I hear ya! There's probably lots of fancy stuff you could get into, but easy to use + high-end is an equation that I thought might not jive too well. Might be good to find a nice local dealer that can do a clean install for you.
https://www.kandwaudio.com/kw-audio/
KW Audio is a fun place to visit. They may have some ideas for a good receiver and I'm sure they'd do the install. Would probably cost a finger, likely not an arm
Last edited by calumniate; 03-12-2024 at 09:37 AM.
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I appreciate your thorough and well thought out answer.
With our current house/setup, moving to a sound bar is not an option as that is extra money that doesn't need to be spent, and worst case, it would relegate the paradigms to storage (as we only have a single viewing/listening space).
I won't lie when I say that I'm fairly new to this (or maybe more to the point, haven't looked into it for years). The paradigms replaced a set of Nuance speakers that 23 year old me was suckered into buying. TV/Music usage is down tremendously since our daughter arrived, so I rarely get a chance to enjoy it, however on the few times that I have, I don't "feel" like the difference in speakers has truly been maximized.
Fortunately, from people such as yourself, this forum, and just general knowledge, I'm fully aware that our setup is less than ideal. A huge ceramic potted plant directly in front of one speaker? Check. Baby fence in front of all the speakers? Check. Not using the speaker stands as it represents a risk of them getting knocked over? Also check. Etc Etc. Far from ideal
The Onkyo at the time was second from top of their line from whatever its worth, but if its generally an entry level, then that doesn't matter how "top of the line" it is!!!
I do love the idea of contacting a smaller Hifi store and trying my speakers with a variety of amps to see if I notice a difference. Its possible I won't, and therefore its a moot point!
I will probably have to settle with the idea that with life in its current form, I could buy an amazing amp and still a) not be able to use it and b) not be able to appreciate it fully with the lack of proper setup/acoustics.
Final note, I did contact Paradigm a few weeks ago, and they recommended their Anthem line, specifically the MRX 740 or 1140. I chuckled when I saw them on the site as it reminded me of when I bought the Onkyo, thinking bigger was better (even though it was powering garbage Nuance speakers!)
@Calumniate - My dad had a vintage Yamaha amp and loved it. My sister had one too. I've briefly looked at their offerings, but marketing has sucked me into a "higher priced brands = better" mentality, so I haven't necessarily given Yamaha their due. Appreciate the link, and I'll look into it a bit more!
Yeah, Yamaha is often overlooked. I forget them at times too.
Also, my bad. I didn't look at it earlier, but I just double checked your Onkyo 876. Looking at the specs now, I think it's possible it could pair decently with the Paradigm speakers. I just kinda assumed by the way you described it that it was basically entry level. The 876 is considered a really good receiver that punches above its weight class. I also assumed that if you had that receiver, you may have tried it already and you were looking for a bit more to pair with the Paradigm speakers. Like I said, I'm not a real expert on these receivers, I just know the basics. So the receiver you mentioned didn't immediately stick out to me as "Oh, that's one of the best value receivers of that time period and era". I also kinda assumed that someone who had once spent Onkyo 876 type money on a set up wouldn't be shooting blind when looking for an upgrade. That one isn't entry level! People will still seek this unit out and get amazing performance for the price they pay for this used vs many brands brand new! I just assumed a bit too much about your situation and now I look like an ass. Again, my bad.
I'd definitely suggest that you hook up your set up to the Onkyo and see what you think of the set up and get an idea of a baseline prior to taking it to a Hifi shop to experiment further. If I'm not mistaken (and now that I have looked up that specific model), that Onkyo still might exceed if not be on par at worst with some of the entry and mid line Yamaha and Denon receivers out there. You can hook up the system with your existing hardware and delay the receiver upgrade. You can still take the speakers to a Hifi shop. You just don't have to rush a decision, and you can take your time deliberating on what upgrades you are leaning towards if the Onkyo unit goes kaput and/or ways to optimize your viewing/listening space. I believe you'll be limited by 1080P/Atmos due to the receiver, but perhaps that's not a huge issue for now/there are potentially ways to bypass that. Plus there's ways to optimize the older Dolby set ups to still sound as good as entry level Atmos, even if it's limited to top end Atmos (but some people can't tell/notice the higher end Atmos anyways).
I too have kids and usability/price was my greater concern rather than specs when I did my family room set up a few years back. 80" projection at 1080P (plus could be retracted so that the feature wall isn't fully hidden) vs 4K/OLED at a smaller size. Yup. 5.1 soundbar with some wireless attributes I could set and forget vs my existing receiver set up that needs multiple clicks to get where it needs to be? Again yup. The AV equipment I inherited ended up in a small office room. My plan in about 3-5 years is to start putting together a basement home theatre set up. The reason for this timeline is the damn bouncy castle in the basement needs to be outgrown first.
