[News] Official expansion alignment, expansion draft rules, and 2017 entry draft rules

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

It's one of my off-season hopes.

My bet is both those two re-sign in SJ after the ED is over, which leads to cries of "ED circumvention!" that fall on deaf NHL execs ears.

But yeah, Marleau for 1 year @ $5 million would be fantastic.

Imagine if Vegas took Brouwer and Calgary got Marleau for net $1M or so?

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Imagine if Vegas took Brouwer and Calgary got Marleau for net $1M or so?

Oh yes, I've imagined it.

Think about Bennett having Marleau on his wing for a year or two, in games, in practices, giving him tips, showing him the ropes, burying his passes...

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Not quite right. As Getback posted earlier, Pittsburgh will only deal Fleury if the return is at least equal to or higher than the player that Pittsburgh would then end up losing in the expansion draft in lieu of Fleury.

That makes no sense at all. What you are saying is that Pittsburgh will do one of two things:

(a) Trade Fleury, but only for such assets as will 100% compensate for any other player lost in the expansion draft;

(b) Lose Fleury in the expansion draft and do nothing about it.

Normally, in dealing with a projected loss of assets, you consider options other than total mitigation and no mitigation at all. It's better to cut your losses than just sit and take them, even if you can't cut your losses all the way to zero.

If the market dictates that you can't cut the losses to zero, logic dictates that you do the best you can. You appear to advocate that the Penguins should just take it on the chin if they can't find a perfect deal.

[Tiger]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

That makes no sense at all. What you are saying is that Pittsburgh will do one of two things:

(a) Trade Fleury, but only for such assets as will 100% compensate for any other player lost in the expansion draft;

(b) Lose MURRAY in the expansion draft and do nothing about it.

Normally, in dealing with a projected loss of assets, you consider options other than total mitigation and no mitigation at all. It's better to cut your losses than just sit and take them, even if you can't cut your losses all the way to zero.

If the market dictates that you can't cut the losses to zero, logic dictates that you do the best you can. You appear to advocate that the Penguins should just take it on the chin if they can't find a perfect deal.

If they don't do something with fluery then they lose Murray or have to make a deal with the LGK to give them an asset to pick someone else

A)trade Fleury and get something
B) Don't trade him lose Murray
c) Trade prospect/picks to have them pick one of their D etc.

[Roof-Daddy]

All the Pens have to do with Fleury is have him agree to waive his NMC, and for all we know that may have already happened unofficially.

If that happens then they protect Murray and Vegas decides whether to take Fleury or one of their forwards or D that will be exposed (Hagelin, Dumoulin, Cole, Pouliot)

[FanIn80]

Patty Marleau is extremely high up on my list of all-times faves, so I would be ecstatic to see him come here. It would also be interesting to see if took and/or was given #12...

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

That makes no sense at all. What you are saying is that Pittsburgh will do one of two things:

(a) Trade Fleury, but only for such assets as will 100% compensate for any other player lost in the expansion draft;

(b) Lose Fleury in the expansion draft and do nothing about it.

Normally, in dealing with a projected loss of assets, you consider options other than total mitigation and no mitigation at all. It's better to cut your losses than just sit and take them, even if you can't cut your losses all the way to zero.

If the market dictates that you can't cut the losses to zero, logic dictates that you do the best you can. You appear to advocate that the Penguins should just take it on the chin if they can't find a perfect deal.

What exactly isn't making sense?

It isn't mitigating a loss. A loss is to be had. Pittsburgh - like every single other NHL team - is going to lose exactly one player to the expansion draft. That player is already widely reported as going to be Fleury.

Now, let's say Pittsburgh ends up trading Fleury for pennies on the dollar. Pennies on the dollar is better than nothing, right? Well, let's go back to the fact that every team is going to lose exactly one player in the expansion draft.

Let's say for the sake of argument that Dumoulin is the next best player available on the Pens. So the best offer they get for Fleury is a 4th round pick.

Out:
Fleury - trade to 'X' team
Dumoulin - Vegas through the expansion draft

In:
4th round pick

Is this a preferable situation to just biting the bullet and letting Fleury get selected by Vegas? I don't think so.

That is how teams have to manage their assets.

[bigrangy]

The problem for Pittsburgh is more complicated than for other teams due to Fleury's NMC.

Assuming he doesn't waive it, they will have to either trade him or buy him out in order to protect Murray, which they will do at all costs (Losing Dumoulin or Schultz, while a big deal, is a small blow compared to losing Murray).

Of course, if Fleury waives, then Pittsburgh is in a great situation. VGK will (probably) take Fleury and Pittsburgh will clear 5.75 million off their cap while still having an elite #1 which could allow them to add more for another cup run next year.

I don't expect Fleury to waive, since the only reason for him to would be out of loyalty, which is sort of rare among hockey players (and honestly should be imo).

