were potential home runs. Problem is that those percentages are small. Let’s take some singles and doubles, moves that improve us incrementally but still improve the team. Instead of ending up with nothing which is where we are now.

So name a player that fits your bill as a replacement in that Kari deal that Treliving could obviously have easily made a deal for. On a team that needed a return that Calgary could do like that one.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Jiggy

Do people really think GM's would try to trade for a guy that 100% did not want to go to a certain city? Kadri was originally open to coming to Calgary (from a trusted source). That's why there was a deal in place, but once they needed Kadri's sign off he got cold feet and didn't want to leave Toronto. The thing is Toronto was done with Kadri, so once he said no to going to Calgary the Leafs leaked the deal.

Apparently Kadri thought that by nixing the Calgary deal he wouldn’t get traded at all, but it didn’t work out like he thought.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Apparently Kadri thought that by nixing the Calgary deal he wouldn’t get traded at all, but it didn’t work out like he thought.

This is what I remember hearing as well. He was looking to nix getting traded, not specifically nix Calgary and then a second trade was built that he couldn't nix and off he went.