Amanda Lindhout-kidnapped Canadian Journalist, freed from captors

[Jetsfan]

Originally Posted by Savvy27

I don't know if you're interested, but I heard about a country somewhere in Africa where you can go and you won't have to pay taxes... I sincerely hope you try it out.

Dang.

Seriously though, she is a freelance journalist, so she wasn't in Somalia on vacation. I can't imagine casually concluding that a member of my own family should die at the hands of kidnappers, because they took a calculated risk, especially when that risk is understandable given the nature of her career.

I think Cowperson made a really good point that she should have arranged insurance before travelling there. Hell, I get travel insurance when I go to G7 countries.

Anyways, I'm happy to hear that she's back in Canada and safe. Best wishes to her in recovering from what was surely a terrifying ordeal.

So what your saying is as a Citizen of Canada I am obligated to cover the ransom due to her poor decisions under the pretext of her career otherwise you will throw me out of the country.

What if she went to climb Mount Everest without an oxygen tank and became stranded on the summit, would you suggest that I should pay to have her rescued and flown back to Canada or I can move to Tibet.

Let me be clear...she ignored warnings not to travel there and got kidnapped. As a citizen, it I am not obligated to pay for her poor decisions. Instead of suggesting that I move to Africa, maybe she should change her career!

[VladtheImpaler]

The insurance comment is a good one - you can insure for any risk - obviously, the higher the risk, the higher the premiums. If she cannot afford insurance, she should not be taking the risk. A white, anglo-saxon woman going to a place like Somalia on her own is INSANE. Sure, she is very brave, but also very stupid.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

The insurance comment is a good one - you can insure for any risk - obviously, the higher the risk, the higher the premiums. If she cannot afford insurance, she should not be taking the risk. A white, anglo-saxon woman going to a place like Somalia on her own is INSANE. Sure, she is very brave, but also very stupid.

I honestly doubt she is brave. I'm guessing a combination of naive and dumb.

[VladtheImpaler]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I honestly doubt she is brave. I'm guessing a combination of naive and dumb.

Nah, I'll give some credit for having bigger cojones than Alexandre Burrows. She survived for 15 months and seemingly still together, so she certainly has some toughness/bravery/whatever you want to call it. I don't know what her purpose was in going there, what "story" she was chasing, so I cannot really judge that part of it.

[krazycanuck]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I honestly doubt she is brave. I'm guessing a combination of naive and dumb.

she's a journalist...she knew the dangers very well.

It's not like she was in Somalia to look at giraffes as a tourist, she was there working. Journalism isn't exclusive to covering the car accident down the street. She can hardly be blamed for her job taking her to Somalia.

[Savvy27]

Originally Posted by Jetsfan

So what your saying is as a Citizen of Canada I am obligated to cover the ransom due to her poor decisions under the pretext of her career otherwise you will throw me out of the country.

Nope. The government didn't pay her ransom, her family raised money and they paid off the kidnappers. You said that:

If one of my family members were stupid enough to go to a country like Somolia and ignore the travel warnings of the Canadian government then they're out of luck and they can fend for themselves.

This has nothing to do with your status as a citizen of Canada.

I'm not going to throw you out of the country, but I do suggest that you re-evaluate your determination that the greatest problem in Western society has to do with taxation, especially in a thread related to the disaster of a country (without government or taxes) that is Somalia.

What if she went to climb Mount Everest without an oxygen tank and became stranded on the summit, would you suggest that I should pay to have her rescued and flown back to Canada or I can move to Tibet.

I'm trying to keep up with you here, but you're a shifty one. Actually, here I would probably be in favour of a rescue mission to save a Canadian citizen. I know that we face an ever-present risk of gigantic mountains abducting people (and we all know that if we save them it will only inspire other mountains to join them in their evil scheme) and forcing them to strive for their summits out of a not-quite-understood plan for profit, but the value of human life and all that compels me to approve.

Let me be clear...she ignored warnings not to travel there and got kidnapped. As a citizen, it I am not obligated to pay for her poor decisions. Instead of suggesting that I move to Africa, maybe she should change her career!

Well since we're working in the service of clarity, you are not currently obligated to pay for her poor decision. If the government of Canada's policy was to pay any and all ransoms immediately, you would be obligated as a citizen to pay your share.

As an individual you may not believe that the government is justified in taking your property and using it for ends that you do not approve of, but as a citizen (member of a society) you share in the responsibility for other members of society. Of course you are free to try and change that policy through democratic means, but don't confuse democratic freedom with an absence of social responsibility.

More importantly, this story has nothing to do with you. She made a grave mistake and people who care about her, and others who care about people in general collected money to free her. I don't know why you are complaining about taxation in relation to a story that has nothing to do with taxes, or why you are complaining about having to be responsible for others in a case where private citizens CHOSE to support her (and I'm guessing that you did not choose to help her, since you explicitly stated that you wouldn't help, even if she was your own family member)?

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by Jetsfan

If one of my family members were stupid enough to go to a country like Somolia and ignore the travel warnings of the Canadian government then they're out of luck and they can fend for themselves.

Wow, I'm glad I'm not one of your kids or are related to you.

