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View Poll Results: If you could vote on Super Tuesday who would you vote for?
Joe Biden 35 16.51%
Michael Bloomberg 14 6.60%
Pete Buttigieg 17 8.02%
Amy Klobucher 9 4.25%
Bernie Sanders 102 48.11%
Elizabeth Warren 23 10.85%
Other 12 5.66%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-08-2020, 09:20 AM   #881
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No, I can't. It's all anecdotal.
We moved to US 2.5 years ago.p
Our co-pay is $25 per visit, whether that is to specialist or GP, including immediate care. Emergency care is $100/visit,unless admitted to hospital, then is no charge.
I have seen a derm and an orthopedist, as specialists, in our time here.my wait time to see specialist in both cases was less 48 hours.
My wife had breast cancer in Canada. No complaints with the care for her treatment there, but because she was so young, and we have a daughter, they put her on list for genetic testing for BRCA. She was on that list for 1.5 years in Montreal. Here, upon initial consultation with oncologist, they also recommended genetic testing, and apologized because the delay for testing was 10 days.
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Here's something anecdotal to see how y'all feel U.S. coverage is compared to you guys:

A couple weeks ago my 5 year old needed tubes in his ears and they took out his adenoids. It was an outpatient procedure that did require anesthesia. We were at the hospital for probably 3 hours total.

The bill? Just over $20,000. After insurance, we were left with a $3,000 bill from the hospital. We also received a bill for ~$400 for the anesthesiologist. Not sure if we have seen any other charges, would have to look in the pile.

My kids are under my wife's insurance through her work. I think its Blue Cross Blue Shield.

Luckily we are well enough off to be able to take a hit like that without much problem. But for a lot of people, bills like that are what start the spiral. So the choice is let your kid go through grade school with hearing problems (mine failed his hearing tests) or go broke.
Here's the thing about this anecdotal evidence. Both are likely accurate based on the situation of the individuals in question.

One individual lives in the 3rd largest metropolitan area in the nation, and is fairly affluent, based on their commentary. It is very likely they have a really good job, get paid a lot, and have a benefits package that most would consider gold plated or Rolls Royce. So they have an advantage of having low deductibles and excellent access. Being in the 3rd largest metro area has its advantages as well. Chicago has 91 hospitals in a 20 mile radius of the center of the city. Illinois is also a very liberal state where there are a huge number of insurance programs available. There is a high density of good service providers and specialists. You have a high degree of choice and your plan likely allows a high degree of choice between service providers, including specialists.

The other individual lives in the 47th largest metropolitan area in the country. Population density is a fraction and access to providers is obviously going to be restricted. Tulsa has access to 29 hospitals within a 50 mile radius of city center. This individual is not affluent and more of a member of that shrinking middle class. It is likely the individual does not have a high paying job, is limited on benefits, and has to make due with those benefits provided by employer. Oklahoma is a state which fought the idea of health exchanges and has very limited choice in the system for those who have to buy from that marketplace. The majority of these programs have high deductibles to keep insurance costs down and pass a lot of the costs off to the insured. Depending on where the individual lives in Tulsa, they could be subject to "rural medicine" classification, making access to services extremely difficult.

Context of this issue is important. Listening to someone who has fantastic insurance and lives in the middle of a large urban area can give the impression of everything being rainbows and unicorns. Listening to someone who lives in a smaller population center and lives paycheck to paycheck, the picture is very different. Both can be right, but it is the contrast that shows you everything that is wrong with the system itself.
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Old 02-08-2020, 11:13 AM   #882
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But just for posterity (and I could be misremembering) but from previous posts you are pretty well off?
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This is an excellent peak into why anecdotal is often useless if not compared to other anecdotal.
I would have to think both are pretty well off. That's the thing with any of these anecdotes - very few people would willfully moving to the USA to put themselves into a worse situation.

My family could theoretically move to the US and be better off, healthcare costs included. If Alberta continues to regress into insanity, it may be a consideration for us (though US won't be much more appealing with another 4 yrs of Trump). We could go to BC and have a lower standard of living than here, or New Zealand/Australia/Europe...wherever we went it would likely come out close to a wash, all things considered.

I don't really have a point, other than if you're in the top 5% of income, you're going to be in the top 5% (give or take a % or 2) standard of living pretty much wherever you go...
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Old 02-08-2020, 12:33 PM   #883
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Old 02-08-2020, 01:25 PM   #884
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Anyone but Trump means anyone that can beat Trump, and Sanders can't, he hasn't a hope in hell, it isn't that he will be eviscerated by the right wing media as a Commie, although he will, its that when he starts droning on about healthcare and free college for most of America they hear the waa waa waa of Charlie Browns teacher, he is dull, depressing and rambling.
What are you basing that upon? National polls suggest he is a strong candidate. The same was true last go around, and he's been droning on about the same things forever. Those things are exactly what people know him for.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep.../National.html

Bernie with a smart Veep selection looks like a strong candidate based on the polling data. Not as strong as Bloomberg or Biden, but Stronger than Warren, Buttigieg or Klobuchar.
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Old 02-08-2020, 01:50 PM   #885
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What are you basing that upon? National polls suggest he is a strong candidate. The same was true last go around, and he's been droning on about the same things forever. Those things are exactly what people know him for.



https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ep.../National.html



Bernie with a smart Veep selection looks like a strong candidate based on the polling data. Not as strong as Bloomberg or Biden, but Stronger than Warren, Buttigieg or Klobuchar.
I think the argument is that Bernie wins the popular vote but he can't win the swing states. I don't necessarily agree, but that's the argument.
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Old 02-08-2020, 08:14 PM   #886
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But just for posterity (and I could be misremembering) but from previous posts you are pretty well off?
I don't expect our American experience is very typical.
I expect that 'better' insurance is often a benefit of 'better' employment, and most definitely all health insurance is not equal. Which I why I originally said I'm not sure how many Americans enjoy great health insurance.
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Old 02-08-2020, 09:03 PM   #887
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Looks like Pete has some explaining to do after taking donations from a Russian Oligarch previously linked to the Trump presidential inauguration and many other major GOP campaigns.