Maybe that's what you can do. Get an idea if you even want to upgrade to a newer $1500+ receiver after testing it at a Hifi store. Then look at your viewing/listening area to see if you can upgrade the room to pair up with that speaker. Or maybe the Onkyo meets/exceeds your expectations and the money saved on not buying the receiver, a portion can be used to investigate whether wall mounting/elevating the speakers over the interference is possible in your situation. Then you could potentially optimize the sound by avoiding interference plus reduce the risk of damage to your speakers.
The usability for your spouse is the biggest challenge, but if you've had this receiver for 16 years, then maybe this could be moot. Same "interface" she's seen for over a decade but with an upgraded output. Using the old one could still allow you to save the money for the time being and this could address the quality difference your wife and your child can't tell. This way you don't have to rush a decision and settle for a lower end receiver. You can decide to save up for the true receiver you want once the speakers are a little bit less precarious and/or your listening set up is a little more upgraded/optimized due to circumstances of your child growing up. These two factors were the bigger concerns I had without knowing more details on your situation, but it seems that it can be addressed with both paying a small fee to get an idea of whether you want to push a baseline of the Onkyo 876 with those speakers.
Good luck. I hope you find a solution that exceeds your expectations!
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I will point out you could just add a seperate 2 channel power amp, use the Onkyo as a pre amp for the front A/B channels, but let it still power the rear and center probably the easiest upgrade
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Yeah, Yamaha is often overlooked. I forget them at times too.
Also, my bad. I didn't look at it earlier, but I just double checked your Onkyo 876. Looking at the specs now, I think it's possible it could pair decently with the Paradigm speakers. I just kinda assumed by the way you described it that it was basically entry level. The 876 is considered a really good receiver that punches above its weight class. I also assumed that if you had that receiver, you may have tried it already and you were looking for a bit more to pair with the Paradigm speakers. Like I said, I'm not a real expert on these receivers, I just know the basics. So the receiver you mentioned didn't immediately stick out to me as "Oh, that's one of the best value receivers of that time period and era". I also kinda assumed that someone who had once spent Onkyo 876 type money on a set up wouldn't be shooting blind when looking for an upgrade. That one isn't entry level! People will still seek this unit out and get amazing performance for the price they pay for this used vs many brands brand new! I just assumed a bit too much about your situation and now I look like an ass. Again, my bad.
I'd definitely suggest that you hook up your set up to the Onkyo and see what you think of the set up and get an idea of a baseline prior to taking it to a Hifi shop to experiment further. If I'm not mistaken (and now that I have looked up that specific model), that Onkyo still might exceed if not be on par at worst with some of the entry and mid line Yamaha and Denon receivers out there. You can hook up the system with your existing hardware and delay the receiver upgrade. You can still take the speakers to a Hifi shop. You just don't have to rush a decision, and you can take your time deliberating on what upgrades you are leaning towards if the Onkyo unit goes kaput and/or ways to optimize your viewing/listening space. I believe you'll be limited by 1080P/Atmos due to the receiver, but perhaps that's not a huge issue for now/there are potentially ways to bypass that. Plus there's ways to optimize the older Dolby set ups to still sound as good as entry level Atmos, even if it's limited to top end Atmos (but some people can't tell/notice the higher end Atmos anyways).
I too have kids and usability/price was my greater concern rather than specs when I did my family room set up a few years back. 80" projection at 1080P (plus could be retracted so that the feature wall isn't fully hidden) vs 4K/OLED at a smaller size. Yup. 5.1 soundbar with some wireless attributes I could set and forget vs my existing receiver set up that needs multiple clicks to get where it needs to be? Again yup. The AV equipment I inherited ended up in a small office room. My plan in about 3-5 years is to start putting together a basement home theatre set up. The reason for this timeline is the damn bouncy castle in the basement needs to be outgrown first.
Maybe that's what you can do. Get an idea if you even want to upgrade to a newer $1500+ receiver after testing it at a Hifi store. Then look at your viewing/listening area to see if you can upgrade the room to pair up with that speaker. Or maybe the Onkyo meets/exceeds your expectations and the money saved on not buying the receiver, a portion can be used to investigate whether wall mounting/elevating the speakers over the interference is possible in your situation. Then you could potentially optimize the sound by avoiding interference plus reduce the risk of damage to your speakers.
The usability for your spouse is the biggest challenge, but if you've had this receiver for 16 years, then maybe this could be moot. Same "interface" she's seen for over a decade but with an upgraded output. Using the old one could still allow you to save the money for the time being and this could address the quality difference your wife and your child can't tell. This way you don't have to rush a decision and settle for a lower end receiver. You can decide to save up for the true receiver you want once the speakers are a little bit less precarious and/or your listening set up is a little more upgraded/optimized due to circumstances of your child growing up. These two factors were the bigger concerns I had without knowing more details on your situation, but it seems that it can be addressed with both paying a small fee to get an idea of whether you want to push a baseline of the Onkyo 876 with those speakers.
Good luck. I hope you find a solution that exceeds your expectations!
Again, appreciate the info and thoughts!
