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View Poll Results: What role do humans play in contributing to climate change?
Humans are the primary contributor to climate change 321 63.69%
Humans contribute to climate change, but not the main cause 134 26.59%
Not sure 26 5.16%
Climate change is a hoax 23 4.56%
Voters: 504. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 09-24-2019, 02:34 PM   #1041
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Lol

SUVs and pickups are classified as "Trucks" on that chart. So if personal vehicles are classified in that category according to the statistics, why can't we include trucks as personal vehicles?

You can't cherry pick. Use the stats and let's look at numbers for Western Canadian provinces.
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:37 PM   #1042
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100%. Right to repair. Stop making product deliberately convoluted so they cannot be easily repaired.
Boom.

The right to repair law would make a massive, massive difference.

And I'm not talking about iPhones either.

It is common knowledge in the agriculture industry that not having the right to repair your equipment is extremely costly. Environmentally it is a killer.
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:40 PM   #1043
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Now we're back to bickering about minor details. We really are going to amuse ourselves to death.
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:40 PM   #1044
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Are you sure that lack of foresight was about that or about the fact that the economy should be diversified to absorb a blow to one commodity-based sector? You know, those commodities that have significant price swings on a nearly constant basis? Nobody should have expected oil to stay around $100 a barrel.
The lack of pipelines and pipeline infrastructure being built does show that yes they lacked the foresight.
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:44 PM   #1045
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... Iím clearly talking about jobs. You donít know anyone in Alberta who lost their oil and gas job? Are you kidding me??? Isnít there an estimated 10,000+ oil and gas jobs predicted to be lost this year?

I specifically state in the post you quoted that oil and gas isnít going away completely. You talk about foresight, and Iím concerned about a commodity that the worlds economy isnít going to use in its existing capacity forever. Foresight is planning for that.

Sell it all as quick as we can and invest in nuclear energy.
You are missing the point.

Coal is being phased out. Oil is not. There is a difference in the reasons why jobs are being lost.
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:46 PM   #1046
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We could reduce energy usage probably by 30% straight away if everyone bought in and really wanted to. Drive less, vacation less, buy less crap. But no one is going to do that because the lifestyle we lead is the lifestyle we want.

You don't want the 50mpg puddle jumper you want the nice SUV that gets half that. Sure some people need a large people mover most do not, I can easily prove this by watching traffic for 5 minutes.
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It's a trend in all of North America. To the point where GM and Ford are not bothering with sedans anymore.
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I'm dismissive because it doesn't matter, we need to brainstorm solutions not argue over who may or may not be correct about a prediction.
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Now we're back to bickering about minor details. We really are going to amuse ourselves to death.
... what do you want?
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:50 PM   #1047
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Because we need forced change in industry to change habits. For example: People are still going to buy the plastic dollar store item, wrapped in more plastic necessary, shipped from China. Because itís all they can afford. In addition, there are countless fossil fuel industry jobs that would be on the line. Those people need to be protected if youíre going to dial back that industry. Thatís done through effective government.
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You are missing the point.

Coal is being phased out. Oil is not. There is a difference in the reasons why jobs are being lost.
No, youíve missed the point of my argument. Which was on the page before you responded so I can see how they became disconnected. I was arguing that itís an important political issue, and that IF youíre going to scale back an industry in the name of a Ďgreení solution, those people need protection.
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:51 PM   #1048
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... what do you want?
I'd like to see more auto makers embrace the BEV for starters. I am adamant we stop making everything out of plastic since most of it ends up in the ocean we're at the point where micro particles of plastic are in almost everything no matter where you are on the globe.

The path forward is to use our carbon energy to enable innovation to the point where we are as close to carbon neutral as possible. The way forward is not screaming we are doomed let's shut down pipelines and sail around the ocean.

What do YOU want?
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Old 09-24-2019, 02:55 PM   #1049
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I'd like to see more auto makers embrace the BEV for starters. I am adamant we stop making everything out of plastic since most of it ends up in the ocean we're at the point where micro particles of plastic are in almost everything no matter where you are on the globe.

The path forward is to use our carbon energy to enable innovation to the point where we are as close to carbon neutral as possible. The way forward is not screaming we are doomed let's shut down pipelines and sail around the ocean.

What do YOU want?
This is what everyone wants. Fix the problem but don't impact me in any way. Unfortunately it likely isn't going to work that way.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:02 PM   #1050
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This is what everyone wants. Fix the problem but don't impact me in any way. Unfortunately it likely isn't going to work that way.
I think it can but not in the time frame some except. We are not going to change the foundation of our society in 12 years, I'd say 50 years is doable.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:05 PM   #1051
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I think it can but not in the time frame some except. We are not going to change the foundation of our society in 12 years, I'd say 50 years is doable.
All the same, if change is going to happen in 50 years, it needs to start now.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:08 PM   #1052
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All the same, if change is going to happen in 50 years, it needs to start now.
Wait until China, India, Brazil, Russia and the U.S. sort their houses out first. We have the time.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:09 PM   #1053
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Lol

SUVs and pickups are classified as "Trucks" on that chart. So if personal vehicles are classified in that category according to the statistics, why can't we include trucks as personal vehicles?

