Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Go Back   Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community > Main Forums > Fire on Ice: The Calgary Flames Forum

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-08-2021, 11:17 PM   #2081
djsFlames
Franchise Player
 
djsFlames's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Where opinions are fact
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache View Post
Itís funny how some people are still hanging on to the bizarre hope that Sam still wonít succeed in Florida.
He's put it together for 1/8th of a season.

Whatever your definition of 'succeeding' is, it certainly differs from mine at least.
djsFlames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2021, 11:17 PM   #2082
edslunch
#1 Goaltender
 
edslunch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wastedyouth View Post
Because his on ice save percentage is also sky high.

But I wanted to highlight the shooting percentage because it is more relevant for my point.

What does save percentage have to do with Bennett?
edslunch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2021, 11:30 PM   #2083
DeluxeMoustache
 
DeluxeMoustache's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by djsFlames View Post
He's put it together for 1/8th of a season.

Whatever your definition of 'succeeding' is, it certainly differs from mine at least.

Well, I think that getting 15 points in 10 games in Florida is quite successful compared to 12 in 38 here. If you don’t think that is successful, that is fine but sure would be informative.

A lot of people have observed his handling for years, and suggested that he could be successful if the Flames gave him good linemates, played him at C, and he wasn’t relegated to bottom 6 blender.

It’s not that he is randomly doing well. The logic was laid out, the data was shown, the argument was made. The hypothesis was made.

The prediction was more modest. Nobody expects him to sustain 1.5 points per game. But that *is* pretty ####ing good. It’s not lucky points, the guy has been one of the 3 stars several times

So when people lay out the rationale, and exactly what they expected to happen happens, it is funny to see people still stamping their feet

Just because Calgary screwed up for 6 years doesn’t mean we have to wait another 6 to see that they screwed up.

Let me know when you will be ready to concede that Calgary messed up. What is your bar? Should be interesting.
DeluxeMoustache is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to DeluxeMoustache For This Useful Post:
Old 05-08-2021, 11:44 PM   #2084
Flame On
Franchise Player
 
Flame On's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aarongavey View Post
It is great to see. The Panthers took a different approach and played the former 4th overall pick with some skilled players. It appears that approach is working out nicely for them.
What a revolutionary idea, if only the Flames had competent development personnel, coaching or a GM. But hey the team still won this trade, they got the most important thing of all. And that's to teach a player that he just doesn't get handed things! Eff yah, we're in the business of old school hockey tropes and we sure won that one.
__________________
Canuck insulter and proud of it.
Reason:
-------
Insulted Other Member(s)
Don't insult other members; even if they are Canuck fans.
Flame On is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-08-2021, 11:54 PM   #2085
GranteedEV
Franchise Player
 
GranteedEV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Calgary
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by djsFlames View Post
He's put it together for 1/8th of a season.

Whatever your definition of 'succeeding' is, it certainly differs from mine at least.
Regardless of whatever your definition of "put it together" is, the fact of the matter is that he's had four games of 20+ minutes in his ten as a panther. He had zero in his 400 as a Flame.

You can probably expect him to have a lot more 20+ minute nights in his next 390 games, considering the most winningest coach of this millennium is the one giving him that ice time, on a pretty good team.
__________________

"May those who accept their fate find happiness. May those who defy it find glory."
GranteedEV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2021, 12:16 AM   #2086
dino7c
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Exp:
Default

There is no denying the start...there are extremes on both sides in here though. To compare him to ROR and Point already is the same extreme as the people who said he would be out of the league.

Jeff Carter has 8 goals in Pittsburg since the deadline...new team bump isn't just grasping at straws it has happens with guys every year.

I expect him to be in the 40-45 point range next season and I'm considered a hater.
__________________
#MakeTheFlamesGreatAgain
dino7c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2021, 12:31 AM   #2087
FBI
Franchise Player
 
FBI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Flames fan in Seattle
Exp:
Default

Not just 15 in 10, 21 in last 16.

Now we’re getting into 1/5 of an 82 game season sample size..
__________________
FBI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2021, 12:37 AM   #2088
DeluxeMoustache
 
DeluxeMoustache's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dino7c View Post
There is no denying the start...there are extremes on both sides in here though. To compare him to ROR and Point already is the same extreme as the people who said he would be out of the league.

Jeff Carter has 8 goals in Pittsburg since the deadline...new team bump isn't just grasping at straws it has happens with guys every year.

I expect him to be in the 40-45 point range next season and I'm considered a hater.

