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Old 03-13-2023, 10:03 AM   #1181
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I'm just glad this episode had a bit of the ladder moving simulator that made the games so memorable.
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Old 03-13-2023, 10:09 AM   #1182
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I really liked the show, but I loved the game. The show simply isn't as good as the game, and the portrayals of Joel & Ellie in the game were better than the show. Honestly, the computer graphic Ellie could portray better emotion than IRL Bella Ramsey. Pedro's lack of a Texas accent kinda made him seem, I dunno, less gruff than in the game portrayal? Joel's transition in the game from stand-offish macho man to loving father figure by the SLC chapter was much more believable than the show. I think even non-gamers will agree the show felt rushed at times.

One major thing that was missing from the show was that it never felt like there was immediate danger around the corner. In the game, there was always a raider or a zombie around every ####ing corner and it made every scene suspenseful. The show felt quite relaxed to a large extent.

The Calgary connection was really fun. Certainly looking forward to S2.

Can't wait to replay the PS5 rebuilt version of the game. $90 tho dang.
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Old 03-13-2023, 10:29 AM   #1183
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I liked how he actually checked to see if there was a bullet in the hand gun he picked up, and was able to do so by manipulating the slide without fully wracking it or stove piping the round.

Never played the games, fully enjoyed the show. The finale did feel a bit short, but it still accomplished what we needed.

I know there's no danger from Red Shirt Jimmy, so let's get to what matters.

Given the reception of the show I do wonder if they will decide to draw the second game out over several seasons now.
I don't see how they could fit the 2nd game into a single season, unless they make quite a few more episodes than season 1. It's a much longer game than the first with many more characters
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Old 03-13-2023, 10:31 AM   #1184
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Did anyone else get Jurassic Park vibes during the giraffe scene?

I was 1/2 expecting the giraffe to sneeze snot all over her.

I did not play the games, but was entertained by the series. I was looking forward to watching it every Sunday night, and that is good enough for me. Mission accomplished, HBO!
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Old 03-13-2023, 11:03 AM   #1185
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Before this season began airing, I read somewhere that the plan was for the second game to be spread over 2 seasons.

It will be interesting to see how they adapt the second game because it isn't as straightforward and linear as the first game was. Plus, there's a five-year time jump.
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Old 03-13-2023, 11:54 AM   #1186
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Lol at the above. It's precisely what you're meant to feel.

The only part you've got wrong is Joel taking away Ellie's agency to make her own decisions. It was Marlene who did that, as Ellie wasn't informed she'd die on the operating table.

Everyone sucks here. No one is in the right.
Well said

The turn/situation is supposed to make the audience feel uncomfortable. There was no "win" coming out of that predicament. Joel had to decide which loss was easier to stomach, and for him that was keeping Ellie alive at the expense of the fireflies and their cure project (which wasn't guaranteed to succeed anyways). We know that Joel wasn't going to let someone he had basically adopted as a second daughter (highlighted by their early exchanges) slip through his fingers like Sarah did.

I didn't mind Joel mowing them down just because we know his soldier background and with ellie at stake he would be at his most focused and lethal. And these guys were probably never soldiers before but civilians recruited by the fireflies and trained with them.

It makes sense that it wasn't a big challenge for Joel vs these guys. He's hardened and unafraid. They didn't want to be in debt to him (as Marlene said) because they know what he can do

I wouldn't mind the search for ellie being dragged out more, but I'm also not exactly sure what it would add or accomplish in terms of dramatic effect either.

What was needed were more infected. Maybe a brush with some clickers before the fireflies. Think they could've used a reminder of the dangers they still pose to survivors.

I liked the ending. But sure, pacing and style points weren't perfect in this one. Interesting how that's completely swayed certain posters on the entire season. Fickle audience

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Old 03-13-2023, 12:17 PM   #1187
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This episode almost completely lacked suspense. They were very relaxed walking through the city and buildings, nothing ominous. Maybe that was to show Joel was in a better place mentally, but that’s not how they survived to get to this point.

