Calgary SSP Development Listing

[Bigtime]

Bucci's proposal "The Kensington" for the Carpenter's building site on 10th Street NW:

https://bucci.egnyte.com/h-s/20140410/Fe6QWfhHuL

The Kensington by Render Central, on Flickr

[calgarygeologist]

I haven't followed the news regarding Stampede Trail very much but today the Calgary Herald is reporting that Alberta Development Partners, the developer who was supposed to be putting together the Stampede Trail development, is stepping aside due to financial problems.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/busines...251/story.html

It sounds like Stampede Trail is going to sit vacant for quite a while yet. I'd be surprised if anything happens by 2020 now which is really disappointing. I'd really like to see that area expand to provide a better Stampede and overall lifestyle experience in Calgary but if the Calgary Stampede can't make it happen I think they should look at a land disposition option.

The east end of the downtown area has been looking very attractive with the proposed Stampede Trail and the East Village redevelopment but now Stampede Trail is a bust.

[Bigtime]

No surprise Stampede Trail is on hold yet again.

[CaptainYooh]

I've always been skeptical about collaborative public-private real estate initiatives. They always sound great at the beginning and rarely, if ever, result in a truly win-win positive outcomes. When one party wants to have a cake at the expense of another party, things are bound to get bad at some point, which is what happens most of the time, when the government is involved in them. We've seen so many examples here in Calgary of why it should not even be attempted. The only people winning here are the bureaucrats receiving fat pay-cheques and hired to manage these ventures without any good credentials based on their personal connections to the decision-makers.

The only right way for the forward-thinking municipality to re-develop a blighted area is by investing in its development via a wholly-owned development subsidiary (i.e. CMLC in East Village), that assumes all of the development risks and receives all of the development rewards through the full retail value of the developed land parcels sold to retail/commercial and residential builders through a fair market auction process. If a municipality has a certain architectural/planning vision for the area, then it should implement it at its own (public) dollar and see if the market is there to buy in at some point. Get the proper budget and pro-forma prepared, get the Council to digest it and approve it, hire professionals to do it and do it.

[Tyler]

Cross-posting this from SSP user Chadillaccc. Here's the progress of Brookfield Place as of today:

[cam_wmh]

Who owns the land between 11th & 12th Ave SE, from Olympic Way all the way to the Calgary Transit building? That's not the Stampede is it?

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by cam_wmh

Who owns the land between 11th & 12th Ave SE, from Olympic Way all the way to the Calgary Transit building? That's not the Stampede is it?

Remington has that land, and it has long been planned for his "Railtown" development.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Remington has that land, and it has long been planned for his "Railtown" development.

I'm not sure if that is correct. Remington land is north of 11 Ave to the CPR lines. Between 11 Ave and 12 Ave east of 4 Street is land that I believe belongs to the Stampede but the building have not been flattened yet and are still in use.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

I'm not sure if that is correct. Remington land is north of 11 Ave to the CPR lines. Between 11 Ave and 12 Ave east of 4 Street is land that I believe belongs to the Stampede but the building have not been flattened yet and are still in use.

Sorry, you are most likely correct on the Railtown land, however the Stampede does not own the land between 11th and 12th east of 4th street. Torode owned some at one point, and I believe Brad Lamb may have purchased a section too and has a proposal called "The Orchard" for it.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Sorry, you are most likely correct on the Railtown land, however the Stampede does not own the land between 11th and 12th east of 4th street. Torode owned some at one point, and I believe Brad Lamb may have purchased a section too and has a proposal called "The Orchard" for it.

It looks like you are correct on The Ochard and the ownership of that section of land. This shows that Lamb Development is planning a two building development spanning 8 properties between 602 and 628 along 12 Ave SE.

http://fortressrealdevelopments.com/...ject-page1.pdf

[rayne008]

Are there still plans for a entertainment district just north of Cowboys casino that would house places like an ESPN Zone and such?

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by rayne008

Are there still plans for a entertainment district just north of Cowboys casino that would house places like an ESPN Zone and such?

That is the overall vision of the Calgary Stampede and what they were working on with Alberta Development Partners. But it now seems that if the Stampede wants to make that vision a reality they will have to bring a new developer on board.

The Calgary Stampede has no interest in, and is not in the business, of developing the land. The Stampede just wants to lease the land under their vision and direction for the area to a developer who takes on all the risk.

[Barnes]

Originally Posted by rayne008

Are there still plans for a entertainment district just north of Cowboys casino that would house places like an ESPN Zone and such?

Plans? Yes. Execution? Not as long as the Stampede board is responsible for it.

Originally Posted by Bigtime

No surprise Stampede Trail is on hold yet again.

[Addick]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

I've always been skeptical about collaborative public-private real estate initiatives. They always sound great at the beginning and rarely, if ever, result in a truly win-win positive outcomes.

I share your skepticism and like the alternative you proposed, however, I've been led to believe that the lack of success in the case of Stampede Trail might be rooted into the alleged incompetence of the Stampede's Board of Directors.

[CaptainYooh]

Originally Posted by Addick

I share your skepticism and like the alternative you proposed, however, I've been led to believe that the lack of success in the case of Stampede Trail might be rooted into the alleged incompetence of the Stampede's Board of Directors.

Stampede Board is composed of very influential and, for the most part, very wealthy people. Most of them are not incompetent. Collectively, as a board, they are indecisive, because as a steward of the lands for the City, they need to have a clear mandate and direction, which is not there. As I said earlier, if the City has a strong architectural/planning vision for the area, it is not prudent of them to sit and wait for some white knight out there to come and build it for them; it doesn't happen this way. What's worse, sometimes these boards get enamoured by a good talker and a cute pencil sketch rendering and declare a new beginning, which turns sour, as soon as the real numbers come in and the "white knight" either asks for a lot more money or huge tax breaks or both.

[getbak]

At this point, I can't see anything happening with Stampede Trail until the location of the replacement for the Saddledome is finalized.

[Tyler]

Exactly. And what this tells me, is that the Flames have told the Stampede board that they're building in the West Village, so this entertainment district development doesn't make financial sense

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Exactly. And what this tells me, is that the Flames have told the Stampede board that they're building in the West Village, so this entertainment district development doesn't make financial sense

Or, the developers of the entertainment district are just as in the dark as we are as to the future location and that they can't get financing until the location of the new Dome is finalized.

[Muta]

I think the Stampede development will happen at some point. They need it to bridge the 'tourism corridor' that the city would like - from the Science Centre, to the Zoo, to the East Village to the Stampede. You could literally walk from one end to the other when this corridor is fully developed.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Muta

I think the Stampede development will happen at some point. They need it to bridge the 'tourism corridor' that the city would like - from the Science Centre, to the Zoo, to the East Village to the Stampede. You could literally walk from one end to the other when this corridor is fully developed.

You can already "literally" walk this corridor.