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Old 12-05-2021, 09:16 AM   #481
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He has a NTC
Modified.

8 team trade list
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Old 12-05-2021, 01:00 PM   #482
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If we can move Monahan for picks / prospects this summer I expect we can sign Kylington (4.5M), Mangiapane (5M), Tkachuk and Gaudreau matching (9.25M)

Current Free Space: 1.55M
Walk: Zadorov, Pitlick, Richardson, Stone, Ritchie, Gudbranson (9.9M)
Buyouts coming off: Brouwer (1.5M)
Trade: Monahan (6.375M)

Total cap to do the below: 19.325M

Promoted: Valimaki, Mackey, Pelletier, Ruzicka ~3M
Gaudreau/Kylington/Mangiapane/Tkachuk Raises: 11.075M
Potential to Keep: Lewis (750K)

Cap space remaining after all the above happens: 5.25M to sign one roster player.


Roster 2022/23:

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk
Mangiapane - Backlund - UFA 5.25M
Pelletier - Dube - Coleman
Lucic - Lewis - Ruzicka

Hanifin Andersson
Tanev Kylington
Valimaki Mackey

Markstrom
Vladar
I have my doubts that you could trade all of Monahans cap hit without taking back a substantial contract . It is summer so it wouldn’t have to be dollar for dollar , but I would have to think your taking back at least $4 million .
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Old 12-05-2021, 02:40 PM   #483
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Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy View Post
Modified.

8 team trade list
Correct. Lucic also has an NMC (which he waived for the expansion draft), but that does not affect trades one way or the other.

According to CapFriendly, starting on July 1, it becomes a 10-team trade list.
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Old 12-05-2021, 02:43 PM   #484
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I have my doubts that you could trade all of Monahans cap hit without taking back a substantial contract . It is summer so it wouldn’t have to be dollar for dollar , but I would have to think your taking back at least $4 million .
Pencil in Toffoli.

Monny ++ for Toffoli.
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Old 12-05-2021, 02:46 PM   #485
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Originally Posted by jg13 View Post
If we can move Monahan for picks / prospects this summer I expect we can sign Kylington (4.5M), Mangiapane (5M), Tkachuk and Gaudreau matching (9.25M)

Current Free Space: 1.55M
Walk: Zadorov, Pitlick, Richardson, Stone, Ritchie, Gudbranson (9.9M)
Buyouts coming off: Brouwer (1.5M)
Trade: Monahan (6.375M)

Total cap to do the below: 19.325M

Promoted: Valimaki, Mackey, Pelletier, Ruzicka ~3M
Gaudreau/Kylington/Mangiapane/Tkachuk Raises: 11.075M
Potential to Keep: Lewis (750K)

Cap space remaining after all the above happens: 5.25M to sign one roster player.

Roster 2022/23:

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk
Mangiapane - Backlund - UFA 5.25M
Pelletier - Dube - Coleman
Lucic - Lewis - Ruzicka

Hanifin Andersson
Tanev Kylington
Valimaki Mackey

Markstrom
Vladar

What does this work out to for each player?
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Old 12-05-2021, 02:59 PM   #486
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What does this work out to for each player?
Not enough.
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Old 12-05-2021, 03:04 PM   #487
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I think thats more than enough. $2.5 to Gaudreau. $2.5 to Tkachuk.$3.5 for Mangiapane and about $2.5 more to Kylinton.
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Old 12-05-2021, 03:11 PM   #488
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Originally Posted by mdubz View Post
What does this work out to for each player?
Roster 2022/23:

Gaudreau 9.25M - Lindholm 4.85M - Tkachuk 9.25M
Mangiapane 5M - Backlund 5.35 - UFA 5.25M
Pelletier 863K - Dube 2.3M - Coleman 4.9M
Lucic 5.25M - Lewis 750K - Ruzicka 785K

Hanifin 4.95M Andersson 4.55M
Tanev 4.5M Kylington 4.5M
Valimaki 1.55M Mackey 750K

Markstrom 6M
Vladar 750K
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Old 12-06-2021, 12:33 AM   #489
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jg13 View Post
Roster 2022/23:

