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Why we choose Suicide
Minnie posted in the WGMG thread about a friend of one of her children comitting suicide. We also had a thread recently created about a Canadian porn star comitting suicide at age 23.
In discussions of the above nature arguments arise about wether suicide is a choice. A while back I stumbled upon a TedX talk video where mental health advocate Mark Henich does a talk about his own personal experience with suicide and why there is no choice.
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About the Speaker:
Mark Henick is a mental health advocate. Informed by his direct experience with this aspect of the health care system, Mark has authored commentaries on issues relating to mental health for major newspapers across Canada and the U.S. His undergraduate degree is in Psychology and Philosophy, with a graduate degree in Child Development. At 22, he served as the youngest President of a provincial Canadian Mental Health Association division in history. He is the youngest member of the board of directors for the Mental Health Commission of Canada.
I think it's important that everyone watch this video with hopes a better understanding can be gained and what people go through. If anything a healthy discussion of the subject with hopes of eliminating the negitive stigma regarding mental health.
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My sister and brother both killed themselves and my mom tried twice, most recently last year. My dad was just taken off life support to die peacefully and then walked out of the hospital three weeks later. So wtf do I know about this? Some people really want to live and some do not.
I've got two foster kids wrestling these demons, there's little I can do in reality but always answer the phone (sometimes at 4am) and pray, I am scared to death I might lose either of them, they have both done well, got out of the system got jobs.
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My brother in law was recently diagnosed with bi polar after going into a very extreme manic episode.
No one in the family every saw this coming and it feels like it came out of nowhere for a guys who's about to turn 30.
Not directly suicide related (thankfully he hasn't yet shown any signs of those thoughts); but my eyes have been opened wide to what mental health issues are really like.
After spending many days in a psych ward and seeing what the inpatients are dealing with, I definitely have a better sense of how things like suicide would not be a choice at all.
The mind is incredibly powerful.
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My sister and brother both killed themselves and my mom tried twice, most recently last year. My dad was just taken off life support to die peacefully and then walked out of the hospital three weeks later. So wtf do I know about this? Some people really want to live and some do not.
Holy crap man, I am truly sorry to hear about how much suicide has cost you. That is really heartbreaking.
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^^wow! OMG!WTF!, when I read your post I thought the text was a passage from the article. When dissentowner posted his response, I realized that text was about you and your family. I am sorry for you and your family.
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Four years after her own suicide attempt, Gill Hayes aims to bring hope to others by sharing her story of recovery from severe depression. In this powerful and deeply personal talk, she challenges the stigma surrounding mental illness and explains how we can all help to save lives by understanding depression.
I just finished watching "13 reasons why" a fictional netflix teen drama series on suicide. I thought it was really well done, thought provoking series. It tells a story of one road that can lead to suicide, especially for young adults - a depression spiral. The logic flow was something like: (a) Depression spirals can cause otherwise sane people into depths of destruction where there is no way out (b) that the signs of an impending suicide are hard to read, and (c) people who commit suicide were surrounded by people who could have (and would have) done more (if only they knew). And it could have made a difference because people who commit suicide lack the perception of how much they matter.
If you believe the signs of suicide are hard to read and that even the smallest actions can be the straw that breaks (or saves) the camel's back, then we all owe it to each other to be a list more caring of those around us, and a little softer to each other.
When I look back at my 15-25 years, the largest single events that took me out of my own depression cycle were the "unexpected" actions of my friends that forced me to challenge my perceptions of reality. So it fits with the TEDx video mentioned by Dion. Friends - all of whom had no idea of what I was going through - just going out of there way to do something for our relationship, which basically showed me that I was valued, that I mattered. I remember three events vividly - a friend that set-up an entire NYE night for me and made me come out (thereby counteracting my view that no one cared whether I showed up or not); a friend that dropped everything at 2am to text with me for 4 hours when I was 2000 miles away (counteracting my view that my relationships lacked depth and I was a friend of convenience) ; and a friend who hung-out with me for an entire weekend (counteracting my view that people liked me in groups, but not one-on-one). Just showing someone you care is sometimes all they need...
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I struggled with posting my own story but it might help people understand. I was diagnosed with PTSD 2 years ago. Having learned a lot about the illness, I have probably been struggling with the illness for much longer but it was initially diagnosed as depression.
There are many components to PTSD. Suicidal thoughts is a huge issue with my PTSD. I have had daily thoughts of suicide for about two years. The thoughts are not in passing but dominate my thinking for hours a day. I have not attempted suicide but I have a plan of how I would go about it. I have shared everything with my doctor, counsellor, and psychiatrist. These folks give me support and strategies for dealing with the thoughts. For me, suicide is a way to end the constant pain that comes with the illness. Basically, suicide would happen when I could no longer cope with the pain and the strategies were exhausted; I don’t believe I will ever choose that route. In my experience, counselling and therapy are paramount to avoiding suicide. My counsellor and doctor have provided so much value that I could write pages about it. The trouble is that many people don’t go for various reason including the stigma involved.
