DC Capitol Riot & Subsequent Fallout Thread (Jan 2021)

[N-E-B]

What are the chances the 25th amendment is actually invoked? I don’t know enough about it. Genuinely curious.

I hope to see some terrorism charges laid against these thugs.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

You're right. If this was a BLM event, or heck, any leftist group, more people would have been killed.

Just some random thoughts...

I think it is kind of sad that the person who was killed, probably wasn't even close to being the most threatening person there. She made an extremely poor decision combined with an inappropriate sense of entitlement, and paid the price for it. I am going on gut assumptions and could be wrong, but based on her profile, she seemed like someone who fell for the con but wasn't necessarily dangerous on her own.

If Auschwitz Man or some other obvious nazi was the one shot doing the exact same thing as her, I don't think anyone would be having this conversation.

The other thing that gets me about this is that on one side of the doors, there were cops with their guns drawn ready to shoot, and on the other side were rioters with cops all around them. I am inclined to think that the cops on each side had a different perspective on the threat. The storming of the Capitol wasn't a collaborative effort IMO, but had different factions with different intentions. The cops with their guns drawn had no way of knowing if the woman coming through was a neo-nazi, or just a brainwashed Captain America wannabe.

Having been in a lot of big demonstrations some of which turned into borderline riots when I was a teenager I feel slightly sorry for these morons, people lose all common sense in a mob that gets out of hand, these numpties are looking at decades in jail for doing something they really hadnt put an instance of thought into, the muppets sitting at the speakers desk had no clue they were committing a crime as serious as rape or robbery at the time.

To be clear though they do need to go to jail for decades

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

What are the chances the 25th amendment is actually invoked? I don’t know enough about it. Genuinely curious.

I hope to see some terrorism charges laid against these thugs.

Zero.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

What are the chances the 25th amendment is actually invoked? I don’t know enough about it. Genuinely curious.

I hope to see some terrorism charges laid against these thugs.

slim to none. You'd need Pence and a majority of Trumps cabinet on board to even get the ball rolling, and that's not going to happen.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

You're right. If this was a BLM event, or heck, any leftist group, more people would have been killed.

Just some random thoughts...

I think it is kind of sad that the person who was killed, probably wasn't even close to being the most threatening person there. She made an extremely poor decision combined with an inappropriate sense of entitlement, and paid the price for it. I am going on gut assumptions and could be wrong, but based on her profile, she seemed like someone who fell for the con but wasn't necessarily dangerous on her own.

If Auschwitz Man or some other obvious nazi was the one shot doing the exact same thing as her, I don't think anyone would be having this conversation.

The other thing that gets me about this is that on one side of the doors, there were cops with their guns drawn ready to shoot, and on the other side were rioters with cops all around them. I am inclined to think that the cops on each side had a different perspective on the threat. The storming of the Capitol wasn't a collaborative effort IMO, but had different factions with different intentions. The cops with their guns drawn had no way of knowing if the woman coming through was a neo-nazi, or just some goofy brainwashed Captain America wannabe.

she's not some innocent mislead school girl.
she a 14 year military vet for starters, is a longtime trumper and a Qanon supporter, has a rap sheet which she was previously prosecuted for reckless endangerment, malicious destruction of property and has had two restraining orders against her.

just because she was female and to you didn't look like a threat doesn't make her less of one. your thinking is one that gets innocent people killed.
everyone in that situation is a threat until the situation is over.

[Nsd1]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

If Auschwitz Man or some other obvious nazi was the one shot doing the exact same thing as her, I don't think anyone would be having this conversation.

Camp Auschwitz guy was there when she got shot. I watched a video of the shooting from a different angle than the one posted earlier. I think it’s clear she knew who she was with and what they were doing. The officer who shot her was clearly visible and had his gun drawn, should have known what was going to happen. A couple of her fellow patriots tried to help her while everyone else continued to take videos and pictures. She survived four tours of duty in the military for her country only to be killed in her country’s Capitol building for Donny. What a waste.

[Flames_Gimp]

Originally Posted by New Era

If those were black and brown people doing that, it would take weeks to clean up the blood. The cops would have run out of ammo. Capitol Police are notorious hard asses, so the fact there was a single shooting is not only miraculous, it is straight up inconsistent with the behavior and training of this agency.

It's funny how many times you guys say this, why would there be more killing? white people are the number 1 race shot by police. I don't remember there being a shooting gallery during the blm rioting.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by New Era

Oh goodie, we get to play number games. If you take the number of arrested in BLM protests and compare it to the number arrested here and compare that to the total number of protest days how do the stats work out? Or, if you take the number of protested snatched off the street by unmarked LEOs in BLM protests and compare it to the number snatched here and compare that to the total number of protest days how do the stats work out?



And why do you think the breach was allowed? If these were black or brown protesters do you think the breach would have happened? Or do you think the Capitol Police would have used lethal force to maintain the skirmish line? I'll give you a clue, since you don't appear to have one, they would have used excessive force because that is their MO and their reputation. That is part of what is so incredulous about this situation. The Capitol Police are hard asses and routinely use excessive force to achieve compliance. Christ, even the members of Congress joke about this stuff. So why, during a moment like this where the Capitol is being over-run do the Capitol cops not do what they always do?

Id really like to see the numbers for all of those things when this is said and done. The statement that more Black people would have been shot should be easily provable. I just haven’t seen anyone do the work yet.

As to why the breach was allowed that needs to be determined.

