[PGT] Painful loss to the Ducks

[SuperMatt18]

Zadorov is a bit weird.

His play without the puck is great. He does a good job of protecting the front of the net, strong in the corners, and positionally tends to be sound...

But then he gets the puck on his stick and it's an absolute fire drill every single time. If it's not a giveaway then generally it means that he just flipped the puck in the air and out to center ice back to the other team.

Biggest issue is that neither him or Tanev should be the primary puck mover on a pair. It's hurting Tanev because it's not his strength and puts more pressure on Zadorov too.

Just not a fit as a pairing.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Zadorov is a bit weird.

His play without the puck is great. He does a good job of protecting the front of the net, strong in the corners, and positionally tends to be sound...

But then he gets the puck on his stick and it's an absolute fire drill every single time. If it's not a giveaway then generally it means that he just flipped the puck in the air and out to center ice back to the other team.

How does Erik Karlsson look this year, any good signs? Maybe we could throw some junk San Jose's way and pick up EK's contract to play with Zadorov.

This is me giving up on the straightforward solutions.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Zadorov is a bit weird.

His play without the puck is great. He does a good job of protecting the front of the net, strong in the corners, and positionally tends to be sound...

But then he gets the puck on his stick and it's an absolute fire drill every single time. If it's not a giveaway then generally it means that he just flipped the puck in the air and out to center ice back to the other team.

Biggest issue is that neither him or Tanev should be the primary puck mover on a pair. It's hurting Tanev because it's not his strength and puts more pressure on Zadorov too.

Just not a fit as a pairing.

I’m really surprised by the pairing, to be honest

I thought Darryl liked pairing a more stay at home guy with a puck mover, and this pairing does not really fit the bill at all

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

How does Erik Karlsson look this year, any good signs? Maybe we could throw some junk San Jose's way and pick up EK's contract to play with Zadorov.

This is me giving up on the straightforward solutions.

Its okay we have Karlsson at home!

We just staple him to the bench for reasons unknown.

[SuperMatt18]

Also what I'm seeing with Monahan is a guy who seems really afraid to get caught in the offensive zone, and might be overthinking his defensive responsibilities.

You'd see it a couple times where he was about to pinch in the offensive zone, would realize Dube / Mangipane were already below the goal line and he'd pull back up to be the high man.

Not sure if that's coaching or if it's something he's worried about right now just as he tries to focus on being more defensively responsible, but it was noticeable that he was really playing high in the offensive zone last night.

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

I’m really surprised by the pairing, to be honest

I thought Darryl liked pairing a more stay at home guy with a puck mover, and this pairing does not really fit the bill at all

I actually don't think it was their first choice.

Initially in the pre-season they had Zadorov-Andersson and Hanifin-Tanev...but Zadorov-Andersson just didn't seem to work at all in preseason. That fit the bill of more of a puck mover with a stay at home guy though.

I actually think stylistically Hanifin-Zadorov, and Tanev-Andersson would fit the best but that doesn't work from a LH-RH perspective.

My gut is we see Zadorov-Andersson and Hanifin-Tanev at some point, might work better now that Andersson seems to have found his legs and is playing better again.

[DeluxeMoustache]

^ that’s in line with my expectations too

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

Its okay we have Karlsson at home!

We just staple him to the bench for reasons unknown.

Ahem

"straightforward solutions"

[Lanny_McDonald]

Monahan thrives in a game where the puck is in the middle of the ice, where he can use the puck movement across the ice to find soft spots and convert. The Flames have gone to a more north-south, play-along-the-boards style, and it doesn't fit his game. I think his only hope of recovering his game is to be traded to a team that uses the middle of the ice and his skillset. He's not going to recover here in Calgary with the style being played.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Fan in Exile

Looking back on the league scorerboard over the past 3 days the team with the most shots on goal only won 8 out of 19 games. I don't care about SOG or corsi or moral victories. I want an entertaining team that finds ways to win. The Flames are now neither of those things.

Well, with a sample size of 19 games, flame away.

Why don’t you look at the direct correlation between positive Corsi and wins based on the last number of years, and get back to us.


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[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Fan in Exile

I want an entertaining team that finds ways to win. The Flames are now neither of those things.

I thought the team was very entertaining last night.

Physical, tenacious, and playing with speed and some creativity.

Honestly the result wasn't what we wanted but if you didn't find that team fun to watch last night then I'm not sure what to tell you.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Also what I'm seeing with Monahan is a guy who seems really afraid to get caught in the offensive zone, and might be overthinking his defensive responsibilities.

You'd see it a couple times where he was about to pinch in the offensive zone, would realize Dube / Mangipane were already below the goal line and he'd pull back up to be the high man.

Not sure if that's coaching or if it's something he's worried about right now just as he tries to focus on being more defensively responsible, but it was noticeable that he was really playing high in the offensive zone last night.



I actually don't think it was their first choice.

Initially in the pre-season they had Zadorov-Andersson and Hanifin-Tanev...but Zadorov-Andersson just didn't seem to work at all in preseason. That fit the bill of more of a puck mover with a stay at home guy though.

