Yeah, I take the prequel light saber duels over the sequel duels any day, especially the Maul Obi-Wan duel.
Kylo vs Rey 1 was stick swinging. The one against the Imperial guards was decent. The one in the third one between Rey and Kylo was pretty generic.
The Prequel duels were more like dances than action sequences. Not a critical comment, just not really my cup of tea. I can understand those who prefer them but for me it breaks the framing of the story in a way I don't enjoy.
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Originally Posted by blankall
I didn't mind the actual mechanics of TFA lightsabre duel. What gets me about it is that Rey holds her own too easily. At this point Kylo, who is a pretty powerful force user himself, has had a lot training, both by Luke and by Snoke. Yet Rey just manages to pick up the lightsabre and go toe to toe with him.
My gripe is more with the plot than the actual battle itself though. I agree, that the fact it was emotionally driven made it pretty good in a vacuum.
Hated the overly-choreographed stuff in the TLJ. Even the choreographing in the prequels got to me at points. For example, for the most part the Maul battle is great, but there are definitely points where it looks like he might a pirouette. More just a matter of personal taste though.
I agree, and absolutely this is my take away to. But being charitable to the creator, Kylo was injured before the fight spend much of the fight visibly fighting off the paint, and his fundamental problem throughout all of the movies doesn't seem to be strength but rather control. He's the better fighter, but is completely un strategic about it in a way that loses him fights.
While I'm critical of the excessively choreographed scenes in TPM, oddly I loved the Choreographed scene in TLJ. For me the Snoke throne room is still one of the best scenes in Star Wars, right from the lightsaber chopping Snoke in half to the Kylo refusing to join Rey on her adventure, the whole scene does all the heavy lifting of character development for the film. Also again that movie did a lot to honor the movies that came before without copying them, often framing the exact same images and circumstances as RoTJ & TPM with different causes or outcomes.
You mean Yoda flying around doing spins and flips like a cartoon? Yea, no thanks. I prefer the more grounded, brutal, and emotional duels like Luke vs. Vader in ROTJ and ESB. The saber duels in the sequels were much more in line with the ones from the original trilogy IMO, which is why I prefer them.
I'll give you Darth Maul vs. Obi-Wan and Qui Gon though. That one was pretty badass.
Even then the sequels still win hands down. The RotS duel is overrated and ruined by bad acting and TPM duel is good but ruined by cuts to the other parts of that awful movie.
Literally the only good thing about the prequels is duel of the fates and the Darth Maul fight edited to remove the cutaways.
But I can watch that on YouTube anytime I want.
You could not pay me to sit thru any of the prequels. I would happily watch TFA, or even TROS if I had to. At least it isn’t painfully boring like the prequels.
They legit have no redeeming qualities, outside of one good lightsaber duel in the first movie that lasts for like 6 minutes.
Last edited by Cecil Terwilliger; 11-25-2020 at 05:06 PM.
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It depends how one defines "best". If best means overly choreographed and boring after the first 30 seconds, then yeah, the prequels have the best duels.
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You're both wrong. The best lightsaber duels are in the animated content and both involve Ashoka.
There was a just a brutal duel between Anakin and Dooku in Clone Wars. Or Obi and Ventress in the Clone Wars movie.
Yeah Ashoka vs Maul was terrific. Kanan and Ezra against Vader because it was terrifyingly one sided and showed that Kanan really wasn't at the Jedi Knight Level.
I even loved Ashoka vs Vader because we saw that Vader's style was all power because of the restrictions of his suit.
I remember seeing a remake of the Vader vs Kenobi fight and I just didn't like it after being blown away by it in the first time. Here we have this aged warrrior on one side who's touch to the force while powerful wasn't what it once was. Versus and older Anakin who hadn't had to fight a Jedi in a long time and was restricted by his suit.
Instead we get this really chess like duel with simple movements and counters and you can believe its two old friends now enemies that know everything about each other. I love that old fight.
Don't get me wrong I really liked the TFA duel, but it did underwhelm me and didn't make much sense in the grand scheme of things because we get a guy with no on minimum force powers and no training holding his own against Ren for a few minutes. Then we get Rey with no training in the Force beating the crap out of Ren.
I thought the throne room fight was ok, but over the top, and again, Ren is at that point really the most powerful force user out there, and they're going against non force guys, and what's with the one Imperial Guardsman grabbing his weapons blades to fold it. WTF.
The last fight in TROS just didn't resonate with me.
Yeah in the sequels Yoda was over the top. But we have to remember that the whole high speed choreographed feel, was symptomatic. I mean we are at the height of the trained Jedi, they were at the height of their force powers and probably trained every day against the same type of opponents, and realistically Maul fed that to Qui-gon, but Obi, used fury to beat Maul.
I loved the last fight in ROTS between Anakin and Dooku. Because at one point Dooku says to Anakin "You have much fear and anger" or something like that "But you don't use it". And its almost like Dooku gave Anakin this vision of the darkside, and permission to use it, and Anakin's style completely changed to a power style that was grounded. Watch Hayden's footwork, its amazing and balanced and grounded, and powerful. And he dispatches one of the best swordsmen in Jedi history in seconds.
Luke versus Vader in ROTJ. Watch how it changes, Luke is still a novice, and Vader does his share of dominating until Luke touches the darkside, and he just over powers Vader with no style. I loved that duel.
