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Old 01-01-2019, 03:41 PM   #61
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I love this move ! He should go about 5-15 and help us get a better pick !

Jays should be aiming for a bottom 5 finish this year

I agree with the bottom 5 comment simply because they should be stripping this team clean with guys who won't be here 3 years from now. However, in baseball, does it really matter if you get a top 5 pick? Due to signing bonus discussions before the draft, and the varying opinions on players, isn't there a wide set of opinions on each player, save the top 3 or so generally? So sometimes someone could be ranked on some publications the 4th best player, and that player could be drafted 35th based on teams chances at signing him and the varying opinion on their skillset. Baseball is interesting that way.
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Old 01-01-2019, 03:53 PM   #62
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I agree with the bottom 5 comment simply because they should be stripping this team clean with guys who won't be here 3 years from now. However, in baseball, does it really matter if you get a top 5 pick? Due to signing bonus discussions before the draft, and the varying opinions on players, isn't there a wide set of opinions on each player, save the top 3 or so generally? So sometimes someone could be ranked on some publications the 4th best player, and that player could be drafted 35th based on teams chances at signing him and the varying opinion on their skillset. Baseball is interesting that way.
While perhaps not as critical as other leagues, probably due to development time more than anything, a lot of elite talent is found in the top 5-10. It definetly matters I'd say.
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Old 01-01-2019, 04:20 PM   #63
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I agree with the bottom 5 comment simply because they should be stripping this team clean with guys who won't be here 3 years from now. However, in baseball, does it really matter if you get a top 5 pick? Due to signing bonus discussions before the draft, and the varying opinions on players, isn't there a wide set of opinions on each player, save the top 3 or so generally? So sometimes someone could be ranked on some publications the 4th best player, and that player could be drafted 35th based on teams chances at signing him and the varying opinion on their skillset. Baseball is interesting that way.
Ya you're definitely right in that the baseball draft includes a lot more variability and uncertainty than other professional league's drafts. Signability issues, whether they want to go to college and re-enter the draft in a couple years and hopefully improve their position and get a better bonus etc. But I definitely feel like having a top 10 pick is better than not having a top 10 pick. Gerrit Cole, Carlos Correa, Francisco Lindor, Trevor Bauer, Kris Bryant, Kyle Schwarber, Aaron Nola, Kyle Freeland, Alex Bregman, Andrew Benintendi were all picked in the top 10 between 2011 and 2015. I think only one of those was a first overall (Cole).
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Old 01-01-2019, 06:47 PM   #64
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I agree with those saying the Jays should have traded their top guys earlier and miscalculated their competive window. Seeing those potential deals for Donaldson hurts and that is on Shapiro and Atkins for botching that.
They didn't miscalculate anything, imo. They were instructed to hold on to the playoff roster as long as possible to sell ticket buyers on another playoff hopeful season.

And it worked - They were still getting 30k strong with 40k on weekends waaaaay past when Jays fans should have been giving them that. Everyone knew when it was time to sell, and Shapiro and Atkins would have known too.

Directives are stronger than logic, unfortunately.
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Old 01-01-2019, 07:38 PM   #65
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^ Fair enough, but it's Shapiro's job to pitch what the effect of that is. So if he didn't get his way, it's a failure on his part too.
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Old 01-01-2019, 09:37 PM   #66
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Tulo to the Yankees pending a physical. Yuck.
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Old 01-01-2019, 10:19 PM   #67
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How ironic. The Yankees pay him $550K and the Jays pay him $20 million.

The Yankees making those under the radar, low risk moves?
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Old 01-01-2019, 11:29 PM   #68
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Boy I sure hope Tulo is washed up because if he contributes wins to the Yankees while they pay him 550k and the Jays are paying him tens of millions the optics will be terrible.
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Old 01-02-2019, 08:55 AM   #69
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Yankees risk nothing in signing him for next to nothing but Tulo is done as a major league player imo. Bench utility infielder with a below average bat with maybe a bit of pop left. His OBP, Slugging %, bat speed, exit velo, all decreasing since his hip surgery in 2014.
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Old 01-02-2019, 09:07 AM   #70
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Whats the guess on number of games before he is injured? 20? 40?
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Old 01-02-2019, 10:52 AM   #71
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whats the guess on number of games before he is injured? 20? 40?
0.5
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Old 01-02-2019, 03:06 PM   #72
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^ Fair enough, but it's Shapiro's job to pitch what the effect of that is. So if he didn't get his way, it's a failure on his part too.
You're never going to get your way if it runs counter to an $8bil publicly traded company with shareholders.
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Old 01-02-2019, 06:43 PM   #73
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Personally I hope Tulo falls on his face. Something about him that really rubbed me the wrong way. Likely how he didn't want to entertain the possibility of a different position with his diminished skill. Hard to root for a guy who's kinda handcuffing the team.

Anyway, I give it under 30 games before he's forced to situ out which ultimately leads to him retiring after collecting his paycheque.
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Old 01-07-2019, 10:32 AM   #74
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I agree that Tulo brought a certain arrogance with him, you could say it was deserved if you like based on his history but wasn't my favourite player either.