Mental illness has a terrible stigma that brings about a lot of shame and embarrassment. These illnesses are not easy to explain or fix and it is not something that one just gets over. My circle of friends is getting smaller because I have found that some people don’t get it and have judged me. In the past few months, I have let go of several friendships due to comments and assumptions that were made. Essentially, the comments were negative and left me questioning myself followed by intense feelings of shame and suicide. On the flip side, I have had some friendships grow stronger because buddies have been completely non judgemental and always there for me. Similar to GullFoss, I have had some friends do exceptional things for me. This summer in Idaho, a group of friends surprised me with a Canada Day party complete with trivia, Canadian Club whiskey, and Canada flags. On my birthday, about 40 friends gathered by the river and celebrated my birthday; a few of the friends even drove 100kms round trip to join me for burgers and cake. A birthday card signed by those friends sits on my tv stand as a reminder of my value. As well, my friends are already making plans for the next Canada Day and birthday. Those are the moments I cling to when I have tough moments; it’s kind of tough to off myself when people are planning parties for me and I see that they value me. If I had a friend who was suicidal, I would look to make a special moment that is about the individual and makes them challenge their perceptions of their self worth.
When I was first prescribed antidepressants, I was worried about the suicidal risks associated with the drugs. I asked my counsellor how antidepressants cause suicide because I wanted to know what to look for with my behaviour and feelings. She explained that the drugs don’t cause suicide as a side effect. Essentially, a mentally ill person may be so depressed or sick that they can’t even motivate themselves to commit suicide. Once the drugs start working, it actually improves a person to a point at which they can now motivate themselves to commit suicide and actually act on the impulse. So, if someone you care for has been recently precribed antidepressants, it is worth keeping an eye on their behaviour.
If you have read this far, the last thing I would worry about with a mentally ill person is to try to understand them. Be empathetic, non judgemental, and supportively listen but what they may be going through may make no sense at all and most folks don’t have the training to understand. With my PTSD, most of my thought patterns are irrational and I know that. I tried to make people understand...it was pointless. I think the only people that understand are my counsellor and psychiatrist.
Long post but hopefully it sheds some light on suicide for the OP and others.
Last edited by wwkayaker; 01-14-2018 at 10:40 AM.
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I was diagnosed about 12 years ago. I did a huge study at the Mayo that concluded about a year ago. EMDR really really helps if you can swing it. And the number one conclusion after a twelve year study....get a dog.
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I was diagnosed about 12 years ago. I did a huge study at the Mayo that concluded about a year ago. EMDR really really helps if you can swing it. And the number one conclusion after a twelve year study....get a dog.
I am currently looking into EMDR and spoke to,my counsellor about it last week. I have a golden retriever and she is my lifeline.. I’m currently looking into having her registered as a service dog.
2 years has been exhausting. I can’t imagine what 12 years dealing with PTSD must feel like. If I am correct, your dog recently passed away...are you getting another?
I am currently looking into EMDR and spoke to,my counsellor about it last week. I have a golden retriever and she is my lifeline.. I’m currently looking into having her registered as a service dog.
2 years has been exhausting. I can’t imagine what 12 years dealing with PTSD must feel like. If I am correct, your dog recently passed away...are you getting another?
Quit copying me! First the PTSD. Now the golden retriever!
Yes sadly mine just died at 12. But he left me with an almost two year old disaster who is so wonderful. I think it is really important to get back into it with another dog. There are just too many laughs to miss out. And I have a friend with several goldens who let's me "help out" once and a while.
EMDR is intense and difficult but it will change your life...probably. It has a very good success rate.
12 years is nothin when you got a dog bugging you for walks and hikes.
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Originally Posted by redforever
Some brave people posting in here. Kudos to you.
We have a caring and understanding community that allows members to share their experiences. Discussions of this nature have come up over the years and through that we all have become better educated on what to look for and how to be a good supportive listeners.
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I struggled with posting my own story but it might help people understand. I was diagnosed with PTSD 2 years ago. Having learned a lot about the illness, I have probably been struggling with the illness for much longer but it was initially diagnosed as depression.
There are many components to PTSD. Suicidal thoughts is a huge issue with my PTSD. I have had daily thoughts of suicide for about two years. The thoughts are not in passing but dominate my thinking for hours a day. I have not attempted suicide but I have a plan of how I would go about it. I have shared everything with my doctor, counsellor, and psychiatrist. These folks give me support and strategies for dealing with the thoughts. For me, suicide is a way to end the constant pain that comes with the illness. Basically, suicide would happen when I could no longer cope with the pain and the strategies were exhausted; I don’t believe I will ever choose that route. In my experience, counselling and therapy are paramount to avoiding suicide. My counsellor and doctor have provided so much value that I could write pages about it. The trouble is that many people don’t go for various reason including the stigma involved.