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Luke versus Vader in ROTJ. Watch how it changes, Luke is still a novice, and Vader does his share of dominating until Luke touches the darkside, and he just over powers Vader with no style. I loved that duel.
That final duel in ROTJ is still my all-time #1. I was 9 when I saw that movie in the theatre in 1983, and I remember being absolutely riveted and pinned to my seat for the entire thing. Even when I watch it today, the emotional intensity of that duel is unmatched by any other SW flick.
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Highest emotion level, awesome score, the most at stake, and the best actual dueling.
If people would just get over themselves, they could enjoy the prequels as I have and my father before me.
I dunno, it got a bit eye rolly with them jumping around a lava river. Those things tend to be hot, and full of poisonous gases. If they had scaled down the sillyness, thy could have used the same setting. I appreciate the stakes, and the concept of the fight. I like that his undoing was his arrogance. But the first 2 minutes of this? I can't say it is the best in any way. I think I have to go with RotJ throne room as my favourite.
I dunno, it got a bit eye rolly with them jumping around a lava river. Those things tend to be hot, and full of poisonous gases. If they had scaled down the sillyness, thy could have used the same setting. I appreciate the stakes, and the concept of the fight. I like that his undoing was his arrogance. But the first 2 minutes of this? I can't say it is the best in any way. I think I have to go with RotJ throne room as my favourite.
My 7.5 month pregnant wife continually tells me that 9 month pregnant Padme prancing toward Anakin is the most unrealistic moment of the fight.
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I dunno, it got a bit eye rolly with them jumping around a lava river. Those things tend to be hot, and full of poisonous gases. If they had scaled down the sillyness, thy could have used the same setting. I appreciate the stakes, and the concept of the fight. I like that his undoing was his arrogance. But the first 2 minutes of this? I can't say it is the best in any way. I think I have to go with RotJ throne room as my favourite.
I still don't get why Obi-Wan doesn't finish him.
Is he trying to be merciful? Letting Anakin seemingly burn to death slowly is better than a quick lightsaber strike? Does he think Anakin will survive....and just be horribly disfigured.....like the other Siths....so he's purposely creating a Sith lord? What's the reasoning here?
Is he trying to be merciful? Letting Anakin seemingly burn to death slowly is better than a quick lightsaber strike? Does he think Anakin will survive....and just be horribly disfigured.....like the other Siths....so he's purposely creating a Sith lord? What's the reasoning here?
I think he couldn't do it. The way he says he loved him and that he was a literal brother to him, he couldn't bring himself to slay him. So he chopped him up good and left.
It was the first time Obi Wan couldn't follow a direct order from the council. Unless of course he's been banging Duchess Satine this whole time, in which case this would be only the 2nd order he disobeyed.
Is he trying to be merciful? Letting Anakin seemingly burn to death slowly is better than a quick lightsaber strike? Does he think Anakin will survive....and just be horribly disfigured.....like the other Siths....so he's purposely creating a Sith lord? What's the reasoning here?
I think there are two things, at least in my mind.
The Jedi, and especially Obi-Wan were big proponents of the will of the living force. Which includes future events. The Force maybe knew that Anakin would still fulfill his role as the chosen one that would destroy the Sith. Without Anakin Sidious would have found a apprentice without the attachments to Luke and Leia, and the Sith might have ruled forever.
Also I think that Obi-Wan felt that Sidious was soon to arrive, and he probably knew that he shouldn't stay and face a battle that he couldn't win, that he had an obligation to doing everything to keep Padme and her child(ren) safe.
A third thing and this was my theory, maybe in that moment, with the Dark Side ascendant and the greatest betrayer and possibly greatest Jedi Killer in history at his mercy, Obi-Wan just didn't feel like granting that mercy, and in that moment, he wanted Anakin to burn.
At the end of the Rise of Darth Vader we wee Kenobi following Owen and Beru and Baby Luke and he stops in a bar and sees a video of an armored monster that the news named Darth Vader, and he reacted being shocked that Anakin was still alive. He spoke to Qui-gon who assured him that Vader would never step on Tattooine because it would threaten to bring up the spark that was Anakin, and that he needed to focus on Luke and to an extent Leia and leave Vader to his fate.
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Is he trying to be merciful? Letting Anakin seemingly burn to death slowly is better than a quick lightsaber strike? Does he think Anakin will survive....and just be horribly disfigured.....like the other Siths....so he's purposely creating a Sith lord? What's the reasoning here?
So all of this Galactic Strife is Obi-Wan's fault!
He had Anakin/Darth Vader at his mercy and didnt finish him and...well...he's on a lava planet with Padme who is carrying Luke and Leia...and the Star Wars Galaxy is notorious for their lack of safety railings...one well timed force shove and re-starting the 'No Workplace Incidents' counter and he could have saved the Galaxy a lot of problems...
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Highest emotion level, awesome score, the most at stake, and the best actual dueling.
If people would just get over themselves, they could enjoy the prequels as I have and my father before me.
I feel I would have appreciated it much more if it wasn't 97% poor CGI with a million different things happening on screen.
They never needed shooting lava and floating platforms. A real, dimmed room would have been more effective. No distractions in the periphery, just two brothers fighting for their respective beliefs and the future of the galaxy.
But I guess the world also wouldn't be the same without the higher ground memes either.