You can't cherry pick. Use the stats and let's look at numbers for Western Canadian provinces.
Goddamit, take a second and read. AGAIN:



Light trucks: include minivans, sport-utility vehicles, light trucks and vans.

Trucks: Trucks include minivans, sport-utility vehicles, light and heavy trucks, vans and buses.


There is a great deal of overlap between the categories. "Trucks" included everything in the light truck category, PLUS heavy trucks and buses. Do you need a Venn diagram? Light trucks is what is relevant to the consumer population. You compare that to the "passenger cars" category. Which is exactly what I did. I don't know what your major malfunction is.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:15 PM   #1054
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Wait until China, India, Brazil, Russia and the U.S. sort their houses out first. We have the time.
Oh yeah that's right, I forgot that it is always someone else's fault.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:21 PM   #1055
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Goddamit, take a second and read. AGAIN:



Light trucks: include minivans, sport-utility vehicles, light trucks and vans.

Trucks: Trucks include minivans, sport-utility vehicles, light and heavy trucks, vans and buses.


There is a great deal of overlap between the categories. "Trucks" included everything in the light truck category, PLUS heavy trucks and buses. Do you need a Venn diagram? Light trucks is what is relevant to the consumer population. You compare that to the "passenger cars" category. Which is exactly what I did. I don't know what your major malfunction is.
Lol

You just cherry-picked even more and are proving my point with bolding certain vehicles. And even then, why would the same vehicles be categorized twice? That's double dipping! Like a DQ ice cream cone!

Just accept the fact that "Trucks" should be included in personal vehicles as much as Light Trucks. No need to blow your tits wide open on semantics.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:24 PM   #1056
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Oh yeah that's right, I forgot that it is always someone else's fault.
We shouldn't do anything until the big boys make the real gains. Check out the visualization of Canada vs. the big boys:

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Old 09-24-2019, 03:31 PM   #1057
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Lol

You just cherry-picked even more and are proving my point with bolding certain vehicles. And even then, why would the same vehicles be categorized twice? That's double dipping! Like a DQ ice cream cone!

Just accept the fact that "Trucks" should be included in personal vehicles as much as Light Trucks. No need to blow your tits wide open on semantics.
So you really do need a venn diagram. You can look at the numbers yourself to convince yourself of the facts. They "double dip" because "Trucks" is the main category, then break that out into "light trucks", trucks, and buses. I'm done pointing out the blindingly obvious to you, but if you want to included buses and industrial trucks as personal vehicles, well, that's your prerogative. I think it's blindingly stupid, but you do you.



https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1...pid=2010000201


Honest question, are you trolling?
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:37 PM   #1058
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All the same, if change is going to happen in 50 years, it needs to start now.
It started a long time ago, petrol cars are 1000's of time cleaner than they were in the 50's. Power plants are much more efficient, we know how to build much better nuclear stations. Quite a few highly dangerous and destructive chemicals have been banned.

Population growth has largely negated the gains, and developing nations don't have the luxury of being green. Plus as a society we have become incredibly wasteful and base our lifestyle in large part to buying crap, needed or not. Industry for the most part doesn't give a second thought to producing goods with a life cycle in mind it's made to be used and tossed. Slap a recycle logo on it call it day, who cares if it actually gets recycled or how difficult it is to recycle assuming it happens.

In defense of the auto industry they are quite good at recycling most of the vehicle is reused in some way, the difficult stuff is rubber, electronics and plastic.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:40 PM   #1059
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So you really do need a venn diagram. You can look at the numbers yourself to convince yourself of the facts. They "double dip" because "Trucks" is the main category, then break that out into "light trucks", trucks, and buses. I'm done pointing out the blindingly obvious to you, but if you want to included buses and industrial trucks as personal vehicles, well, that's your prerogative. I think it's blindingly stupid, but you do you.



https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1...pid=2010000201


Honest question, are you trolling?
Straight outta Statistics Canada:

Footnote 2: Trucks include minivans, sport-utility vehicles, light and heavy trucks, vans and buses.

Footnote 3:Light trucks: include minivans, sport-utility vehicles, light trucks and vans.

So now we're counting SUVs and minivans in the same category on two different levels. Each footnote does not designate why we should use these two separate types exclusively in two categories. If we can't define a difference, then both need to be used, partner! You're going to have to Venn me hard on how we don't include both.

You also do realize that there is no definition of what constitutes a personal vehicle and what constitutes a commercial vehicle according to the data presented, right?
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:45 PM   #1060
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I suspect in 30 years we will still be arguing that we are on the precipice of extinction.
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