[bax]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

Patty Marleau is extremely high up on my list of all-times faves, so I would be ecstatic to see him come here. It would also be interesting to see if took and/or was given #12...

He wouldn't.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

The problem for Pittsburgh is more complicated than for other teams due to Fleury's NMC.

Assuming he doesn't waive it, they will have to either trade him or buy him out in order to protect Murray, which they will do at all costs (Losing Dumoulin or Schultz, while a big deal, is a small blow compared to losing Murray).

Of course, if Fleury waives, then Pittsburgh is in a great situation. VGK will (probably) take Fleury and Pittsburgh will clear 5.75 million off their cap while still having an elite #1 which could allow them to add more for another cup run next year.

I don't expect Fleury to waive, since the only reason for him to would be out of loyalty, which is sort of rare among hockey players (and honestly should be imo).

I assume they came to an agreement last summer. He agrees to waive and in return the Pens didn't trade him and kept him for another Cup run.

[TheIronMaiden]

With 13 days until the expansion draft are we going to see any movement?

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

With 13 days until the expansion draft are we going to see any movement?

I bet it starts once the finals are over. Lebrun mentioned this morning they will likely have deals in place but won't announce till after to not take away from the finals.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

The problem for Pittsburgh is more complicated than for other teams due to Fleury's NMC.

Assuming he doesn't waive it, they will have to either trade him or buy him out in order to protect Murray, which they will do at all costs (Losing Dumoulin or Schultz, while a big deal, is a small blow compared to losing Murray).

Of course, if Fleury waives, then Pittsburgh is in a great situation. VGK will (probably) take Fleury and Pittsburgh will clear 5.75 million off their cap while still having an elite #1 which could allow them to add more for another cup run next year.

I don't expect Fleury to waive, since the only reason for him to would be out of loyalty, which is sort of rare among hockey players (and honestly should be imo).

Fleury and the Pens are in such an interesting spot. No doubt Pittsburgh will do whatever it takes to protect Murray, including a buyout of Fleury if necessary. But they have gone on and on about how important Fleury is to the team and how they will treat him with respect. I am not entirely convinced that Vegas takes him, if exposed.

I am starting to think there are other options out there. Perhaps they work out a deal to expose Fleury and give up assets to Vegas not to take him. Pittsburgh keeps Murray, Vegas gets an asset, plus Schultz or Dumoullin or whomever they pick and Fleury stays in Pittsburgh or is traded to another team of his choice.

EDIT: In other words, Fleury waives his NMC on the condition he isn't taken by Vegas.

[Vinny01]

How much would it cost the Flames to have Vegas agree to not take Lazar? Would it be 2 assets (say Kulak+Shinkaruk)?

I wonder because of the Flames can acquire another forward to protect before the draft they might be able to get this player on a discount.

[Lil Pedro]

Does Vegas have an AHL affiliate next year or are they splitting a team with another NHL club?

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Lil Pedro

Does Vegas have an AHL affiliate next year or are they splitting a team with another NHL club?

They bought the Chicago Wolves. I think sureloss made a thread about that in the AHL forum.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

How much would it cost the Flames to have Vegas agree to not take Lazar? Would it be 2 assets (say Kulak+Shinkaruk)?

I wonder because of the Flames can acquire another forward to protect before the draft they might be able to get this player on a discount.

I'm sure LV has some deals in place with certain teams to pass over certain unprotected players but they do have to build a competitive team for their inaugural season after all and it's in their best interest to pick what they view as the best players available and they can't do that if they make side deals with too many teams.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

How much would it cost the Flames to have Vegas agree to not take Lazar? Would it be 2 assets (say Kulak+Shinkaruk)?

I wonder because of the Flames can acquire another forward to protect before the draft they might be able to get this player on a discount.

The idea of acquiring players before the expansion draft seems to be adding far too many wrinkles for what is an easy situation for Calgary. Treliving set his table up nicely heading into the draft. Why mess it up? I don't believe they will. Unless it's a protected player for protected player kind of trade. I suspect there will be crickets on the forward front. Only pre draft trade I can see the Flames doing is one for a goaltender.

[dammage79]

I also think in Trelivings TSN interview he was being polite when he said McPhee was the puppeteer of all the off season trade action. I believe he's going to have the league ruthlessly by the balls while he can, not allowing anything to happen until he gets what he wants, or at the very least the best he can forcefully pry put of teams. And for that reason, I don't think we will see anything until the playing field is level again after LV has their draft

[Moneyhands23]

Originally Posted by dammage79

I also think in Trelivings TSN interview he was being polite when he said McPhee was the puppeteer of all the off season trade action. I believe he's going to have the league ruthlessly by the balls while he can, not allowing anything to happen until he gets what he wants, or at the very least the best he can forcefully pry put of teams. And for that reason, I don't think we will see anything until the playing field is level again after LV has their draft

Would be really funny if LV took 4 or 5 goalies as some ppl have speculated and the rest of the gm's collectivly refuse to trade for them.