But there really aren’t the extremes. Nobody is going ahead and projecting 50 / 70 / 90 points next season that I’ve seen, in contrast to your 40-45 point prediction. (Which is basically that of a pretty average middle 6 player)

Most people here are enjoying the guy getting a top 6 role and that he is capable of producing accordingly.

I know people have been disappointed in his Calgary production relative to draft expectations, but nobody has made a compelling case that he notably and uniquely underachieved considering his deployment

Interesting how you bring up Jeff Carter as a relevant example. Has he ever been considered “successful” in any way before?

And I don’t know any adults who use the phrase ‘hater’

Carry on, though. It’s just bizarre to show up and try to set a claim at a low expectation level. I just really don’t get why
DeluxeMoustache is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2021, 12:42 AM   #2089
The Fonz
Our Jessica Fletcher
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Exp:
Default

It’s weird that Bennett is having success in Florida with a successful coach. I mean, Treliving out-thinks every other GM, and brings in coaches that can out-draw every other coach on the chalk board. Gulutzan did a hockey talk to university kids for christ’s sake, so you know he’s good.

How is this happening. It just doesn’t make sense.
The Fonz is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to The Fonz For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 12:50 AM   #2090
The Fonz
Our Jessica Fletcher
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Exp:
Default

In all seriousness, I’m happy fo Bennett. This saved his career.
The Fonz is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 13 Users Say Thank You to The Fonz For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 12:54 AM   #2091
DeluxeMoustache
 
DeluxeMoustache's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Exp:
Default

It has definitely saved his career and also most likely made him several millions of dollars career earnings.

Seriously, a lot of people here were debating whether he was going to be worth his qualifying offer, leaning towards no
DeluxeMoustache is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to DeluxeMoustache For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 01:00 AM   #2092
FlamesAddiction
Franchise Player
 
FlamesAddiction's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Vancouver
Exp:
Default

I wish it was possible to hide a thread. Don't get me wrong, I am not criticizing anyone for posting in it and I have the willpower to not post in it, but just seeing it on the front page is so demoralizing. It's just a constant reminder to how this whole season has been and sucks big time.

This and the Adam Fox thread. There aren't enough remote controls in the world to express my frustration.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
FlamesAddiction is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to FlamesAddiction For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 01:09 AM   #2093
dino7c
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache View Post
But there really aren’t the extremes. Nobody is going ahead and projecting 50 / 70 / 90 points next season that I’ve seen, in contrast to your 40-45 point prediction. (Which is basically that of a pretty average middle 6 player)

Most people here are enjoying the guy getting a top 6 role and that he is capable of producing accordingly.

I know people have been disappointed in his Calgary production relative to draft expectations, but nobody has made a compelling case that he notably and uniquely underachieved considering his deployment

Interesting how you bring up Jeff Carter as a relevant example. Has he ever been considered “successful” in any way before?

And I don’t know any adults who use the phrase ‘hater’

Carry on, though. It’s just bizarre to show up and try to set a claim at a low expectation level. I just really don’t get why
Look harder a couple pages back...#1 center below McDavid tier but in the Stamkos, ROR, Tavares tier

Jeff Carter was an example because he has as many goals with the Pens as he had all season with the Kings. I have already said I think he puts up 40+ next season (is that low?) and than is nothing to sneeze at.

Nobody on this site has ever said hater so go after me about that lol
__________________
#MakeTheFlamesGreatAgain

Last edited by dino7c; 05-09-2021 at 01:17 AM.
dino7c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2021, 01:30 AM   #2094
DeluxeMoustache
 
DeluxeMoustache's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Exp:
Default

Look harder? Go after someone? I’m getting less interested the more I hear

Bennett was a highest ever pick, now 24, that became a mismanaged castoff. No fit here but good looking RFA there. Carter has a cup ring and is a back 9 of career rental.

This is pretty much stupid at this point. Carry on
DeluxeMoustache is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2021, 02:06 AM   #2095
dino7c
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache View Post
Look harder? Go after someone? I’m getting less interested the more I hear

Bennett was a highest ever pick, now 24, that became a mismanaged castoff. No fit here but good looking RFA there. Carter has a cup ring and is a back 9 of career rental.