I actually think stylistically Hanifin-Zadorov, and Tanev-Andersson would fit the best but that doesn't work from a LH-RH perspective.

My gut is we see Zadorov-Andersson and Hanifin-Tanev at some point, might work better now that Andersson seems to have found his legs and is playing better again.

I get the lack of experience on LD pushed us to acquire Zadorov but with the wealth of experience on RD we have I don’t know why we just didn’t see if we could get by with Hanifin, Valimaki, Kylington and Mackey as our LD?

I understand we want depth and to mitigate risk but Zadorov was atrocious with the puck on his stick.

A top 6 with Zadorov and Gudbranson in it just feels like we are asking for trouble.

[Your Calgary Flames!]

Why can’t we give Sutter the benefit of the doubt, give him this chance to make the playoffs and see what he can do. I mean, he has earned that right? 2 cups and a final? His teams weren’t president winners. He try’s to Instill playoff type hockey through out the season to carry over. Seems to have worked for him. I want to see what he can get out of these guys if we do make it in.

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by Your Calgary Flames!

Why can’t we give Sutter the benefit of the doubt, give him this chance to make the playoffs and see what he can do. I mean, he has earned that right? 2 cups and a final? His teams weren’t president winners. He try’s to Instill playoff type hockey through out the season to carry over. Seems to have worked for him. I want to see what he can get out of these guys if we do make it in.

I agree, but isn't this what the Flames are doing?

[Fan in Exile]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Well, with a sample size of 19 games, flame away.

Why don’t you look at the direct correlation between positive Corsi and wins based on the last number of years, and get back to us.


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Why don't you show me what you're relying on? One would expect corsi and SOG to correspond to wins but I can't find any analysis that bears that out. In fact, much of what I've reviewed indicates the opposite. For example:

https://medium.com/hockey-stats/are-...y-f8f8d16811bf

[joejoe3]

Originally Posted by AC

The Flames used to be elite at 3 on 3 OT. Now we struggle to generate anything.

Very frustrating, but it shouldn't have been even close to OT to begin with.

I miss TJ Brodie in OT

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

Its okay we have Karlsson at home!

We just staple him to the bench for reasons unknown.

Kyllington is Karlsson now? common. Kyllington is ready to be a regular but he is far from a franchise player.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I thought the team was very entertaining last night.

Physical, tenacious, and playing with speed and some creativity.

Honestly the result wasn't what we wanted but if you didn't find that team fun to watch last night then I'm not sure what to tell you.

The Flames need to bury their chances. They played very well with exception to the fact that they need to finish.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Your Calgary Flames!

Why can’t we give Sutter the benefit of the doubt, give him this chance to make the playoffs and see what he can do. I mean, he has earned that right? 2 cups and a final? His teams weren’t president winners. He try’s to Instill playoff type hockey through out the season to carry over. Seems to have worked for him. I want to see what he can get out of these guys if we do make it in.

Sutter has now had what, 35-40 games and training camp with the majority of this group? How long is it supposed to take him to get this team to turn a corner? Good effort isn't enough in this league. It's a start, but the wheels are going to be completely off the track in a week or two if this group can't muster at least 3 goals a game more often than not.

It was pretty obvious this was going to be a problem when the genius GM didn't get something done to shake up the core and bring in more offensive weaponry. Now this team's margin is to score 2 goals and try to hang on for dear life each and every night? It's not happening often with guys like Monahan consistently taking the easy track in big moments and a hapless PP with no true elite finisher.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

For this team to be successful Markstrom has to be better.

That may be true at the end of the day. But he's playing appropriate to who he is: a good, sometimes excellent, but not elite goaltender. He's doing his part, in other words. It's the other guys who aren't - the top guys. And maybe you've just given up on that happening, but I don't know why the reaction to top-end players underperforming is to demand that the goalie overperform to make up for them. Give those guys ####, not Markstrom, is what I'm saying.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Fan in Exile

Why don't you show me what you're relying on? One would expect corsi and SOG to correspond to wins but I can't find any analysis that bears that out. In fact, much of what I've reviewed indicates the opposite. For example:

https://medium.com/hockey-stats/are-...y-f8f8d16811bf

It's not strong at predicting results in individual games.

But generally the teams that are better at CorsiFor and xGF over longer periods of time will be more successful than those that do not.

Here are the top 10 teams in the NHL over the past 3 seasons in CorsiFor and xGF%.

Corsi For:

1) Carolina
2) Montreal
3) Vegas
4) Colorado
5) Boston
6) Calgary
7) Tampa Bay
8) Toronto
9) San Jose
10) Nashville

xGF%:

1) Vegas
2) Carolina
3) Montreal
4) Tampa Bay
5) Colorado
6) Minnesota
7) Boston
8) Calgary
9) Dallas
10) Toronto

Those generally have been the best teams in the NHL over the same time period...with Washington and Pittsburgh being the exceptions that perform well while not controlling the shot attempts.

Here are couple of other articles:

http://hockey.greatapes.ca/index.php...cted-goals-is/