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Democratic presidential candidate and former South Bend, Indiana mayor Pete Buttigieg is facing questions after recent revelations that his 2020 effort has taken campaign contributions from an infamous Republican Party billionaire with direct links to the Russian oligarchy. That’s according Federal Election Commission (FEC) data reviewed by Law&Crime.

Previously described in the press as “The Giver,” Leonard “Len” Blavatnik is a well-known GOP donor with a New York address who previously took it upon himself to fund President Donald Trump‘s lavish — and allegedly criminal — inauguration festivities in 2017 to the tune of some $1 million.

Now, Blavatnik and his wife are apparently shifting allegiances. As of this writing, they have donated thousands of dollars to Pete for America, Inc., Buttigieg’s official campaign organization.

Donald Trump and the political action committees for Mitch McConnell, Marco Rubio, Scott Walker, Lindsey Graham, John Kasich and John McCain accepted $7.35 million in contributions from a Ukrainian-born oligarch who is the business partner of two of Russian president Vladimir Putin‘s favorite oligarchs and a Russian government bank.
https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile...and-mcconnell/
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Old 02-08-2020, 09:32 PM   #888
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Right or wrong two things America isn't ready for in a President, ultra leftists in Bernie/Warren or a gay person, for me the only ones that have a shot a beating Trump are Biden, Klobuchar, Yang or even Steyer
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Old 02-08-2020, 09:52 PM   #889
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Right or wrong two things America isn't ready for in a President, ultra leftists in Bernie/Warren or a gay person, for me the only ones that have a shot a beating Trump are Biden, Klobuchar, Yang or even Steyer
Meh, I think we have a tendency to underestimate the tolerance of most Americans because the ugly minority get the most publicity. I remember the same arguments being made regarding America's willingness to accept a black president back in 2008.
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Old 02-09-2020, 12:02 AM   #890
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Uhhh....wtf?

https://peteforamerica.com/policies/...ll-to-service/

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Pete's Vision

Our intention is for this proposal to create a pathway towards a universal, national expectation of service for all 4 million high school graduates every year, such that the first question asked of every college freshman or new hire is: “where did you serve?” A new generation of American youth, bound by mutual service and sacrifice, aware of the common values that bind all Americans, influenced by the experience of doing real work with people across races, politics, faiths, income levels, and gender identities, and imbued with an appreciation of the effort required to maintain a democracy can help heal a divided nation
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Old 02-09-2020, 02:30 AM   #891
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Shades of Dougie circa 2017.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1226007766558560256
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Old 02-09-2020, 02:49 AM   #892
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Is this "wtf" because it would never happen? Or because of the idea? I think mandatory public service is actually a really good idea and better than the mandatory military service that a lot of countries do.
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Old 02-09-2020, 07:45 AM   #893
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I honestly believe the only path the Democrats have is hoping the economy tanks. Gay/Leftist/whatever identity aside, if the American economy continues at this pace come November I simply cannot see people voting to take a risk by voting social over economy.

Remember first time Obama won we just entered the Great Recession. Republicans were in charge for 8 years and fairly blamed. When Clinton won we were in a recession.

I still firmly believe America votes on economy over anything else. So Dems better hope for a crippling recession soon.
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Old 02-09-2020, 09:26 AM   #894
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Is this "wtf" because it would never happen? Or because of the idea? I think mandatory public service is actually a really good idea and better than the mandatory military service that a lot of countries do.
I'm opposed to the idea that this will become a social expectation to the extent that it will be asked on college/job applications. Outside of the military, most of these organizations rely primarily on unpaid/volunteer service. The reality of that means this is just another way to force poor kids into the military while rich (usually white) kids go off to travel the world.

It's exactly the type of proposal I'd expect from someone like Pete.
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Old 02-09-2020, 10:23 AM   #895
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See if you can spot it

https://twitter.com/Olivianuzzi/stat...514713601?s=20
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Old 02-09-2020, 11:45 AM   #896
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The reality of that means this is just another way to force poor kids into the military while rich (usually white) kids go off to travel the world.
Well geez, when you put it that way, it doesn't sound so great.
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Old 02-09-2020, 11:55 AM   #897
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Sport jacket +sun glasses + ball cap guy seems to want to get energized with the gal beside him...
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Old 02-09-2020, 12:06 PM   #898
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I honestly believe the only path the Democrats have is hoping the economy tanks. Gay/Leftist/whatever identity aside, if the American economy continues at this pace come November I simply cannot see people voting to take a risk by voting social over economy.

Remember first time Obama won we just entered the Great Recession. Republicans were in charge for 8 years and fairly blamed. When Clinton won we were in a recession.

I still firmly believe America votes on economy over anything else. So Dems better hope for a crippling recession soon.
I agree. I think the Dems are screwed with the candidates they have.

Economy is good, unemployment is low and people got their short term tax cut in their pocket. It's not a time for change and risk taking.
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Old 02-09-2020, 09:07 PM   #899
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nm
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Old 02-09-2020, 11:08 PM   #900
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Thanks, Pete. Christ, what a wiener.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1226658738175725568
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