So if we change courses and keep the Onkyo, then the idea of adding a music streaming device would appeal. I've seen a few Digital Music streaming devices in my research this week, and just curious yours (or anyone else's) thoughts on a good user friendly device that I could add. And I guess is lossless audio really worth it (ie dropping spotify for tidal or similar)?
Maybe the Wiim Airplay into a DAC of your choice and then into your Onkyo using RCA.
Or just the Wiim into your Onkyo via RCA. The Wiim uses your wifi internet or ethernet so it doesn't lose anything. Using a good DAC might make a marginal difference.
Last edited by calumniate; 03-13-2024 at 10:30 AM.
So if we change courses and keep the Onkyo, then the idea of adding a music streaming device would appeal. I've seen a few Digital Music streaming devices in my research this week, and just curious yours (or anyone else's) thoughts on a good user friendly device that I could add. And I guess is lossless audio really worth it (ie dropping spotify for tidal or similar)?
Probably not useful for you (no longer in production and at least a grand second hand) but I use a Cambridge Audio 851N as an all in one DAC, streamer and digital pre amp, my analog pre amp has only 3 inputs, phono, aux and tape, so I added the 851 mostly to add inputs but it not only streams but also has a USB input that I have an 8 terabyte drive plugged into it so I have around 44,000 songs in FLAC files I control with a phone app, I can put on an album or create a playlist as I choose without leaving the couch, it has been something of a game changer for my listening
Last edited by afc wimbledon; 03-13-2024 at 12:29 PM.
Maybe the Wiim Airplay into a DAC of your choice and then into your Onkyo using RCA.
Or just the Wiim into your Onkyo via RCA. The Wiim uses your wifi internet or ethernet so it doesn't lose anything. Using a good DAC might make a marginal difference.
The only thing I noticed about entry level Wiim is that I didn't notice a way to play your own music via USB or otherwise.
For around $150-400, setting up a raspberry Pi DAC and loading it with Volumio or Moode OS might be worth considering. You can play your own music via USB, you have some casting abilities with a few streaming platforms (ie: From your phone and select the DAC to cast to as you could for a smart speaker). I think both also have web interfaces that you can use from a computer for phone to swap between using streaming services and local music options.
Raspberry Pi DAC I looked into previously were Hifiberry, Allo, IQAudio. I had the Allo Boss with Volumio and I was very happy with it.
You'd want to research the DAC combo options as well as the OS interface options.
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True - I didn't even think of if he had local media to stream..oops!
Not everyone has old format local media to stream like some of us weirdos. The Wiim isn't bad for those applications where you stream at qualities higher than Bluetooth. I actually think this situation is more common than some believe.
After a quick glance, it seems that the Wiim might be able to connect to a separate server to stream local media. That makes a USB an unnecessary interface. I was just saying that I didn't notice a USB port to easily connect external media, if that was a primary way that someone wanted to play their own music.
I picked these up based on your recommendation. They are pretty nice! Best part is they actually fit me well even with the default red tips. Only downside I can find for me is I still prefer over-ear to IEM's most of the time. Still, amazing for the price and think i'll use them for travel quite a bit
Do you think they would work on an airplane with the plugs they have? Thinking of sending a pair of these to my mom for her flights back to China.
I picked these up based on your recommendation. They are pretty nice! Best part is they actually fit me well even with the default red tips. Only downside I can find for me is I still prefer over-ear to IEM's most of the time. Still, amazing for the price and think i'll use them for travel quite a bit
Sorry was out of town for a few weeks, missed some messages.
Glad to hear! I don't particularly like IEM's as they bother my years after a short time, but these were just too good to pass up for the price. Like you said great travel partners. Glad to hear you enjoy them as well!
Do you think they would work on an airplane with the plugs they have? Thinking of sending a pair of these to my mom for her flights back to China.
They come default with a 3.5MM jack, but if you search amazon with little effort you can find other cords for $20-$30 (I know, almost the same price as the IEM's but the cords can be transferred to almost any IEM at a later date if desired) with several options such as the 4.4MM balanced plug. Always order based on what you are using as an amp (most phones or example if they have a plug use 3.5MM, if purchasing a dongle, most do 3.5MM and/or 4.4MM)
If needed, the 4.4 cord I use was from amazon, linsoul tripowin if you search that it should come up.
Again however the default 3.5MM plug it comes with will fit nearly all audio devices. I believe all planes that still have physical plugs are all 3.5MM.
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They come default with a 3.5MM jack, but if you search amazon with little effort you can find other cords for $20-$30 (I know, almost the same price as the IEM's but the cords can be transferred to almost any IEM at a later date if desired) with several options such as the 4.4MM balanced plug. Always order based on what you are using as an amp (most phones or example if they have a plug use 3.5MM, if purchasing a dongle, most do 3.5MM and/or 4.4MM)
If needed, the 4.4 cord I use was from amazon, linsoul tripowin if you search that it should come up.
Again however the default 3.5MM plug it comes with will fit nearly all audio devices. I believe all planes that still have physical plugs are all 3.5MM.