One is underestimating the size of the crowd that was going to show up - unlikely
One is underestimating the risk they posed likely due to race - probably part of it
One is intentionally understaffing because Trump and allies wanted this outcome
One is incompetence

I agree that they would have been properly staffed if it hasn’t been MAGA protesters.

Maybe a combination of all of the above. Is it too much of a conspiracy theory to believe the third item?

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

It's funny how many times you guys say this, why would there be more killing? white people are the number 1 race shot by police. I don't remember there being a shooting gallery during the blm rioting.

You're right. If a bunch of armed muslims had stormed the capital to try and overthrow the democratically elected president of the United States of America by taking over the capitol building with the intent to murder Congressmen and Senators, and take hostages, it is super hard for me to imagine that the police and military would've responded with deadly force.


I'm rolling my eyes so ####ing hard I think I just detached my retinas. JFC what a stupid post.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

It's funny how many times you guys say this, why would there be more killing? white people are the number 1 race shot by police. I don't remember there being a shooting gallery during the blm rioting.

only because there are so many more of them. nice white argument you have there.

try this instead, for just one example.

Rate of fatal police shootings in the United States from 2015 to December 2020, by ethnicity.

white people 14 per 1 million. black people 34 per million.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...-ethnicity-us/

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Nsd1

Camp Auschwitz guy was there when she got shot. I watched a video of the shooting from a different angle than the one posted earlier. I think it’s clear she knew who she was with and what they were doing. The officer who shot her was clearly visible and had his gun drawn, should have known what was going to happen. A couple of her fellow patriots tried to help her while everyone else continued to take videos and pictures. She survived four tours of duty in the military for her country only to be killed in her country’s Capitol building for Donny. What a waste.

No, just no. These people were not patriots. They were domestic terrorists, plain and simple. The leader of the Proud Boys said they had successfully "terrorized" those in the Capitol. That is admission of a terrorist activity and all who participated are terrorists.

[Hockeyguy15]

Oh sure if you want to stand there roll out correct stats.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by New Era

No, just no. These people were not patriots. They were domestic terrorists, plain and simple. The leader of the Proud Boys said they had successfully "terrorized" those in the Capitol. That is admission of a terrorist activity and all who participated are terrorists.

Too add to this- she was a veteran (and deserve the associated respect for that) who was brainwashed. Even brainwashed people are still terrorist. Being brainwashed doesn't excuse the actions or remove the label.

I don't think she would of seen herself that way, but she is still a terrorist in my view.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Mull

Too add to this- she was a veteran (and deserve the associated respect for that) who was brainwashed.

No she doesn't deserve any respect just because she was a veteran. Does Russell Williams deserve respect because he served with distinction in the Canadian Forces for 23 years?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Mull

Too add to this- she was a veteran (and deserve the associated respect for that) who was brainwashed. Even brainwashed people are still terrorist. Being brainwashed doesn't excuse the actions or remove the label.

I don't think she would of seen herself that way, but she is still a terrorist in my view.

Great point. We look at American "enemy combatants" who side with terrorists. They have been brainwashed into a specific ideology (we all are to be honest) and they take up arms against their own country. While the term enemy combatant is a legal term to identify these people, so their rights are not infringed upon, the reality is they are every bit the terrorist that their Middle Eastern hosts are. Same should be applied to domestic terrorists. They employ terror tactics and should be classified as such. Even though they believe they are on the righteous side of the ledger, the laws and standards of our nation say otherwise.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

No she doesn't deserve any respect just because she was a veteran. Does Russell Williams deserve respect because he served with distinction in the Canadian Forces for 23 years?

I am truly not sure how I feel. He did horrible things, but also served this country.

I don't respect him, or what he did, but I get pretty blinded by the whole "veterans deserve respect for the time they served".

Good point though.

[Roughneck]

When we remember Timothy McVeigh, let’s be sure to respect his service as well.

Lee Harvey Oswald and Charles Whitman as well. Gotta show the respect.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by Mull

I get pretty blinded by the whole "veterans deserve respect for the time they served".

Maybe you should drop this attitude. Veneration of the military is one of the hallmarks of fascism. Just like in any other profession, there are both good and awful people who serve in the Armed Forces. None of them automatically deserve respect solely because of the uniform they wear (or once wore) and nothing else.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

she's not some innocent mislead school girl.
she a 14 year military vet for starters, is a longtime trumper and a Qanon supporter, has a rap sheet which she was previously prosecuted for reckless endangerment, malicious destruction of property and has had two restraining orders against her.

just because she was female and to you didn't look like a threat doesn't make her less of one. your thinking is one that gets innocent people killed.
everyone in that situation is a threat until the situation is over.

I didn't know all that stuff, which is why I said I could be wrong, nor did I say she was innocent. I think shooting her was justified.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Mull

I am truly not sure how I feel. He did horrible things, but also served this country.

I don't respect him, or what he did, but I get pretty blinded by the whole "veterans deserve respect for the time they served".

Good point though.

They don't deserve respect just because they got hoodwinked by a recruiter at the mall, though. You earn respect. Just signing up isn't enough...it needs to be backed up through conduct.

This "thank a soldier for their service" thing only came about in the last 10-15 years. It's a perfect marketing tool because young guys see the default respect army dudes are now getting and it encourages them to sign up. Maybe that's a good thing for defense/the military, but it always makes me uncomfortable because I feel like we're sort of coaxing young people into a career they may not choose if not for the manipulation.

Also, there are people that serve with tremendous courage, valour and selflessness, but they are placed on the same pedestal as the mail clerk that gave people their care packages at a base in San Diego. Thanking every soldier is a hollow gesture and reminiscent of a participation award.