Landlord Problems

[lazypucker]

Just an update - if anyone cares.

After multiple emails, calls, and texts to the tenant over the last 2 weeks, we finally got the full amount of the September rent in 3 payments. We shall see how the end of the month goes as the deadline for the tenant to move out is fast approaching. Hopefully it will go smoothly without incident...

[lazypucker]

Of course this type of trouble will not go away quietly.

Today we have got an email from the tenant basically accusing us (the landlord and the condo board) of unlawful eviction and they will "lawyer up" per se by filing a complaint through the Residential Tenancy Dispute Resolution Service of Alberta. Unless we can arrange a showdown meeting between all 3 parties (the tenant, the landlord, and the condo board / management company). I suspect it will be a sh*t show.

To the CPers in the know, can we actually ask for such a showdown talk? Any advice? We are now down to 2 weeks before the original deadline date of Sep 30. I know the tenant will not leave quietly now and probably want to beg more one more chance from the condo board. We are out of ideas now. Please help!

[Oling_Roachinen]

So Condo aside, a landlord can give a tenant a notice of eviction for substantial breach as long as the notice is at least 14 days prior to the eviction date. Assuming that was done properly, then the recourse the tenant has is to file a notice of objection prior to the eviction date. If they object, as it appears to have been done so in this case, then it falls back to the landlord to apply to the Provincial Court of Residential Tenancy Dispute Resolution Service to terminate the tenancy. So I would not rely on him filing a RTDRS application.

(4) A notice to terminate under this section is ineffective if, before
the termination date given in the notice, the tenant
(a) pays all rent due as of the date of payment, if the alleged
breach is a failure to pay rent, or
(b) serves the landlord with a notice in writing objecting to the
termination that sets out the tenant’s reasons for objecting, if
the alleged breach is other than a failure to pay rent.

There's a couple things to note, first that the notices of eviction were done properly, I'm not sure how strict they are with email with conditions. If the email received does constitute a notice of objection then the tenant is effectively done his part and the notice of eviction is invalid. The onus again falls on your father to go to the courts or file an application with the RTDRS if he still intends to evict him on September 30, 2019. And at that point I would make sure all the ducks are in a row including written notices of eviction, written notices of bylaws being broken, written complaints etc.

Required notices must be delivered in person or by registered mail. Tenants should use the mailing address provided in the “notice of landlord.” Landlords should use the mailing address of the residential rental premises.

If the tenant is absent from the rental premises and/or evading service, the landlord may:

give the notice to an adult who appears to live with the tenant, or
post the notice in plain sight on the residential rental premises
If a landlord or tenant cannot serve a notice to vacate as indicated above, the notice may be sent through electronic means, as long as it results in a printed copy of the notice.

Now, the Condo corporation can also evict but they would follow the Condominium Property Act which requires:

Notice to give up possession
54(1) The corporation may give a tenant renting a unit a notice to
give up possession of that unit if any person in possession of the
unit
(a) causes damage, other than normal wear and tear, to the
real or personal property of the corporation or to the
common property, or
(b) contravenes a bylaw.
(2) When the corporation gives a tenant a notice under subsection
(1),
(a) the tenant shall give up possession of the unit, and
(b) notwithstanding the Residential Tenancies Act or anything
contained in the tenancy agreement between the tenant
and the tenant’s landlord, the tenancy agreement
terminates,
on the last day of the month immediately following the month in
which the notice is served on the tenant.
(3) A notice given under subsection (1) shall be served on the
tenant and the tenant’s landlord.

So following that the tenant has broken bylaws, assuming that the corporation hasn't given a notice to terminate tenancy yet, the earliest they could evict the tenant now is October 31, 2019 through this method.

[lazypucker]

A written eviction notice was emailed on Aug 31 by the condo board to my father and promptly forwarded to the tenant stating the reason for eviction (repeat multiple bylaw infractions). So I know right now the tenant is trying one last chance to beg for forgiveness from the condo board so that they can stay.

My father is probably the easiest person to deal with as long as he doesn't need to get his hands dirty. If the tenant can work out something with the condo board my father is willing to rent to him until the lease runs out next year. So dealing with RTDRS and any legal entity will definitely be the last resort.

