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Old 04-18-2019, 08:13 AM   #21
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Monahan 44.74%, Gaudreau 40% in shot attempts.

But ...

They were both about 35% in scoring chance splits, and 30% and 23% respectively in high danger situations.

They got worked.

Lindholm was the worst player on the team in giving up high danger five on five chances against.

The 3M Line was all over 60%j in high danger splits. They did their job.
This makes it clear that the first line needs to be split up.

What the re-jigged lines look like, I’m not sure. But I do think that the only two forwards on this team that have put-the-team-on-your-back type stuff are Tkachuk and Bennett, and that they need to be put on the same line and told that basically, it’s up to them to win the series.
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:26 AM   #22
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I like this idea, but also need every like to step up their two way game and spread the wealth and spread the sandpaper around

Line 1: tkahcuk Backlund Bennett
Line 2: Johnny Lindholm Hathaway
Line 3: Mangiapane Monahan Frolik
Line 4: czarnik Ryan neal
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:30 AM   #23
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Somewhere Glen Gulutzen is laughingly bent over his ipad
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:35 AM   #24
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Now do you guys believe me about Gaudreau and Monahan??!!

This team is softer than the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man and it's because we've invested far too much money in two players who have zero grit or determination to be successful in the NHL Stanley Cup playoffs. They're both way too scared to go to the areas on the ice you need to get to to score goals because they are too scared of getting hit. It's embarrassing at this point.

Both should be traded IMO I've seen enough. You can't win with these two
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:38 AM   #25
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Somewhere Glen Gulutzen is laughingly bent over his ipad
Nah. He's too busy still trying to figure out why that square peg wont fit in the round hole on his geometric peg board.
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:42 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by GullFoss View Post
I like this idea, but also need every like to step up their two way game and spread the wealth and spread the sandpaper around

Line 1: tkahcuk Backlund Bennett
Line 2: Johnny Lindholm Hathaway
Line 3: Mangiapane Monahan Frolik
Line 4: czarnik Ryan neal

Put Bennett and Gaudreau together. I want Lindholm, Monahan, and Gaudreau all on separate lines.
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:51 AM   #27
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Put Bennett and Gaudreau together. I want Lindholm, Monahan, and Gaudreau all on separate lines.
Bennett doesn't have sufficient vision to play with Johnny. Johnny doesn't have sufficient intensity to play with Bennett. They're just not good linemates for each other
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:53 AM   #28
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Bennett doesn't have sufficient vision to play with Johnny. Johnny doesn't have sufficient intensity to play with Bennett. They're just not good linemates for each other
But don't you want complementary and not identical players? And isn't someone like Lindholm the medium between those two?

BTW what happened to Johnny's intensity? He used to have it.
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Old 04-18-2019, 08:54 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GullFoss View Post
I like this idea, but also need every like to step up their two way game and spread the wealth and spread the sandpaper around

Line 1: tkahcuk Backlund Bennett
Line 2: Johnny Lindholm Hathaway
Line 3: Mangiapane Monahan Frolik
Line 4: czarnik Ryan neal
On the road, I’d go with something close to this and roll 4. Screw the match up. I especially like Backlund with Tkachuk and Bennett. Get some emotion going - some leadership.

At home, if I wanted to keep matching Backlund against MacKinnon then I’d go:

Gaudreau - Bennett - Tkachuk
Mangiapane - Monahan - Lindholm
Dube - Backlund - Frolik
Hathaway - Ryan - Neal

From a motivation perspective, I’d go full Torts. Lose my ####. Challenge all the forwards. Call them all out, except for the 4th line.

Last edited by Murph; 04-18-2019 at 09:07 AM. Reason: Moved Neal to the 4th
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Old 04-18-2019, 09:02 AM   #30
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But don't you want complementary and not identical players? And isn't someone like Lindholm the medium between those two?



BTW what happened to Johnny's intensity? He used to have it.
I was chatting with my buddy the other day about the difference between goal scorers and playmakers.

Playmakers are very visible - you see the play they are making. You can easily see the skill - the passing, the vision, the edgework that goes into the playmaking because they do it with the puck.

For a goal scorer, all you see is the goal and the hands. You don't see the vision and hockey sense that goes into being at the right place at the right time. The edges that help with deception. How they beat defensemen. They know what to do without the puck to be in the right place and the right time.

People underestimate how important monahan and lindholm are for Johnny. The only other players with comparable abilities on the roster is tkachuk and backlund. IMO Bennett is getting there, but he isn't there yet.
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Old 04-18-2019, 09:16 AM   #31
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Valimaki looked great as the #5/6 D man playing as sheltered minutes as possible.

He was the largest Flame D-man and was not worn down and/or intimidated by the first 3 games.
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Old 04-18-2019, 09:36 AM   #32
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Derrek Engelland is quietly leading all Vegas players in TOI with a modest 21:22 / game.

