Minneapolis PD Suffocate Unarmed Black Man Who Later Dies in Hospital

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

What if Taylor had been a kid?

Probably nothing changes if she had been a kid. A bad cop who was scared s***less of black people opened fire on 12-year old Tamir Rice within two seconds of his patrol car arriving on the scene, not even giving Tamir an opportunity to raise his hands and drop the toy gun he was holding before he shot the kid to death. A grand jury declined to charge Tamir's murderer with any wrongdoing.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

The word racism doesn't mean anything to you, does it? It's just a weapon to wield at people who don't agree with your hore#### narrative.

Do yourself a favour and listen to the daily September 9th and 10th. I know, I know, the New York Times is an extreme right wing outfit, but have an open mind. The police had valid reasons to be there. She called the dude in jail and referred to her home as the trap house. Known associates of the ex who were drug dealers were seen coming and going to her home with packages. They were looking for drug money with probable cause. They were fired on. They returned fire. It's hardly racism, and hardly a cold blooded murder.

I'm all for ending the war on drugs so people don't die over stashing drug dealers money. Too many people are in jail for low level offences, and that falls disproportionately on the black community. But there's absolutely zero evidence to suggest this was in any way racially motivated. People want to assign blame to some one but its impossible here. Too many bad decisions from people going back to Reagan and Bush's war on drugs, up to Breonna allowing her loser ex to rope into his drug activity. Obviously she didn't deserve to die. Obviously. It's also not her fault. But you can't just say this is racially motivated murder. It's a tragedy. Tragedies don't always have single causes and can be complicated.

The whole point of the term 'systemic' is to describe a system that produces racist results regardless of the actions of individuals within it, US drug laws are and always have been systemically racist, they were first created a century ago to stop black people using drugs, marijuana being seen as a 'black drug', their enforcement has always been racially biased towards the policing and arrest of more black and brown Americans than white even though there has never been any evidence of any difference in drug use by whites.

As such all of this means the very fact the Police were attempting to use a no knock warrant on dubious grounds to persue a minor drug dealer in a poor black neighborhood, a set of circumstances that is all but unknown in a white middle class community, makes her death an outcome of systemic racism, and it would if every cop was black as the only reason they were there and caused her death was due to the racist policing of drugs in the US

[GGG]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Just about every one of these incidents can be accurately, or at least plausibly, attributed partly to systemic racism. There's just no way to convincingly determine to what extent systemic racism was to blame. And it's obviously never the only factor (no systemic factor could be). So saying that systemic racism was to blame for this strikes me as a fairly meaningless statement, regardless of what WO403's position is about that.

I think the value in calling it out specifically as systemic racism is that it should force people to look deeper at why this happens.

If cases can be summed up as all laws were followed and no one is at fault like many of these cases then they are dismissed as acceptable.

Instead the system that leads to these events occurring needs to be evaluated and modified to prevent it. The value in labeling and specifically calling it out is to say the systems of laws that leads to these types of events occurring and being considered acceptable needs to change.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

As such all of this means the very fact the Police were attempting to use a no knock warrant on dubious grounds to persue a minor drug dealer in a poor black neighborhood, a set of circumstances that is all but unknown in a white middle class community, makes her death an outcome of systemic racism, and it would if every cop was black as the only reason they were there and caused her death was due to the racist policing of drugs in the US

Comparing how police behave in a poor black community vs a middle-class white community doesn't tell us much about systemic racism. A more relevant comparison would be a poor black community vs a poor white community.

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Comparing how police behave in a poor black community vs a middle-class white community doesn't tell us much about systemic racism. A more relevant comparison would be a poor black community vs a poor white community.

There's very few poor, white urban neighborhoods, so it's a hard comparison to make. The poor, white communities I am familiar with are pretty much left alone by a dubious sheriff that aren't running these kind of sting operations on the local meth/opiate dealers or are on the take.

[SebC]

"Florida man" strikes again, only this time he's the Governor.

Florida Governor Ron DeSantis on Monday introduced legislation that could remove legal repercussions for those "fleeing" from a "mob" by using their cars to run over protesters at demonstrations.

DeSantis included the provision as part of a new law dubbed the Combatting Violence, Disorder and Looting and Protecting Law Enforcement Act. One part of the law aims to criminalize certain protests occurring on roads, creating a third-degree felony for those who "obstruct traffic during an unpermitted protest, demonstration or violent or disorderly assembly,"

- Newsweek

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

The word racism doesn't mean anything to you, does it? It's just a weapon to wield at people who don't agree with your hore#### narrative.