[OMG!WTF!]

Have you spoken with the condo board yet? Are they willing to give him another chance?



I still think the reality is you pay now or you pay later. Meet with him. Offer an incentive to leave.

[topfiverecords]

You could start sneaking plastic bags into his shower.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Well then I echo other sentiment in the thread that your father should have had limited involvement.

If it's the Condo board/corporation evicting him, then they should follow the Condominium Property Act which really should have meant they served the notice to both the landlord and the tenant. Assuming the landlord forwarding the email (on August 31, 2019) is an appropriate form of written notice, then he has until September 30, 2019 to leave. If he doesn't the corporation needs to go to Court and get an order for him to vacate.

There's nothing stopping the tenant for asking for a second (or tenth) chance, and there's nothing stopping your father asking for a meeting between the other two parties, but if I was your father I would be very clear that he is not evicting him and his hands are tied. Both to hopefully prevent this tenant from doing anything stupid to the property and to stop any confusion between the Residential Tenancies Act (i.e. your father making the decision to evict) and the Condominium Property Act (i.e. the condo making the decision to evict) because they operate under different regimes, including the RTDRS jurisdiction:

https://www.alberta.ca/assets/docume...mmodations.pdf

See Sections 53 to 57 of the Condominium Property Act. If the condominium corporation or landlord attempts to evict under these sections of the CPA the RTDRS does not have jurisdiction as these sections specifically state that the application must be made to Court of Queen’s Bench and Section 57 states that where there is a conflict the CPA prevails over the RTA. However, if a landlord (NOT the condominium corporation) brings an application under the RTA the RTDRS has jurisdiction under Part 5.1 of the RTA.

[ken0042]

In addition to your father making it clear that his hands are tied- maybe offer an incentive. It could even be simple like offering to provide the security deposit returned immediately upon his out inspection. Or sweeten it with a couple of hundred dollars. Gets him out quicker and allows for another tenant to get in quicker. Also less chance of significant damage/ repairs.

[Torture]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Yeah, I offered etransfers and they said no. I wasn't aware there would be a time lag for the cheque to clear because it isn't local.

Ugh, so I guess I have to open up a new local account just for this. So annoying.

Man, #### that. If you pay rent on time you've met your side of the bargain. It's not your problem that it takes time to clear, Landlords don't get to dictate how rent will be paid unless it's already outlined in the lease.

[lazypucker]

Alright, another update if anyone is still interested...

So the tenant requested a showdown meeting, the condo board said no. We have hand delivered a landlord eviction notice to the unit front door this morning. According to RTDRS while condo board has to give 30 days notice, the landlord only has to give 14 days notice. The final eviction deadline date is now set at Oct 2.

Another thing I have learned is that if the condo board decides to file a court order to force the tenant out, they have to go through the Court of Queen's Bench, which will result in upwards of $1,000 in legal fees. If the landlord is filing, we can go through RTDRS and it is only a $75 application fee. And the wait of getting a hearing is about 2 months.

Many of you guys mention about sweetening the deal and provide incentives for the tenants to leave. The problem is that they do not want to leave. I don't think anything short of paying a couple months rent for their new place will do it.

Anyways, let's see what happens now. Hopefully this thing can end peacefully and without any further incidents...

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by lazypucker

Alright, another update if anyone is still interested...

So the tenant requested a showdown meeting, the condo board said no. We have hand delivered a landlord eviction notice to the unit front door this morning. According to RTDRS while condo board has to give 30 days notice, the landlord only has to give 14 days notice. The final eviction deadline date is now set at Oct 2.

Another thing I have learned is that if the condo board decides to file a court order to force the tenant out, they have to go through the Court of Queen's Bench, which will result in upwards of $1,000 in legal fees. If the landlord is filing, we can go through RTDRS and it is only a $75 application fee. And the wait of getting a hearing is about 2 months.

Many of you guys mention about sweetening the deal and provide incentives for the tenants to leave. The problem is that they do not want to leave. I don't think anything short of paying a couple months rent for their new place will do it.

Anyways, let's see what happens now. Hopefully this thing can end peacefully and without any further incidents...