Gaudreau 9.25M - Lindholm 4.85M - Tkachuk 9.25M
Mangiapane 5M - Backlund 5.35 - UFA 5.25M
Pelletier 863K - Dube 2.3M - Coleman 4.9M
Lucic 5.25M - Lewis 750K - Ruzicka 785K

Hanifin 4.95M Andersson 4.55M
Tanev 4.5M Kylington 4.5M
Valimaki 1.55M Mackey 750K

Markstrom 6M
Vladar 750K
Like your optimism, but there's a lot of best case scenarios in your projection here. First off, you didn't include a 13th and 7th forward, so minus $1.5M minimum. If the Flames cannot completely rid themselves of Monahan's cap hit, then that's a possible $2.3M buyout on the books. Additionally, what if Gaudreau and Tkachuk's cap hit ends up higher than $9.25M? Also, I can't see Mangiapane making $5M. He's sitting 3rd in NHL scoring right now. His cap hit I imagine will likely be closer to $6M+. Lastly, you don't see the Flames re-signing Gudbranson? He's played every game and is a legit right handed shot whereas Mackey shoots left. Sutter isn't one to just hand jobs over to young players, in fact, he's the exact opposite. So, I'm not sure I see a Valimaki-Mackey pairing next season.

So, that possible $5.25M UFA...may actually be $0 depending on how everything else I stated goes. Actually, in a worst case scenario, I could see the Flames having to drop several players just to afford some of these pending raises.
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Old 12-06-2021, 01:21 AM   #490
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Like your optimism, but there's a lot of best case scenarios in your projection here. First off, you didn't include a 13th and 7th forward, so minus $1.5M minimum. If the Flames cannot completely rid themselves of Monahan's cap hit, then that's a possible $2.3M buyout on the books. Additionally, what if Gaudreau and Tkachuk's cap hit ends up higher than $9.25M? Also, I can't see Mangiapane making $5M. He's sitting 3rd in NHL scoring right now. His cap hit I imagine will likely be closer to $6M+. Lastly, you don't see the Flames re-signing Gudbranson? He's played every game and is a legit right handed shot whereas Mackey shoots left. Sutter isn't one to just hand jobs over to young players, in fact, he's the exact opposite. So, I'm not sure I see a Valimaki-Mackey pairing next season.

So, that possible $5.25M UFA...may actually be $0 depending on how everything else I stated goes. Actually, in a worst case scenario, I could see the Flames having to drop several players just to afford some of these pending raises.
You definitely make some good points. The point of my post was just to show it's possible to keep all 4 RFAs if you get a little creative.

Although on Mangiapane, I will be shocked if he gets anywhere near 6M.

Lindholm signed a longterm deal for less than 5M and IMO he had more of a case for a bigger contract than Mangiapane does now. Also Treliving is magic with RFAs I expect we'll see more of the same when it comes to 88 and 58.
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Old 12-06-2021, 01:52 AM   #491
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You definitely make some good points. The point of my post was just to show it's possible to keep all 4 RFAs if you get a little creative.

Although on Mangiapane, I will be shocked if he gets anywhere near 6M.

Lindholm signed a longterm deal for less than 5M and IMO he had more of a case for a bigger contract than Mangiapane does now. Also Treliving is magic with RFAs I expect we'll see more of the same when it comes to 88 and 58.

Lindholm was a pretty consistent 40 point player when he signed his RFA contract.

It really depends on where Mangiapane’s stats end up this year. He already basically has as many goals as Lindholm was getting. I doubt he goes scoreless the rest of the year.


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Old 12-06-2021, 02:16 AM   #492
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45 points in back to back seasons prior to signing his RFA contract. Mangiapane hasn't exceeded 32 points once yet but warrants more than a million more a year than Lindholm?

Yes outscoring Lindholm in terms of goals but only putting up basically 10% of his assists while playing a less important position.

Let's see where Mangiapane ends up this year but I do expect that shooting percentage to come down and although I know Mangiapane is a much better player than Bouma, look what happened when we signed Bouma after his career year.



