Canadians 'drowning in debt': 47% will borrow to cover costs, survey says

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

My wife and I do just fine without a data plan, and I don't even really have a cell phone, but I do have a home phone, so I can see a person choosing to have a cell instead, you can spend $30 a month on that. But no, you don't NEED a data plan. Otherwise I guess I'd be unemployed and dead? You also don't need a brand new phone every 2 years, but most people don't keep them longer than that.

I wish you were unemployed and dead!

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by nik-

One person posted it, and it was clearly facetious. Try calming down, maybe it will let you budget better.

I budget very well thank you. Excel equations and tabs and all.

[Old Yeller]

I don't really know how this problem is fixed... even with education.

I know smart people that understand the concept of compound interest, but really want that boat/ATV/BBQ right now and "credit is easy to get".

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Sliver

People throw things out because it's cheaper than fixing them. I have an employee that I caught trying to fix a dolly in my shop. He was sitting there with the casters pulled off and he was taking the bearings out of the wheels. His next step was to run around trying to find new bearings, which is the point at which I stopped him. Shutting down his production so I'm not billing his hours while he fatas around with a 20-year old dolly is the worst use of 2-3 hours I can imagine. Chuck it out, let me know, and I'll have a brand new delivered here by lunch for half the cost.

TVs are an even more pronounced example. Taking a couple hours off and hauling an old TV to some repair shop in the industrial park to pay a guy $90 an hour to fix it is really dumb. Just shoot over to Costco and have a new warrantied TV for the same or less than messing around with the old one is a no brainer.

New goods are so cheap and Calgary labour rates are so expensive that it no longer makes sense to fix your stuff. It's like if your dishwasher fails...just buy a new one. Taking the day off to have a guy come to your house to tell you your dishwasher isn't repairable and then handing you a $150 bill for his time is a bad way to spend your money and time off.

I think that depends on what it is. I'm not throwing out my lawnmower without trying to fix it. I bought a good coffee grinder for my dad(I have the same one) and a piece broke. Went to their website, ordered it for a very reasonable price, and fixed it. They decided they wanted these things to be reparable, and not disposable so they go through the effort of supplying every piece for cheap. I think you could build one for the sum of the parts. We need more companies doing this, not charging $500 for a gear box on a $600 washing machine. Maybe if more things were repairable more people would learn to repair things on their own? Not suggesting fixing the caster was worth the effort...

[Oling_Roachinen]

Meh, the cost of televisions and even phones have gone down so dramatically that trying to compare the situations is foolhardy.

If you paid $750 for a 19'' colour TV back in the 1980s, that's the equivalent of $1800 today. Forget about the 'big screen' coloured TVs that were going for thousands. Wait for Amazon Prime Days or Black Friday deals and today you could get a far far superior television for peanuts. I mean here's a 43-inch 4K Toshiba with built-in Alexa and Fire TV going for $229.99 on Amazon.com.

I could have a 40+ inch television on everyone of my walls and still have paid less, once adjusted for inflation, than my parents did on their televisions.

It's the cost of cable that has gone above inflation. But really I don't think there's many in that 47% that would be living debt free if they scaled back to basic cable.

Instead, if you want to start drawing fairer conclusions, at least look at the increase of cost of living. Things like the 3x-5x tuition increases over the past couple decades. In the States the median household cost under $50,000 in 1980, compared to the $200,000+. During the bust of the 1985 the cost of housing in Calgary was $75,000 ($179,000 in today's dollars) based on average sale. Today it is $450,000+. Well over double.

I'm not trying to defend the people obviously living beyond their means, but let's not get into the boomer's "Back in my day I got a paper route twice a week that paid for my rent and college tuition, why don't people do that today?"

[nik-]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

I budget very well thank you. Excel equations and tabs and all.

Should have used LibreOffice. Wasting money.

[Jason14h]

Step 1: Stop buying bottled water and Coffee

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Sliver

People throw things out because it's cheaper than fixing them. I have an employee that I caught trying to fix a dolly in my shop. He was sitting there with the casters pulled off and he was taking the bearings out of the wheels. His next step was to run around trying to find new bearings, which is the point at which I stopped him. Shutting down his production so I'm not billing his hours while he fatas around with a 20-year old dolly is the worst use of 2-3 hours I can imagine. Chuck it out, let me know, and I'll have a brand new delivered here by lunch for half the cost.

TVs are an even more pronounced example. Taking a couple hours off and hauling an old TV to some repair shop in the industrial park to pay a guy $90 an hour to fix it is really dumb. Just shoot over to Costco and have a new warrantied TV for the same or less than messing around with the old one is a no brainer.

New goods are so cheap and Calgary labour rates are so expensive that it no longer makes sense to fix your stuff. It's like if your dishwasher fails...just buy a new one. Taking the day off to have a guy come to your house to tell you your dishwasher isn't repairable and then handing you a $150 bill for his time is a bad way to spend your money and time off.

