Calgary Vipers = Joke

[ricoFlame]

really, despite everything, it's a night at the ballpark which is a pretty damn fine way to spend some time in the summer.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

go ahead and hate on Young all you like but please dont lump him in with the rest of the staff and the team.

It's so nice of Mr. Young to join us

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

Not sure why all these people have such a hate on for the Vipers - go ahead and hate on Young all you like but please dont lump him in with the rest of the staff and the team.

Not sure anyone is trashing the staff. However, Young *is* the team. Even if they've changed the title, he's still the guy with his fingers in everything, and that is why everything has gone wrong.

This is going to remain a moribund franchise until he is booted out of the picture entirely. Even then, I wouldn't wish the challenge of trying to fix the mess he has made on anyone.

[Cowboy89]

I have to say I echo a lot of the opinions here on the board. I'm a huge baseball fan, but yet Vipers quality baseball is terrible. Maybe it's because since I grew up on the Cannons, but every Vipers game I've seen there are a good 4-5 errors commited by both teams, not including plays where the third baseman knocked the ball down but can't throw it to first in time to get the runner. To me the baseball element of Vipers games doesn't sell because it's terrible baseball. I'd rather watch a game on MLB.com, or sportsnet for the pure baseball element. If they want to sell their product to me it's got to be all about the experience.

Bottom line, I want to get to drink a lot of cold ones and eat a crap load of ballpark fare for less than $30. Last years prices and promotions allowed me to do that, this year's doesn't. No dice.

[Vipersfan]

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[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

It kind of makes me crazy to read all this when a lot of the suggestions you are all making are being implemented. They started having a twoonie tuesday (cheap popcorn or ice cream - I think it will change week to week) this week, there are some special days being announced (bring your dog) but I agree these things need to be up on the website. Have any of you ever thought to fire off an email with your constructive criticism(s) to Daryl Einarson (marketing) or the new president John Conrad? Those are the guys making the decisions, it isnt PY.
I think if people talked about the positives as well as the negatives it might be more of an incentive for other people to check out a game but that is just me.

Fair enough, but you said it right in your post, they have to get this stuff out to the general public. Like one poster said, if you just announce upcoming specials to the few people that are at games, then they're the only ones who will come back, along with maybe a few friends.

They need to spend a bit of money on a Sun or Herald ad, maybe listing a months worth of upcomig promotions.

If they really are starting to implement some great deals at the park, then I would love to choose some nights that work for me and head down with some friends.

[rubecube]

It's interesting listening to you guys talk about the Vipers. I think the organization has done a terrible job promoting the team. Unless you listened to the FAN 960, or went out your way to check the Vipers website, it was hard to know when games where. That's part of the reason I never got out to a Vipers game while I lived in Calgary. The other reason was the negative reputation surrounding the Vipers.

Compare that with what's going in Victoria right now and the Vipers look like an even bigger joke. Victoria just got the Seals this year, and although I rarely listen to the radio out here, I know how they've been doing and that their first home series is this weekend. I'll probably go check them out this Sunday.

[Cowboy89]

Another thing about the Vipers that I hate is the bush-league gimmicks. Trading a guy for bats, signing and actually playing Theo Fluery, buying a dilapidated mid-90s limo to take people to games. WTF. I know they want to create publicity, and maybe in places like Yuma this bush league stuff flies. But this is a city/region with 1.2 Million people. While the Golden League is in itself bush league, it's still important to at least act like you're a professional baseball franchise. In other words they should follow though on the slogan of "Professional Baseball in Calgary" and act 'Professional'. The Vipers look and feel like a club run by Gob from Arrested Development. All we need is the Final Countdown to play before they take the field at the start of the games!

[malcolmk14]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

All we need is the Final Countdown to play before they take the field at the start of the games!

This would actually get me to the park FWIW.

But seriously, I agree with everyone saying it's all about the ballpark experience. The quality of ball sucks, but the Spolumbo's combo the last few years is what's kept me coming back.

After reading they no longer have it, I doubt I'll get out to more than 2 or 3 games this year.