Do yourself a favour and listen to the daily September 9th and 10th. I know, I know, the New York Times is an extreme right wing outfit, but have an open mind. The police had valid reasons to be there. She called the dude in jail and referred to her home as the trap house. Known associates of the ex who were drug dealers were seen coming and going to her home with packages. They were looking for drug money with probable cause. They were fired on. They returned fire. It's hardly racism, and hardly a cold blooded murder.

I'm all for ending the war on drugs so people don't die over stashing drug dealers money. Too many people are in jail for low level offences, and that falls disproportionately on the black community. But there's absolutely zero evidence to suggest this was in any way racially motivated. People want to assign blame to some one but its impossible here. Too many bad decisions from people going back to Reagan and Bush's war on drugs, up to Breonna allowing her loser ex to rope into his drug activity. Obviously she didn't deserve to die. Obviously. It's also not her fault. But you can't just say this is racially motivated murder. It's a tragedy. Tragedies don't always have single causes and can be complicated.

You repeatedly defend racist actions and deny there is a racist institution.

You are very clearly pro-racist, or RACIST if you will.

and to for you to tell a black man that the word racism means nothing to him is beyond ####ing ignorant and proves what a piece of ####ing #### you are.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

But it doesn’t make him a racist piece of garbage. That’s a stupid thing to say.

Debate the topic then. Hurling moronic unfounded insults achieves nothing.

The dude has been stepping in and defending racism and intentionally making excuses for a racist institution the entire ####ing time in this thread. So yes, he is a racist piece of garbage.

[indes]

Maybe time to take a step back? I'm not sure what you think calling people pieces of #### is going to accomplish. If you believe that anyone who doesn't agree with you on some of these incidents makes them worthless then I don't think you're helping.

I've appreciated a lot of your posts in this thread but crying racism for differing views on the root cause of a tragedy is pretty childish.

The less real discussion we have, the longer it takes for things to change. It doesn't need to be sensationalized or devolved into a team sport.

The way I look at it is; if you can't listen to people with differing views, then you shouldn't be heard.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by indes

Maybe time to take a step back? I'm not sure what you think calling people pieces of #### is going to accomplish. If you believe that anyone who doesn't agree with you on some of these incidents makes them worthless then I don't think you're helping.

I've appreciated a lot of your posts in this thread but crying racism for differing views on the root cause of a tragedy is pretty childish.

The less real discussion we have, the longer it takes for things to change. It doesn't need to be sensationalized or devolved into a team sport.

The way I look at it is; if you can't listen to people with differing views, then you shouldn't be heard.

So we should sit back and let racists be racist without saying anything? We've done that for hundred of years and where did it get us?

Despite daily evidence of systemic racism, and unarmed blacks being murdered at alarming rates, this dude comes in and ALWAYS blames the victim, ALWAYS denies systemic racism exists, ALWAYS defends racist actions.

I'm sorry but one who spends their time always blaming the black victim, always claiming there is no racism and always defending racist actions, they are a ####ing racist and a racist is always a piece of ####.

But now because I speak out, I need to "step back"....... do you tell women fighting for men to stop raping women and calling out people who defend rape and victim blame to step back?

But the minute a ###### speaks his mind, look at how people react.

[indes]

Originally Posted by Crown Royal

So we should sit back and let racists be racist without saying anything? We've done that for hundred of years and where did it get us?

Despite daily evidence of systemic racism, and unarmed blacks being murdered at alarming rates, this dude comes in and ALWAYS blames the victim, ALWAYS denies systemic racism exists, ALWAYS defends racist actions.

I'm sorry but one who spends their time always blaming the black victim, always claiming there is no racism and always defending racist actions, they are a ####ing racist and a racist is always a piece of ####.

But now because I speak out, I need to "step back"....... do you tell women fighting for men to stop raping women and calling out people who defend rape and victim blame to step back?

But the minute a ###### speaks his mind, look at how people react.

No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying the more we can continue a discussion the more thought it will provoke. Trying to change one person's beliefs isn't the goal. There are a lot more readers than writers on this forum.

You've done a great job in this thread spurring that discussion and raising awareness. Now instead of talking about issues and creating that discussion we're increasing the divisiveness.

"Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof." - Jon Galbraith

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by indes

No that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying the more we can continue a discussion the more thought it will provoke. Trying to change one person's beliefs isn't the goal. There are a lot more readers than writers on this forum.