So say if your only child ever made the mistake that Amanda did and was kidnapped, you'd tell the kidnappers to go f themselves, and tell Amanda too bad? Then you can have the satisfaction of being right, while your daughter is gang raped and brutally killed by a bunch of Somali's. It must feel pretty darn good to tell her you told her so after that I guess.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by krazycanuck

she's a journalist...she knew the dangers very well.

It's not like she was in Somalia to look at giraffes as a tourist, she was there working. Journalism isn't exclusive to covering the car accident down the street. She can hardly be blamed for her job taking her to Somalia.

You could be right. I realize I made a big assumption, but I remember the 25 year old chicks I knew when I was 25 and I think naive would describe the vast majority moreso than brave.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Jetsfan

Thats the problem with Western civilization, no one wants to take personal responsibility for the decisions they make. Instead, responsible people like myself are forced, through taxation, to cover for these people.

You must be two people, one person can't be this stupid. As said over and over(starting with my post #9) tax dollars did not free this lady, her family did. If you wouldn't do the same thing for a family loved one then that would make you an ignorent prick.

[Jetsfan]

I'm not going to throw you out of the country, but I do suggest that you re-evaluate your determination that the greatest problem in Western society has to do with taxation, especially in a thread related to the disaster of a country (without government or taxes) that is Somalia.

If you go back and read my post, #37, you will see that I said that the problem with Western Society is that people do not want to take personal responsibility for they're actions.

I'm trying to keep up with you here, but you're a shifty one. Actually, here I would probably be in favour of a rescue mission to save a Canadian citizen. I know that we face an ever-present risk of gigantic mountains abducting people (and we all know that if we save them it will only inspire other mountains to join them in their evil scheme) and forcing them to strive for their summits out of a not-quite-understood plan for profit, but the value of human life and all that compels me to approve.

You mean just like the Somalis flew to Red Deer and kidnapped Amanda out of her house

Well since we're working in the service of clarity, you are not currently obligated to pay for her poor decision. If the government of Canada's policy was to pay any and all ransoms immediately, you would be obligated as a citizen to pay your share.

Correct, and if this were government policy I have a right to voice my opinion without a fellow citizen like you telling me to move to Africa if I don't like it.


More importantly, this story has nothing to do with you. She made a grave mistake and people who care about her, and others who care about people in general collected money to free her. I don't know why you are complaining about taxation in relation to a story that has nothing to do with taxes, or why you are complaining about having to be responsible for others in a case where private citizens CHOSE to support her (and I'm guessing that you did not choose to help her, since you explicitly stated that you wouldn't help, even if she was your own family member)?[/quote]

Correct, I would choose not to help her on the basis that she made a personal choice to go there and as an adult she is responsible for that choice.

If others want to help her great.

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by Jetsfan

Correct, I would choose not to help her on the basis that she made a personal choice to go there and as an adult she is responsible for that choice.

If others want to help her great.

Really? So what you are essentially saying is, your ego (for being right) is pretty much more important than the lives and well being of a loved one.

[VladtheImpaler]

If you are interested in the perspective of a woman who happens to be a journalist, I quote Mrs. Impaler:

"She is a selfish ######"

[Savvy27]

I hope those winks are supposed to mean you're joking.

Originally Posted by Jetsfan

If you go back and read my post, #37, you will see that I said that the problem with Western Society is that people do not want to take personal responsibility for they're actions.

Okay, that position is not unreasonable.

I'm trying to keep up with you here, but you're a shifty one. Actually, here I would probably be in favour of a rescue mission to save a Canadian citizen. I know that we face an ever-present risk of gigantic mountains abducting people (and we all know that if we save them it will only inspire other mountains to join them in their evil scheme) and forcing them to strive for their summits out of a not-quite-understood plan for profit, but the value of human life and all that compels me to approve.

You mean just like the Somalis flew to Red Deer and kidnapped Amanda out of her house

No, I mean like the Somali's who abducted Amanda while she was working as a reporter in Somalia, but of course that is absurd, since mountains are inanimate and that analogy wouldn't make any sense.

Correct, and if this were government policy I have a right to voice my opinion without a fellow citizen like you telling me to move to Africa if I don't like it.

You surely have the right to voice your opinion, but there's no guarantee that you have the right to do so without me telling you to move to Africa. I could tell you to do that regardless of what your opinion is or even the topic of the conversation. And let's be fair, I didn't tell you to move there, I just suggested that you should try it out.

Correct, I would choose not to help her on the basis that she made a personal choice to go there and as an adult she is responsible for that choice.

If others want to help her great.

So, in your eyes, her taking responsibility for her error is to die alone, after months of imprisonment and torture -abandoned by her family, friends and country- without expectation of rescue and bearing the full weight of responsibility for her situation.

Well... that's pretty psychopathic.

[OMG!WTF!]

Nice guy...


https://calgaryherald.com/opinion/co...-gave-her-life

For the first time, former hostage Amanda Lindhout has revealed who paid the bulk of her $1-million ransom nine years ago that got her released from her captors in Somalia. It was Allan Markin, who, by coincidence, was receiving The Mustard Seed‘s Golden Dove Award, for “exceptional support for the most vulnerable in our community.”