[Vipersfan]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

Another thing about the Vipers that I hate is the bush-league gimmicks. Trading a guy for bats, signing and actually playing Theo Fluery, buying a dilapidated mid-90s limo to take people to games. WTF. I know they want to create publicity, and maybe in places like Yuma this bush league stuff flies. But this is a city/region with 1.2 Million people. While the Golden League is in itself bush league, it's still important to at least act like you're a professional baseball franchise. In other words they should follow though on the slogan of "Professional Baseball in Calgary" and act 'Professional'. The Vipers look and feel like a club run by Gob from Arrested Development. All we need is the Final Countdown to play before they take the field at the start of the games!

..

[CrusaderPi]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

The Vipers look and feel like a club run by Gob from Arrested Development. All we need is the Final Countdown to play before they take the field at the start of the games!

Actually that gimmick might work. At least it would make me smile.

[malcolmk14]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

You dont the like the gimmicks, the bush league, the prices, blah, blah, blah. So dont come to anymore games, they wont get your money and you wont be subjected to anymore "professional" baseball. Then you can stop complaining. I get it already - you dont like the Vipers!

I don't think that's what he's trying to say.

There is obviously a demand for a ballpark experience in Calgary. If you make it attractive enough, people are going to come to the games despite the poor quality of the baseball itself.

Unfortunately for us, the people in charge of the team aren't doing a very good job of selling the ballpark experience. So combined with the poor quality baseball, how is the business going to have a chance to succeed?

We're not saying we don't like the Vipers. I think what we're saying is we're disappointed in how the opportunity to establish a somewhat successful business is being squandered by the people in charge.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

You dont the like the gimmicks, the bush league, the prices, blah, blah, blah. So dont come to anymore games, they wont get your money and you wont be subjected to anymore "professional" baseball. Then you can stop complaining. I get it already - you dont like the Vipers!

I've already voted with my feet this season. Just beating the dead horse as to why a million times over . The catch 22 in hoping for the Vipers demise is that ultimately should a legitimate owner or league look at expanding or moving franchises they will look over Calgary because of the poor showing for the Vipers.

[MJM]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

It kind of makes me crazy to read all this when a lot of the suggestions you are all making are being implemented. They started having a twoonie tuesday (cheap popcorn or ice cream - I think it will change week to week) this week, there are some special days being announced (bring your dog) but I agree these things need to be up on the website. Have any of you ever thought to fire off an email with your constructive criticism(s) to Daryl Einarson (marketing) or the new president John Conrad? Those are the guys making the decisions, it isnt PY.
I think if people talked about the positives as well as the negatives it might be more of an incentive for other people to check out a game but that is just me.

I actually talked to one of the Vipers management walking around at the game I was at and told them I had fully intended to buy season tickets or a couple flex passes prior to seeing the increases in price for concessions. Told them it didn't seem like a very smart idea to be having large price increases when 80% of the stadium was empty. I said all it did was alienate the small fanbase they have and would cause potential new fans to baulk at going when their concessions rival that of the Flames.

They didn't give two craps about my comments.

It's hurting them though whether they want to believe it or not. They lost about $400 bucks in guaranteed ticket revenue from me (not counting the food and beer I would buy). I'll still go to a game or two, but nothing like I would have. In respect to new fans, I generally would round up a bunch of guys from work from time to time to come to a Friday game. These are the type of guys you want as fans too (each guy would likely spend about $80-100 bucks per game with the inclusion of tickets, beer, and food), and I've managed to turn a few into regular fans . Last Friday I tried and I was asked if the beer was still $4.00 bucks and the food reasonably priced, to which I had to honestly answer that beer was like $6.00 bucks
and the concessions were similar prices to the Flames. They laughed and said we'll just go to a patio on 17th instead than.


I also walked out of the game with a family of 5 who heard me bitching about the price of beer and food to my fiancee, and they said to me they wouldn't be back with concessions at those prices. Said they went to quite a few games the previous year on the weekends, but wouldn't be this year.

[MJM]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

You dont the like the gimmicks, the bush league, the prices, blah, blah, blah. So dont come to anymore games, they wont get your money and you wont be subjected to anymore "professional" baseball. Then you can stop complaining. I get it already - you dont like the Vipers!

You attitude in this response is the exact reason everyone Calgary thinks the Vipers are nothing but a joke.

Telling someone if they don't like it to leave when the team regularly draws under 1000 fans, is assanine.