You've done a great job in this thread spurring that discussion and raising awareness. Now instead of talking about issues and creating that discussion we're increasing the divisiveness.

"Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof." - Jon Galbraith

Maybe it's time to flip the script, let racists learn what it feels like to see their own kind swinging from trees (metaphorically). Someone will never know what it feels like to have your people marginalized and brutalized until it happens to them.

To be clear, I am talking about treating racists like #### (of all races), not white folks in general.

[indes]

Originally Posted by Crown Royal

Maybe it's time to flip the script, let racists learn what it feels like to see their own kind swinging from trees (metaphorically). Someone will never know what it feels like to have your people marginalized and brutalized until it happens to them.

To be clear, I am talking about treating racists like #### (of all races), not white folks in general.

Maybe it is. What you're doing to this conversation is basically the same as burning down a store during a protest. It just undermines people looking for real change.

If you think the time for protesting is over and it's time to riot (metaphorically) then power to you.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by indes

Maybe it is. What you're doing to this conversation is basically the same as burning down a store during a protest. It just undermines people looking for real change.

If you think the time for protesting is over and it's time to riot (metaphorically) then power to you.

You seem like a decent guy/gal, so I am going to assume you don't realize what you are actually saying is quite offensive to me.

This poster has repeatedly denied our struggles even exist in this thread, he may not go around calling us racist names, but he very much is part of the problem. Earlier in this thread it got bad enough that someone insinuated his username was race related.

You are asking me to listen to someone and treat them with respect despite him marginalizing my entire race on a continual basis, essentially stating that if a cop kills me, it's my own fault because institutional racism doesn't exist.

Calling him out for that and calling him what he is, is not akin to burning down a store in a riot. He is not collateral damage, he is not in the wrong place at the wrong time, he is a big part of the problem. This is closer to burning down the police station that employed the officers that murdered George Floyd.

In the end, in a thread where I am fighting to bring awareness to our struggles, trying to show people what we go through, you are defending soemone who is doing the things I am trying to fight against and draw attention to. By defending him, you are defending his actions, which in turn makes you part of the problem too. Like I said above, I don't think that is your intention, but that is what you are doing.

[PsYcNeT]

It's just the tired centrists squealing about "decorum" and "composure", when their communities and families aren't the ones dying, living in substandard conditions, facing massive hurdles to achieve even the smallest progress, because everything to them is a debate exercise.

Detaching oneself from the subject matter and waving your finger tone policing minorities is the raison d'etre in modern discourse.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Yeah, sorry, no. There are - at least in theory - forum rules. Apparently, one poster is just allowed to come in and call other people racist pieces of #### because he doesn't like what they've said, then double down on that repeatedly. I wonder why no one else is allowed to behave that way.

Can you imagine what would happen if a person like BoLevi, with his set of beliefs, interacted with other posters like this? I can.

[White Out 403]

This thread is complete ####ing tire fire.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Yeah, sorry, no. There are - at least in theory - forum rules. Apparently, one poster is just allowed to come in and call other people racist pieces of #### because he doesn't like what they've said, then double down on that repeatedly. I wonder why no one else is allowed to behave that way.

Can you imagine what would happen if a person like BoLevi, with his set of beliefs, interacted with other posters like this? I can.

Then report me. Let the mods decide.

And the fact you think me calling a racist a racist, is worse than the racist being racist, says a hell of alot about you

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by Crown Royal

Then report me. Let the mods decide.

And the fact you think me calling a racist a racist, is worse than the racist being racist, says a hell of alot about you

Hey man, seriously go #### yourself. It was kind of funny the first couple times to see you flip out and spew verbal diarrhea over the foum, but just because I don't agree with your hysterical interpretation of the Breonna Taylor killing doesn't make me racist. Shut the #### up.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Agreed with Corsi. There’s a level of discourse required to participate here. You don’t have to be perfect, but this isn’t a race war. We are all, more or less, on the same side.

I get it’s easy to get caught up in the emotion of what is going on down south but trying to bring that fight to this forum is totally misguided. You can’t equate a debate on CP with the violence and injustice going on in the USA. They are not remotely comparable.

We can talk about the situation in the USA and also talk about systemic racism in Canada. But it doesn’t make them the exact same thing and doesn’t make your attitude in this thread acceptable. There are no riot police here infringing on your rights and killing civilians.