This is pretty much stupid at this point. Carry on
You are the one saying "nobody is saying he is blah blah blah my moustache is so cool" just correcting you it is being said. I wasn't just commenting on the voice in my head that compared Bennett to Stamkos ect. because of 10 games.

now post some condescending BS so you can get the last word as usual.
__________________
#MakeTheFlamesGreatAgain
dino7c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2021, 02:46 AM   #2096
Saqe
Powerplay Quarterback
 
Saqe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Exp:
Default

I'm not going to pretend I believed Bennett was something special when he was in Calgary and I still think he'll top out as a 60 point 2C max. I don't think the sample size is big enough with Florida to draw long term conclusions about his production. Although just bringing up production with Bennett does him a disfavor, he brings so much more than just points.

But the lack of opportunity here is evident and I don't understand the arguments that he would never have worked out here, like what, can't Calgary fit in good players on their roster? You find a way to make good players work and not bury them in the lineup. Or sell them off for picks that have a slim chance of turning out to be a good player in the future.
Saqe is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Saqe For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 03:10 AM   #2097
UKflames
Powerplay Quarterback
 
UKflames's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: England
Exp:
Default

Pleased and frustrated to see Sam doing so well in Florida. Isn't it amazing what happens when you play a #4 pick with good players, at their natural position for a sustained period, without the threat of being dropped to the 4th line for one minor error.
He never really got the chance to play with quality players for a sustained period on the flames, and for those that say he did, maybe this is an indication then that our qulity players maybe aren't so quality after all, but that's become pretty clear this season.
UKflames is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to UKflames For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 03:17 AM   #2098
KootenayFlamesFan
Commie Referee
 
KootenayFlamesFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Small town, B.C.
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache View Post
Look harder? Go after someone? Iím getting less interested the more I hear

Bennett was a highest ever pick, now 24, that became a mismanaged castoff. No fit here but good looking RFA there. Carter has a cup ring and is a back 9 of career rental.

This is pretty much stupid at this point. Carry on
Do you want a discussion or do you just want to talk down to people? I really can't tell anymore. This is supposed to be fun, but it really doesn't seem like you're having fun. It's okay just to talk about hockey.
KootenayFlamesFan is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to KootenayFlamesFan For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 03:40 AM   #2099
FlamesAddiction
Franchise Player
 
FlamesAddiction's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Vancouver
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by UKflames View Post
Pleased and frustrated to see Sam doing so well in Florida. Isn't it amazing what happens when you play a #4 pick with good players, at their natural position for a sustained period, without the threat of being dropped to the 4th line for one minor error.
He never really got the chance to play with quality players for a sustained period on the flames, and for those that say he did, maybe this is an indication then that our qulity players maybe aren't so quality after all, but that's become pretty clear this season.
Bolded part is spot on. If Bennett was going to be in the top 3 regularly, he had to blow Monahan out of the water, and he just wasn't able to do that. Monahan is useless playing down the line-up while Bennett could at least slot in anywhere. The real tragedy here is that the roster isn't flexible enough to give other players an opportunity without totally neutralizing guys like Monahan and Gaudreau that need to be on the top line to be useful.

Theoretically, Bennett could have supplanted Backlund on the second line (when Lindholm wasn't tried there), but Backlund rightfully earned it and showed he could be productive with scrubs. Bennett not so much, which is the difference in Florida. Their second line has more talent than ours. It could basically be our first line.

I guess to make a long story short, I put this failure on how the team is constructed. It really gave coaches little choice for deployment. Bennett was used where he could be without totally making Monahan useless. With better depth on the wings, Bennett could have shown more and wouldn't have had to play on the wing at all.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
FlamesAddiction is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to FlamesAddiction For This Useful Post:
Old 05-09-2021, 06:18 AM   #2100
Cali Panthers Fan
Franchise Player
 
Cali Panthers Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Boca Raton, FL
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Saqe View Post
I'm not going to pretend I believed Bennett was something special when he was in Calgary and I still think he'll top out as a 60 point 2C max. I don't think the sample size is big enough with Florida to draw long term conclusions about his production. Although just bringing up production with Bennett does him a disfavor, he brings so much more than just points.

But the lack of opportunity here is evident and I don't understand the arguments that he would never have worked out here, like what, can't Calgary fit in good players on their roster? You find a way to make good players work and not bury them in the lineup. Or sell them off for picks that have a slim chance of turning out to be a good player in the future.
That's what I see as well, which is a heck of a lot better than what he would have been in Calgary. Seriously, 4th line winger deployment...WTF? Just insanely bad decision making.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by ResAlien View Post
If we can't fall in love with replaceable bottom 6 players then the terrorists have won.
Cali Panthers Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Cali Panthers Fan For This Useful Post:
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:15 AM.

Calgary Flames
2019-20




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Calgarypuck 2021