The Vipers can't fool the people on the quality of the baseball in this city. I'm a big fan and even i'll admit it's a bush league, full of never-been's. People in Calgary that actually go to the games go because they like baseball regardless of the quality (we don't have another choice, or trust me there'd be 0 people in the stands at Foothills), and sitting outside in the sun watching some sort of sporting event with some atmosphere. This being the case, to get new fans the Vipers have to do something other than sticking a sign in the yard saying "Professional Baseball". Raising concessions prices is not going to bring in new fans to a league that general public, by and large, could careless if it folded tommorow. All it does it is keep potential new fans away, and send some of the previously loyal fans packing (like myself and malcolm14k).

PS I hope you don't work for the Vipers, because if I was in charge of them and found out one of my employees was on here telling fans "To not come if you don't like the way things are run", you'd be fired on the spot.

[Vipersfan]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

I've already voted with my feet this season. Just beating the dead horse as to why a million times over . The catch 22 in hoping for the Vipers demise is that ultimately should a legitimate owner or league look at expanding or moving franchises they will look over Calgary because of the poor showing for the Vipers.

..

[MJM]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

Geez, now I gotta give. As one who also likes to beat a dead horse LoL. I do understand what everyone is saying about pretty much everything. People should start an email campaign, maybe management would listen then. There were a few decisions made this year that I didnt understand (one being opening all those extra concession stands - I can see it on a busy weekend but during the week??). Something has got to be done about the website for sure, there isnt anything much I like there. Hey did I just jump on a bandwagon???

The only thing I still dont agree with is the playing itself. I am just not seeing all these errors everyone else is. Next time I go I am going to keep track. The stand against the Armada was great from my point of view!

How do you not see these errors? The scores at these games are like 12-8 every game. This is the direct result of errors and absolutely garbage pitching throughout the league. Sure a 12-8 game makes for some excitement, but is certainly a testament to the skill level of the league.

[MJM]

Originally Posted by Vipersfan

Geez, now I gotta give. As one who also likes to beat a dead horse LoL. I do understand what everyone is saying about pretty much everything. People should start an email campaign, maybe management would listen then. There were a few decisions made this year that I didnt understand (one being opening all those extra concession stands - I can see it on a busy weekend but during the week??). Something has got to be done about the website for sure, there isnt anything much I like there. Hey did I just jump on a bandwagon???

The only thing I still dont agree with is the playing itself. I am just not seeing all these errors everyone else is. Next time I go I am going to keep track. The stand against the Armada was great from my point of view!

Why do people have to start an email campaign to get the Vipers to listen? The 80% empty seats in their 3000 seat stadiumin a city of 1.2 million should already be doing the talking.

[valo403]

I used to live in a city with a class A team, which is admittedly a better class of ball simply because it's filled with guys who are on the way up, not on the way out. I'm not much of a baseball fan, but I went to a game simply for the $2 beers on thursdays and wound up going when I could thereafter. I should also mention that I was joined at that first Thursday game by about 1500-2000 fellow university students.

Hey wait, isn't foothills right across from the university? You think that a promotion along those lines might draw in some students or other young people in the area? People don't care about the game, they care about having a good time. That area is full of young people even in the summer, show them a good time and they'll come back.

It's just a small example of an organization being completely oblivious to a captivate fan base sitting right at their doorstep.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by MJM

How do you not see these errors? The scores at these games are like 12-8 every game. This is the direct result of errors and absolutely garbage pitching throughout the league. Sure a 12-8 game makes for some excitement, but is certainly a testament to the skill level of the league.

To be fair there were plenty of high scoring games when the Cannons played here too with smaller field specs and high altitude air. A pitcher was good on the Cannons if they could keep their ERA under 4.50. With regard to the errors, often it's not even the plays that get scored an error that illuminate the lack of skill. When I go to the games the lack of range of the infielders is very evident. It's more difficult to turn 2, poor throws from third base, and just plain a lot more ground balls that get out of the infield compared to higher levels of ball.

Compared to the brief stint of the Calgary Outlaws and (although beloved) the Dawgs the quality of ball is a few notches better. I would put the Vipers on par with Single A ball. There's nothing wrong with single A ball, but I would prefer to watch single A quality ball involving promising prospects on their way up the ranks than never-has-and never will-beens.