Where would he fit in on the Flames?

The Flames sort of filled Engelland's spot with Mike Stone. Might he not be good player in the playoffs? He missed the last game of the year against the Oilers but played 22 and 18 minutes in the 2 games before that.
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Old 04-18-2019, 09:40 AM   #33
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The only major problem I’ve found with this series is that Gaudreau is not producing at the same clip as Mackinnon. That’s the X-factor. Our depth scoring is much better then Colorado, but Johnny and Monahan are just so brutal on the big stage that we have no chance of winning.
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Old 04-18-2019, 09:48 AM   #34
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Quote:
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But don't you want complementary and not identical players? And isn't someone like Lindholm the medium between those two?

BTW what happened to Johnny's intensity? He used to have it.
I feel like Johnny's intensity has slowly waned due to his centre being MIA for the last month and a half. Things aren't clicking in the offensive zone in large part because Monahan has been invisible. Johnny seems frustrated and is just channeling that in non-productive ways.

Gaudreau has actually been more physical this playoff series than I've seen him in a long time - throwing hits and attempting to fight battles in the corners. The problem is that he's just not physically equipped to be effective doing that. I'd much rather see him spend his energy on being more engaged on the backcheck, trying to intercept passes or strip pucks from people as he's shown himself of being capable of doing in the past. They haven't been generating much offense off the transition because they haven't been generating any disruption in their defensive zone to transition out of.

I just don't get what's happened to Monahan in the last little while - he's said it isn't an injury, but if so then there's gotta be something off with his headspace. He's had bags under his eyes in a lot of games through March and into at least the beginning of playoffs - maybe it's off-ice issues, but he just hasn't looked like himself. Outside of faceoffs he's contributed very little the whole series.
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Old 04-18-2019, 09:58 AM   #35
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Its too depressing looking at the "How". Individual players, SA, Advanced stats etc.

So I'm going to look at the "What". They could have come to Denver with a 2-0 series lead. Overtime in game 2. You could even make the argument that they could be up 3-1 with 2 Overtime games and chances to end it early. But here they are.

Go home and win one. Get the matchups you want. Feed off the home energy and win one. Then put it all on the line and find a way, anyway to win on the road in Denver. I don't care if Gaudreau and Monahan play the worst games of their careers, just find a way. Then bring it home again for game 7, where anything can happen.

Its not impossible. Who thought the Avs would win 3 in a row against the top team in the West? Not I. Its not that inconceivable to pull off three in a row against the Avs.

Also, How awesome is Valimaki?
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Old 04-18-2019, 10:11 AM   #36
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With the first and third lines broken I think it's time Bill Peters changes things up. I honestly get why he hasn't to date, the Flames aren't going anywhere in these playoffs if they can't get their top line going. But it hasn't happened so it has to be time to go with who's going.

Right now they have the 3M and fourth lines going ... leave them.

They have two players going that are on lines that aren't ... Bennett / Lindholm. Combined them and add Gaudreau, move Monahan to the third line and maybe sit Jankowski for Czarnik or Dube.
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Old 04-18-2019, 10:22 AM   #37
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I don't know if it has been wondered aloud in any other thread. But what the heck do you do with the goaltending in the offseason? (I know its not the offseason yet)

Smith hasn't been adequate, he's been sensational. How do you not re-sign the guy?

It would be so "Flames" if they re-sign him after a fantastic playoffs, then a year from now the team is dominating the opposition with Gaudreau and Monahan playing lights out only to bow out in the first round due to crap goaltending.

But really, given the options out there this offseason, and what we're witnessing right now. How do you not return to the current tandem?
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Old 04-18-2019, 10:22 AM   #38
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Quote:
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Monahan 44.74%, Gaudreau 40% in shot attempts.

But ...

They were both about 35% in scoring chance splits, and 30% and 23% respectively in high danger situations.

They got worked.

Lindholm was the worst player on the team in giving up high danger five on five chances against.

The 3M Line was all over 60%j in high danger splits. They did their job.
Don't need to look any farther than this to understand why Flames are down 3-1.

Yikes.
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Old 04-18-2019, 11:29 AM   #39
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Don't need to look any farther than this to understand why Flames are down 3-1.

Yikes.
In the series ... High Danger counts

Gaudreau 8-17
Monahan 9-15
Lindholm 6-14

Hanifin 7-19
Hamonic 6-18
Jankowski 3-9
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Old 04-18-2019, 11:34 AM   #40
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In the series ... High Danger counts

Gaudreau 8-17
Monahan 9-15
Lindholm 6-14

Hanifin 7-19
Hamonic 6-18
Jankowski 3-9
the first number is for and the last number is against?

Just awful.
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