I still expect Treliving to sign him in the 4.75-5M range as a RFA.
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Old 12-06-2021, 08:42 AM   #493
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I think the ways in which Bouma scored those goals/points and how Mangiapane is going about his business are two different things. He will regress back a bit for sure on goal scoring but his assists should balance too, I don’t see Andrew falling completely off a cliff like Bouma did even after the pressures that will come with a big time contract.
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Old 12-06-2021, 09:50 AM   #494
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lol

Bouma and Mangiapane are not comparable in any way.

Bouma never produced elite offense at ANY level. His career high for goals came in the NHL.

He's a total outlier and nothing like Mangiapane.
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Old 12-06-2021, 10:54 AM   #495
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45 points in back to back seasons prior to signing his RFA contract. Mangiapane hasn't exceeded 32 points once yet but warrants more than a million more a year than Lindholm?

Yes outscoring Lindholm in terms of goals but only putting up basically 10% of his assists while playing a less important position.

Let's see where Mangiapane ends up this year but I do expect that shooting percentage to come down and although I know Mangiapane is a much better player than Bouma, look what happened when we signed Bouma after his career year.



I still expect Treliving to sign him in the 4.75-5M range as a RFA.
Magnipanne is on pace for 55ish goals, if he gets over 40 it's over 6MM all day long, Tre already said show me on his last deal and now you think Magnipanne is going to settle for less than 5 after a break out year?
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Old 12-06-2021, 10:59 AM   #496
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45 points in back to back seasons prior to signing his RFA contract. Mangiapane hasn't exceeded 32 points once yet but warrants more than a million more a year than Lindholm?

Yes outscoring Lindholm in terms of goals but only putting up basically 10% of his assists while playing a less important position.

Let's see where Mangiapane ends up this year but I do expect that shooting percentage to come down and although I know Mangiapane is a much better player than Bouma, look what happened when we signed Bouma after his career year.



I still expect Treliving to sign him in the 4.75-5M range as a RFA.
Mangiapane over his last two years (Combined) has produced at a greater than 40 point pace, as it's unfair to simply say 32 points when it's based on a partial season.

Plus he's on a 66 point pace (56 goals) this year, so it's impossible to know what his cap range will be until you see where he eventually lands this year. No one expects him to keep up this pace, but if he lands on 55 or more points, he'll get more than $5M. How much more depends entirely on his year.
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Old 12-06-2021, 11:00 AM   #497
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Lindholm would get $9M right now if he was a UFA. He's a PPG player that is having elite defensive results this season.

But he signed his last contract when he was a 45-50 point player that had never scored 20 goals.

It's not Mangiapane's fault the last two seasons were shortened, and Mangiapane's 82 game pace the last three seasons is:

19-20: 20 goals, 38 points
20-21: 26 goals, 46 points
21-22: 55 goals, 65 points (current pace)

If he gets 40 goals and 60 points this season then we are probably looking at least at $6M on a contract, and maybe closer to $7M.

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Old 12-06-2021, 01:20 PM   #498
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Mangiapane:

Takes 2.52 shots per game / 207 shots in a 82 game season
Scores on 17.9% of his shots throughout his career
He's scoring on 27% shots this year

If things balance out and he returns to his career shooting % he will have 37 goals this year and roughly 15 assists for a career year of 52 points.

I guess we'll see what he's able to do in the next 55 games. I'm rooting for him because the more he scores the more likely we make a run at the cup, but if he's asking 6M+ and won't budge he's the first i'd move of the big 4 RFAs if Gaudreau / Tkachuk are asking under 10M and Kylington is asking less than 5M.
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Old 12-06-2021, 01:50 PM   #499
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Comparing Mangiapane to a scrub grinder in Bouma is just farcical.

Nothing alike about them at all. It's a pretty big disservice to the player Mangi has become.
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Old 12-06-2021, 02:07 PM   #500
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I think the ways in which Bouma scored those goals/points and how Mangiapane is going about his business are two different things. He will regress back a bit for sure on goal scoring but his assists should balance too, I don’t see Andrew falling completely off a cliff like Bouma did even after the pressures that will come with a big time contract.
Bouma didn't fall off a cliff. Bouma had one outlier of a year in which he outperformed his normal levels for one single year and then after that went back to being what he actually was, a fringe scrub NHLer for a few more years.
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