Mental illness has a terrible stigma that brings about a lot of shame and embarrassment. These illnesses are not easy to explain or fix and it is not something that one just gets over. My circle of friends is getting smaller because I have found that some people don’t get it and have judged me. In the past few months, I have let go of several friendships due to comments and assumptions that were made. Essentially, the comments were negative and left me questioning myself followed by intense feelings of shame and suicide. On the flip side, I have had some friendships grow stronger because buddies have been completely non judgemental and always there for me. Similar to GullFoss, I have had some friends do exceptional things for me. This summer in Idaho, a group of friends surprised me with a Canada Day party complete with trivia, Canadian Club whiskey, and Canada flags. On my birthday, about 40 friends gathered by the river and celebrated my birthday; a few of the friends even drove 100kms round trip to join me for burgers and cake. A birthday card signed by those friends sits on my tv stand as a reminder of my value. As well, my friends are already making plans for the next Canada Day and birthday. Those are the moments I cling to when I have tough moments; it’s kind of tough to off myself when people are planning parties for me and I see that they value me. If I had a friend who was suicidal, I would look to make a special moment that is about the individual and makes them challenge their perceptions of their self worth.
When I was first prescribed antidepressants, I was worried about the suicidal risks associated with the drugs. I asked my counsellor how antidepressants cause suicide because I wanted to know what to look for with my behaviour and feelings. She explained that the drugs don’t cause suicide as a side effect. Essentially, a mentally ill person may be so depressed or sick that they can’t even motivate themselves to commit suicide. Once the drugs start working, it actually improves a person to a point at which they can now motivate themselves to commit suicide and actually act on the impulse. So, if someone you care for has been recently precribed antidepressants, it is worth keeping an eye on their behaviour.
If you have read this far, the last thing I would worry about with a mentally ill person is to try to understand them. Be empathetic, non judgemental, and supportively listen but what they may be going through may make no sense at all and most folks don’t have the training to understand. With my PTSD, most of my thought patterns are irrational and I know that. I tried to make people understand...it was pointless. I think the only people that understand are my counsellor and psychiatrist.
Long post but hopefully it sheds some light on suicide for the OP and others. Ask questions if you want.
As someone who never had any of these problems and have trouble relating but what an awesome post, I have a family member with PTSD after coming back from Afghanistan and I would like to thank your courageous post that might help me understand his problems and help in his recovery.
#udaman
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Could suicide risk be ID'd through a blood test? New Ottawa research chair offers hope
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The emails started arriving soon after a press release went out heralding the stunning research findings, led by young molecular biologist Zachary Kaminsky.
“A blood test for suicide?” was the headline on the release issued by Johns Hopkins University’s school of medicine in 2014. It explained that Kaminsky and other researchers at the Baltimore institution had discovered a chemical alteration in a gene called SKA2 linked to stress reduction. That finding could help doctors predict and prevent suicide through a blood test.
The experience is not one that could be easily forgotten. It has helped drive Kaminsky, now 40, to work toward a game-changing goal of not only predicting suicide risk with a simple blood or saliva test, but preventing it by using some of the biomarkers identified in his lab.
It is a goal he brings to Ottawa, as the newly appointed Suicide Prevention Research Chair at The Royal.
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Richardson, who was part of the Royal selection committee that hired Kaminsky, said she was looking for “hope” in the research that will result.
Kaminsky’s work brings promise for the kind of hope that has long eluded the world of suicide prevention.
He believes that, within a matter of years, a clinical test will exist that could save lives by predicting suicide risk.
“We have a chance with biomarkers to do good in the very near future, I think. That’s my life’s goal — to see some of the biomarkers identified in my lab being used to save people.”
At the heart of his research is epigenetics, the study of chemical modifications to DNA that act like a light switch. Genes can get turned on and off by epigenetic factors, which is what Kaminsky studies on a molecular level.
His research has helped identify biomarkers that indicate a high risk for postpartum depression and another that points to a high risk of suicide. The gene that is associated with a higher risk of suicide works as a kind of “brake pad” for stress response. If the brake pad is thinner, because lower amounts of the gene are being made, it doesn’t work as well in responding to stress.
Quote:
Being able to diagnose a predisposition to suicide also raises ethical questions, given existing stigma around mental illness. As a start, he said, a test would have to be extremely accurate to limit false positives.
Once researchers can more accurately predict who is at the highest suicide risk, “we can start to think about looking at interventions.” He suggested the military might be an obvious place to put resulting diagnostics to work.
The biological approach to identifying and treating mental illness resonates with the public and helps reduce stigma, he said, a lesson he carries from the many emails he received.
“When we point out mental illness is linked to the DNA, it makes it poignantly real. This isn’t something in your head. Like heart disease, it is a real disease.”
When I was first prescribed antidepressants, I was worried about the suicidal risks associated with the drugs. I asked my counsellor how antidepressants cause suicide because I wanted to know what to look for with my behaviour and feelings. She explained that the drugs don’t cause suicide as a side effect. Essentially, a mentally ill person may be so depressed or sick that they can’t even motivate themselves to commit suicide. Once the drugs start working, it actually improves a person to a point at which they can now motivate themselves to commit suicide and actually act on the impulse. So, if someone you care for has been recently precribed antidepressants, it is worth keeping an eye on their behaviour.
Huh, interesting insight. My dad killed himself about six weeks after beginning antidepressant meds. It really left a 'WTF?!' impression on my family with regard to their effectiveness, and there were no answers in the time after he died as to what may have happened.
Why we choose Suicide