The hospital shootout was cartoonish. I guess they didn’t want it to overshadow the interpersonal drama, but it also killed any suspense. Season-ending plot armour.
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The rampage violence IMO was done that way so you aren't cheering for Joel to survive and worried about him during it. Its just him mowing people down - including people who've dropped their weapons or didn't have weapons. If it was some kind of tense battle - you'd reflexively be on his side.
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this makes sense I guess, as soon as they started playing the sad theme music over top of the action, you knew that his plot shield was at 100% and nobody was going to touch him.

the one other thing I didn't like was how little shock/anguish/defiance Joel displayed upon learning what the true plan was. it's as if he knew in advance that the next quest was to Rambo the entire hospital, so he almost immediately just pressed 'X' to accept.
With respect to the "plot armour" and "Rambo-ing the entire hospital": to me, it is essentially what happens in the game. Joel does go in and mow down many, many Fireflies.

I think this is an unfortunate circumstance the writers put themselves into by virtue of adapting a video game. Any adaptation from another medium will demand some changes to be made to suit the new medium, and in order to keep to the game's story narrative they kind of had to concede that Joel will "Rambo the entire hospital". It seems so much more desperate and time-consuming to complete this chapter of the video game because you, the player, as Joel, can die. Repeatedly. Narratively though, within the game's canon, basically that one time wherein you do actually beat the chapter of the game (after repeated deaths) is "the truth" from which the rest of the story continues. From the perspective of the Fireflies Joel does "Rambo" them all. If you're a good enough player to make it all the way through without dying this section of the game takes maybe 20 minutes to complete.
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Old 03-13-2023, 12:23 PM   #1188
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This episode almost completely lacked suspense. They were very relaxed walking through the city and buildings, nothing ominous. Maybe that was to show Joel was in a better place mentally, but thatís not how they survived to get to this point.
I think it was to show how Joel has opened up and let Ellie in and taken on an "us vs the world" frame of mind, while Ellie still has one foot in the real world and is concerned about how her condition can serve a purpose.
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Old 03-13-2023, 12:26 PM   #1189
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When does S2 come out? Need to find time to replay Part I, then play Part II for the first time.
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Old 03-13-2023, 12:29 PM   #1190
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When does S2 come out? Need to find time to replay Part I, then play Part II for the first time.
You have plenty of time. It was only officially renewed a few weeks ago and production hasn't begun yet.

I'd guess fall 2024 at the earliest.
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Old 03-13-2023, 12:30 PM   #1191
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Comments on Episode 9...

1. Not sure why there was some discussion about that being "polarizing". It was the same as the game, just shorter.
2. I wish they'd had a real giraffe if they were going to do that scene. The CGI... wasn't that great.
3. Merle Dandridge was fantastic. Ashley Johnson was fantastic-er. Really great cameo.
4. Again, and I've said this for roughly the entire back half of the season, they just didn't give it enough time to breathe. Joel is basically John Rambo plowing through soldiers in a hospital killing everyone... okay, maybe in a video game, but they needed that whole sequence to be a lot less video gamey, even if they had to do something totally different. Dude was clearly not playing on Grounded.

Scenes from the episode in game form:

Joel and Ellie with the giraffes:
Spoiler!

Joel wakes up in the hospital with Marlene:
Spoiler!

Joel kills Marlene:
Spoiler!

Ending scene:
Spoiler!

... I actually think that last scene was actually probably better in the game.
Lol at "CGI on that real giraffe from the zoo wasn't great"

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Old 03-13-2023, 12:54 PM   #1192
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Going back, Joel is not even looking at the giraffe, he's looking at Ellie the whole time.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1635150647497744384
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:00 PM   #1193
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Going back, Joel is not even looking at the giraffe, he's looking at Ellie the whole time.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1635150647497744384
I donít envy those compositors. Fixing that blue cast is on the giraffe and matching that light looks like a nightmare.
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:15 PM   #1194
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I didn't find the ending as bad as many people on here are stating. The unrealistic rampage was partially due to many of the guards only having handguns up against Joel's assault rifle.