I would agree if the TV's cell phones etc were broken but we live in a world where people dump stuff that is fine, I run a foster home and so have always taken old stuff for my kids, a give away working TV used to be rarer than hens teeth, I have more than I can use, all flat screens, 42 inchs because everyone wants 70 now.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Step 1: Stop buying bottled water and Coffee

I assume you mean coffee by the cup.

Step 2: unless you have a short merge lane, keep your RPMs below 2-2.5 when accelerating.

[Johnny199r]

Originally Posted by FireGilbert

Wages have stagnated, the cost of living is increasing, and interest rates are at historic lows. Can't say I'm surprised people are taking on debt.

Can we please stop with the generational stereotyping? Kids these days are not better or worse at saving than their parents were. The older generations spent more on optional things like music, smokes, and alcohol while the younger generations spend more on the necessities of life such as rent and education. Looking at what wages, house prices, and interest rates were 40 years ago it was easier to save enough to buy a house or have a nest egg.

Oh and you NEED a phone with a data plan to exist in today's society. It's not something you can budget out to save money.

The truth lies in the middle. Did your parents go to Mexico or Cuba on spring break? I knew more people than I could count who did. How many used their line of credit? A whole lot.

It's only one example. Yes, wages are stagnant, school costs more etc, but lots of people feel they are entitled to a certain standard. When I was in university, lots of my friends had the option to live at home and drive to school to save money. How many got an apartment and a huge student loan because they wanted the student life (to go out all the time and pound as many chicks as possible) lots.

How many couples only have one car instead of two? Is it used or new? Do they live in an apartment instead of a house?

Still have students loans? Baby on the way? Better buy that $600,000 house! Everybody else is!

[Oling_Roachinen]

Obviously cherry picking, but if you tried to buy a house in 1985 in Calgary, you're looking at $75,000. In 2006, the average house is costing you $450,000.

Inflation between 1985 and 2006 wasn't quite doubled yet prices increased 6x.

Even if you don't cherry pick on the boom and busts, the cost of housing inflation is just in no way comparable to the dollar inflation.

[PepsiFree]

Boomers should have raised better children.

[Travis Munroe]

I am not sure this can be considered capitalism failing... the capitalists are succeeding on allowing almost anything to be financed long term.

It is a tough fix but if the government were to step in, I would imagine that they would need to limit "financing" options. If you can't afford to buy that new mattress for $2,000 then you can't afford to pay $20 a month for 120 months with interest. The ability to finance almost anything has taken from the art of saving.

Perhaps a tougher crackdown on credit limits would also be a step. If an item is needed that costs more than the credit limit, you can add funds beyond the balance to pay for it. Again, it would help with the need to save vs charge to cc now, worry about later.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Johnny199r

How many got an apartment and a huge student loan because they wanted the student life (is go out all the time and pound as many chicks as possible) lots.?

And yet we've over doubled the amount of young adults living at home....



In 1981, roughly 10% of 25-29 year olds lived in their parental home. In 2011 it was 25%.

Not great graph but from StatsCan: https://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-r...g3_3-1-eng.cfm

[MelBridgeman]

Yup capitalism is succeeding, dumb people are failing.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Boomers should have raised better children.

….and look how you turned out. Guess I should have done a better job

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Obviously cherry picking, but if you tried to buy a house in 1985 in Calgary, you're looking at $75,000. In 2006, the average house is costing you $450,000.

Inflation between 1985 and 2006 wasn't quite doubled yet prices increased 6x.

Even if you don't cherry pick on the boom and busts, the cost of housing inflation is just in no way comparable to the dollar inflation.

Right, but interest rates were up to 20% back then. I've never compared the affordability between now and then, but I suspect it's similar. Housing prices don't tell the full story.

[wwkayaker]

Originally Posted by btimbit

Food is a good point. I see lots of people complaining about their grocery bills yet I see what they're cooking and while a good meal is awesome, you don't need to pretend to be a foodie 7 days a week.

I'm not in debt and I still had meatloaf tonight

But meatloaf is awesome!

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Dion

….and look how you turned out. Guess I should have done a better job

You have children?

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Johnny199r

The truth lies in the middle. Did your parents go to Mexico or Cuba on spring break? I knew more people than I could count who did. How many used their line of credit? A whole lot.

So many people have this expectation that they deserve extravagant travel. Forget a week camping, we're hopping on a plane to somewhere warm. If you're debt free and paid up on your RESPs, RRSPs and TFSAs, then go nuts. Otherwise, you're being super dumb with money.

Having said that, people must be getting something out of travel I'm unable to tap into, so I'll preemptively concede I don't really get vacationing in far flung locations. Spending what will take me four months to net on a week or two vacation is pretty much the worst trade off I can imagine.