Definitely don't offer a few months rent to get them out. I'm pretty sure that's not what the others are Truly suggesting. A few hundred bucks to chip in for the U-Haul, sure, but nothing more.

I think it's really showing that your hands are tied, but you're being reasonable. Either way, something is coming down the pipe. The tenant decides to either take the small bit of honey plus damage deposit if he leaves peacefully right away, or hint risk losing the damage deposit and deal with all the extra mess (ie: Take him to small claims) if he wants to cause more incidents.

[OMG!WTF!]

Yeah the tenant really needs to know that your costs can easily become his costs. And that your costs will be substantial. Most skid tenants don't get that.

[OMG!WTF!]

Any conclusion with this yet? Hope it's worked out well.

[lazypucker]

OMG!WTF! thank you for the bump. I was going to post an update today.

The deadline of Oct 2 has come and gone. We tried to play nice one more time by emailing the tenant to arrange a unit inspection on Oct 2 hoping he will finally leave peacefully, but the dude didn't give 2 sh*ts about moving out. So my father and I went to RTDRS and filed a case there. Filing cost is $75. Because it a government agency, the earliest court hearing date is Nov 20. At the mean time, the tenant can still stay there.

The instruction from the RTDRS is very clear, we have to physically serve the court papers to the tenant face-to-face. So we waited out by the condo, and luckily we tracked the dude down last night around dinner time and hand-delivered the court papers. We didn't say a word, he knew this was coming.

Anyways, now we just have to sit tight and wait for the hearing date on Nov 20 and wait for the judge's decision. Funny thing is that the dude paid the full rent on time on Oct 1 for the first time ever. RTDRS told us to deposit the e-transfer as no one can force him out until after the court decision is made. Of course the tenant can move out on his own anytime without going through court and we can withdraw the case, but I highly doubt that he is being scared by this filing....

We are now going to be hands-off and will not try to strike a side deal with the tenant, unless he initiate a call to us to settle it out of court.

I will keep you guys up-to-date on this.

[getbak]

Has the tenant's behaviour around the building improved at least?

[lazypucker]

Originally Posted by getbak

Has the tenant's behaviour around the building improved at least?

We didn't hear any complaints from the management company / condo board. I suppose the tenant knows it is already strike 2 and a half for him right now so he has to be on his best behaviors in public shared spaces.

But inside the unit? Who knows? Maybe it has already been torn apart! I surely hope not...

[rohara66]

Wonder if your tenant is my old tenant... she was a crazy broad!

I basically had to tip toe to get her out early, sold the rental property shortly after because being a part time landlord is literally the worst job on this planet.

Learnt a valuable lesson that people are generally ####ty and that being a landlord is a decent gig until its not, then its a black hole of time and money.

Good luck!

[lazypucker]

Originally Posted by rohara66

Wonder if your tenant is my old tenant... she was a crazy broad!

It was a guy who signed the lease, but we know he is sneaking his girlfriend in to live with him and her name is not on the lease.

A lot of the problems were loud partying, boyfriend-girlfriend fighting, parking their 2nd car at the visitor stall for weeks on end, causing disturbances, etc.

So the girl may very well be your old tenant!

[rohara66]

Originally Posted by lazypucker

It was a guy who signed the lease, but we know he is sneaking his girlfriend in to live with him and her name is not on the lease.

A lot of the problems were loud partying, boyfriend-girlfriend fighting, parking their 2nd car at the visitor stall for weeks on end, causing disturbances, etc.

So the girl may very well be your old tenant!

She had a boyfriend staying there (he was not on the lease), arguing with neighbors (who were on the condo board), parking in visitor parking, got animals/pets that were not allowed with our lease agreement or condo bylaws, played loud music, etc etc etc.



She threatened getting lawyers involved multiple time. I basically had to baby her to get out and not trash the place. Generally a massive pain in the ass. Never again!

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by lazypucker

But inside the unit? Who knows? Maybe it has already been torn apart! I surely hope not...

You can definitely go check on the unit any time you want with 24 hour notice. I probably would check it out so he knows you're watching. And if there is significant damage you should be able to get him evicted as soon as 24 hrs after you apply to the court. It may also encourage him to move if you start checking up on him.