One thing I did notice was that they really made Joel out to be a psychopath, and much more so than the game did. In the game it felt more like Joel was acting out of a genuine relationship. Here, it was like he was some kind of serial killer that just got fixated on protecting an innocent, to the point he was using that as an excuse to kill. He really didn't seem all that conflicted about protecting Ellie vs. searching for a cure. There seemed to be no internal debate, just kill mode.

Overall, I liked the episode and thought the whole show was great. The opening scene with the birth was really disturbing, but also did a good job of illustrating what might actually happen in that scenario.
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:17 PM   #1195
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It felt like a slog only if you died over and over trying to beat it. It didn't actually last all that long in the game either.
I mean, you can do the massacre in minutes just like the show. Less than a single minute if you are good even.

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The rampage violence IMO was done that way so you aren't cheering for Joel to survive and worried about him during it. Its just him mowing people down - including people who've dropped their weapons or didn't have weapons. If it was some kind of tense battle - you'd reflexively be on his side.
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The only part you've got wrong is Joel taking away Ellie's agency to make her own decisions.

Everyone sucks here. No one is in the right.
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For game people, I didn't notice this obviously but apparently the nurse on the left was played by Laura Bailey.


You reap what you sow. And the seeds are already planted for season 2.
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:23 PM   #1196
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I don't see how they could fit the 2nd game into a single season, unless they make quite a few more episodes than season 1. It's a much longer game than the first with many more characters

Confirmed to be multiple seasons
, but whether it's one or two (or more) is TBD.

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One thing I did notice was that they really made Joel out to be a psychopath, and much more so than the game did. In the game it felt more like Joel was acting out of a genuine relationship. Here, it was like he was some kind of serial killer that just got fixated on protecting an innocent, to the point he was using that as an excuse to kill. He really didn't seem all that conflicted about protecting Ellie vs. searching for a cure. There seemed to be no internal debate, just kill mode.
So basically Punisher if one of his kids had lived.
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:25 PM   #1197
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So basically Punisher if one of his kids had lived.
Worse than that. Joel was potentially dooming the world. He didn't seem to stop and consider the other side. Just straight to killing. It might have been better if Joel had resigned himself to Ellie's death, and at least got out of the building before he decided to murder everyone looking for a cure.
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:26 PM   #1198
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I donít envy those compositors. Fixing that blue cast is on the giraffe and matching that light looks like a nightmare.
They just use computers to do it.
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:30 PM   #1199
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Lol at the above. It's precisely what you're meant to feel.

The only part you've got wrong is Joel taking away Ellie's agency to make her own decisions. It was Marlene who did that, as Ellie wasn't informed she'd die on the operating table.

Everyone sucks here. No one is in the right.
Joel and Marlene did the same thing. Marlene by trying to kill her, Joel by murdering the doctor and then lying. Joel took away her agency by killing the doctor. That was a self serving decision that allowed him to have his daughter back.. He easily could have shot a knee cap to end the surgery. There is no ambiguity he was as wrong as Marlene.

Joel doesnít really love Ellie he loves himself as he always did. He is unredeemed despite the shows first 8 episodes trying to convince you he had changed.
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Old 03-13-2023, 01:35 PM   #1200
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Worse than that. Joel was potentially dooming the world. He didn't seem to stop and consider the other side. Just straight to killing. It might have been better if Joel had resigned himself to Ellie's death, and at least got out of the building before he decided to murder everyone looking for a cure.
The game did this far better IMO. In the show the Fireflies know exactly why Ellie is immune, which suggests they can extract a cure and definitely paints Joel as a madman. In the game they have no idea why Ellie is immune, they just want to cut her up to hopefully find some kind of clue. Makes Joel seem a little less psychotic when he saves Ellie from a (probably) pointless death
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