This offseason has been pretty terrible. Maybe a necessary evil for the Jays but hard to see them being anything other than terrible this year with that rotation. The additions on paper look awful, like worse than journeymen. And even with that rotation they were talking about trading Stroman and Sanchez. Puzzling unless they were getting blue chip prospects back which it didn't sound like. Not a big fan of Atkins approach on the roster so far, it's like a half-assed teardown. At least watching the rookies will be interesting.

Also... still don't know wtf they did with Tulo. I know they couldn't have known where he'd go but they've basically paid him to go to a divisional rival for nothing. If Tulo comes off the bench and hits even semi decently you've hurt yourself for nothing. If he wanted to pout should have sent him down.
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Old 01-11-2019, 01:48 AM   #75
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The Blue Jays have agreed to a contract with righty David Phelps, according to Shi Davidi of Sportsnet.ca (Twitter link). It’s said to be a one-year deal that comes with a club option.



Phelps will receive a $2.5MM guarantee, per Ken Rosenthal of The Athletic (links to Twitter). The deal also dangles a variety of incentives along with a floating option value depending upon how many frames Phelps throws in the season to come.

The terms reflect the fact that Phelps, a client of Jet Sports Management, is coming off of a season lost to Tommy John surgery. The 2020 option price will start at just $1MM. It goes up to $3MM if he appears in 30 games and hits $5MM if he makes his 40th outing. If Phelps reaches fifty appearances the option will jump to $7MM; it can climb by another $1MM if he also finishes forty games, which obviously would not take place unless he earns and keeps the Jays’ closer job for much of the season.

In terms of incentives, Phelps can boost his 2019 pay quite a bit if he’s able to get on the hill early and often. He’ll get a quarter-million boost upon throwing his 25th, 30th, and 35th games, then take home successive $350K payouts if he can reach appearances 40, 45, 50, 55, and 60. The option year also has available incentive pay.
https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/...id-phelps.html
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Old 01-11-2019, 08:39 AM   #76
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The additions on paper look awful, like worse than journeymen.
I dunno, I kind of like the Shoemaker deal.
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Old 01-11-2019, 09:08 AM   #77
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I agree that Tulo brought a certain arrogance with him, you could say it was deserved if you like based on his history but wasn't my favourite player either.

This offseason has been pretty terrible. Maybe a necessary evil for the Jays but hard to see them being anything other than terrible this year with that rotation. The additions on paper look awful, like worse than journeymen. And even with that rotation they were talking about trading Stroman and Sanchez. Puzzling unless they were getting blue chip prospects back which it didn't sound like. Not a big fan of Atkins approach on the roster so far, it's like a half-assed teardown. At least watching the rookies will be interesting.

Also... still don't know wtf they did with Tulo. I know they couldn't have known where he'd go but they've basically paid him to go to a divisional rival for nothing. If Tulo comes off the bench and hits even semi decently you've hurt yourself for nothing. If he wanted to pout should have sent him down.
Just curious what kind of moves were you expecting the Jays to make this offseason?

Is it not plainly obvious that the Jays are in full rebuild mode and are going to be terrible this season, as well as the next? That's the whole point of a total tear-down which the Jays are currently in at the moment. Osuna, Donaldson, Tulo, Happ, Diaz, Solarte, Granderson, Pearce, Oh, Axford, Loup, Estrada, Clippard are all gone. I mean sure take issue with Atkin's returns on trades or the handling of Donaldson, but how can you possibly interpret what is happening with the Jays as a "half-assed" tear down?
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:36 AM   #78
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Ben Nicholson-Smith@bnicholsonsmith

Per @BNightengale, Ken Giles & #BlueJays avoided arb with a $6.3 million deal
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Old 01-11-2019, 11:58 AM   #79
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Just curious what kind of moves were you expecting the Jays to make this offseason?

Is it not plainly obvious that the Jays are in full rebuild mode and are going to be terrible this season, as well as the next? That's the whole point of a total tear-down which the Jays are currently in at the moment. Osuna, Donaldson, Tulo, Happ, Diaz, Solarte, Granderson, Pearce, Oh, Axford, Loup, Estrada, Clippard are all gone. I mean sure take issue with Atkin's returns on trades or the handling of Donaldson, but how can you possibly interpret what is happening with the Jays as a "half-assed" tear down?
I would say it’s half assed from two perspectives.
1) there are guys still on the roster who will not be part of the futures and who’s value today will be higher than tomorrow. Trade them to get prospects instead of dealing them later when their skills decline.
2) smart signings. There are two ways to go about signing guys. You sign guys who haven’t developed who may go boom or bust (ie: Bautista years back) and let them develop. Not mediocre guys who have little upside. Or you sign a marquee guy and deal him at the deadline for prospects. Baseball is mostly about money chasers so if you give guys money they’ll come here.
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Old 01-11-2019, 12:18 PM   #80
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Russell Martin traded to the Dodgers.
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